Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - 1.8.5 the main thread

[db3]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

[exmatproton]

I'm on a fairly decent i3-330m/8GB which yet handles most of my stuff rather good (even Diva and the likes), but Avenger seems to be extremly laggy and CPU-consuming even when not playing any sound.

Also preset loading takes around a couple of seconds, you can actually see all parameters building up in realtime (so to speak)

Is this a GPU-related thing as described? ATM not really usable for me I have to admit, hope that this will get fixed.

Don't want to talk your set-up down, but really, an i3-330m is really low end. Diva is quite old and runs pretty good these days.
Now, i am not saying Avenger is the best optimized synth, because it isn't. But it is a new, 2016 synth.

I can run over 200 voices, spread over multiple instances (7 in this case) with oversampled filters @ 256 samples buffer size on a core i7 4790K (@4.8GHz) and my CPU hit is around 80 percent. It is an heavy synth!

*some numbers (if interested)

http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4 ... re-i3-330M

Maybe they are able to optimize it some more, for some older systems. I guess the 60FPS refresh rate of the synth, can be quite heavy on older systems. They said they will release a new version with an eco mode (30FPS)

[V0RT3X]

Posting your DAW is important, because it might not actually support Multi-core processing.

Ableton for instance dedicated a single core per track from what I've read.


Bitwig on the other hand doesn't have multi-core processing afaik. It would be nice if someone could confirm this though..

[<Outer-Bounds>]

Bit of a long one!

Just some things I noticed in Avenger after demoing for a few hours. I don’t know if this is just because it’s the demo limitations or maybe I just haven’t properly figured it out yet, but I thought I’d mention these few things I’ve stumbled on so far and the rest are just things I’m trying to get my head around from a punters perspective.

There’s some funky sh__ happening in Reaper, Avenger & OSX in regard to display scaling, resizing and resolution.

I’m on OSX using Reaper 5.28. The screen display in “OSX System Preferences>Displays” has to be on it’s default resolution. If it isn’t on it’s default size (in my case 2560 x 1440) Avenger doesn’t fit in the window, always missing the whole top section of Avenger (head cut off), but that's not the main issue as I can deal with that in reaper.
The real issue is that you can’t control anything with the mouse cursor, as your always inches away from the actual control your trying to manipulate, for example, if I’m trying to control “VIB AMOUNT & FADE IN” I’m actually controlling “DETUNE” if you get my meaning. My Mac has to be on it’s default resolution for Avenger on my system that's for sure.(Had display scaled to1920 x 1080 before Avenger issues) I spent about 20 minutes scratching my head trying to figure out why I couldn’t press “NEXT” when setting up library content on first starting Avenger.


Also I realise you don’t want this to cross pollinate with Phalanx to much, but to me these first 2 points are essential!

1. No phase invert on the drums channels that I can see (hopefully I just haven’t figured it out properly).
Just a simple phase inversion button on the drum channels, right next to mute & solo would work. This
is a very basic need for drums, you have it on the synthesis sections, why not the drum sections?

2. A way to assign the drums to external separate output channels.

3. A simpler way to get audio files in to the oscillator section without having to convert them first. Again
you do it in the drum section why not here?

4. Some looping & crossfade options in the Editor.

5. A way to drag the Drum Sequencer as midi in to the DAW & vice versa for bonus points.

You have some things on the oscillator section and don’t implement the same thinking on the drums sections & vice versa. You have shown it can work. Why is it like that if I can ask?


Here’s a couple of odd behavior's I found.

1. Undo doesn’t work on modulators, as in to quickly undo a modulation assignment.

2. Implement a way to flick through the different types of filters, to add to the drop down list you’ve
already have, and also I can’t figure out how to flick through different drum samples either, without
changing the whole kit, I know & like that I can just drop files on the drums channels, but it would be
nice to carry on flicking through them instead of keep dropping them in, as to audition nice & quick.
Like you did on the oscillator page.

3. The send FX doesn’t let me swap them around in a different order, where as the Master FX does.

It seems like this could kick some arse, so why hold it back with these limitations when you can see in the very same software you implemented things in some sections but not in others. I don’’t design software, so maybe it’s not so straight forward as I’m thinking, but what convinces me is that it is obviously very possible as you have already proved it in your own design.

I like Avenger! It has lot’s of potential and I want to purchase if after the few issues I’m observing are sorted! There’s no point in hobbling it just so it doesn’t effect other products in your line. (Phalanx) But it is your living and it is a typical business practice I guess with some companies, but after 3 years of developing this I’m sure more than most, you wanna to see this puppy fly!!

[vanhaze]

Totally Amen.

Also a mac user, experiencing the very same Avenger annoyances in Avenger - Reaper.

[exmatproton]

Bit of a long one!

Just some things I noticed in Avenger after demoing for a few hours. I don’t know if this is just because it’s the demo limitations or maybe I just haven’t properly figured it out yet, but I thought I’d mention these few things I’ve stumbled on so far and the rest are just things I’m trying to get my head around from a punters perspective.

There’s some funky sh__ happening in Reaper, Avenger & OSX in regard to display scaling, resizing and resolution.

I’m on OSX using Reaper 5.28. The screen display in “OSX System Preferences>Displays” has to be on it’s default resolution. If it isn’t on it’s default size (in my case 2560 x 1440) Avenger doesn’t fit in the window, always missing the whole top section of Avenger (head cut off), but that's not the main issue as I can deal with that in reaper.
The real issue is that you can’t control anything with the mouse cursor, as your always inches away from the actual control your trying to manipulate, for example, if I’m trying to control “VIB AMOUNT & FADE IN” I’m actually controlling “DETUNE” if you get my meaning. My Mac has to be on it’s default resolution for Avenger on my system that's for sure.(Had display scaled to1920 x 1080 before Avenger issues) I spent about 20 minutes scratching my head trying to figure out why I couldn’t press “NEXT” when setting up library content on first starting Avenger.


Also I realise you don’t want this to cross pollinate with Phalanx to much, but to me these first 2 points are essential!

1. No phase invert on the drums channels that I can see (hopefully I just haven’t figured it out properly).
Just a simple phase inversion button on the drum channels, right next to mute & solo would work. This
is a very basic need for drums, you have it on the synthesis sections, why not the drum sections?

2. A way to assign the drums to external separate output channels.

3. A simpler way to get audio files in to the oscillator section without having to convert them first. Again
you do it in the drum section why not here?

4. Some looping & crossfade options in the Editor.

5. A way to drag the Drum Sequencer as midi in to the DAW & vice versa for bonus points.

You have some things on the oscillator section and don’t implement the same thinking on the drums sections & vice versa. You have shown it can work. Why is it like that if I can ask?

1. It is possible to send drums out the synth using seperate outputs. I know, this isn't a complete solution, but you can invert the phase in your DAW this way. Not ideal, i know.

perc out.jpg

2. see 1

3. Vengeance was working on this, if i remember correctly.

4. I hope this as well

5. see 4

[msvs]

3. The send FX doesn’t let me swap them around in a different order, where as the Master FX does.

would not have any effect, these are paralell

2. A way to assign the drums to external separate output channels.

already possible:

Vengeance Producer Suite - Avenger - Tutorial Video #16: ROUTING / Sub Outs

3. A simpler way to get audio files in to the oscillator section without having to convert them first. Again
you do it in the drum section why not here?

like I mentioned earlier, Phalanx is our tool for Oneshot samples. We are currently checking if we add this feature, however

4. Some looping & crossfade options in the Editor.

for oneshots no problem, for multis this is a bit more complex.

1. No phase invert on the drums channels

you are right, will be added

[db3]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

30min now with GUI open 100% and no fan noise. Perhaps 1.0.22 is ECO mode.
Anyone confirm the same?

[Numanoid]

It's not about whining because there are some bugs. Some can't even open the plugin without problems. Others have to quit using it due to these circumstances. There are many things that won't work well and should have been fixed before releasing and selling a product...

Kind of amazing that Computer Music can give it 10/10 rating if such problems exist in the release version

I mean how thoroughly did the review it, and do they check that a product works out of the box on more than one format (I hope they do).

[lavizh]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

30min now with GUI open 100% and no fan noise. Perhaps 1.0.22 is ECO mode.
Anyone confirm the same?

I was under the impression that ECO mode could be switched on and off in Sys Tab when it was made available?

[vanhaze]

I would say totally corrupt.

[db3]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

30min now with GUI open 100% and no fan noise. Perhaps 1.0.22 is ECO mode.
Anyone confirm the same?

I was under the impression that ECO mode could be switched on and off in Sys Tab when it was made available?

That's what I was expecting...but right now everything is good for me.

[elassi]

Kind of amazing that Computer Music can give it 10/10 rating if such problems exist in the release version

Since VW tought us how to fool the official institutions I'm not wondering about anything anymore.

[vanhaze]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

30min now with GUI open 100% and no fan noise. Perhaps 1.0.22 is ECO mode.
Anyone confirm the same?

I was under the impression that ECO mode could be switched on and off in Sys Tab when it was made available?

On mac, v1.022 doesn't have ECO mode in sys tab.
Guess we OSX users have to wait for newer version.

[vanhaze]

I don't want to tempt fate...but my mac fan has been quiet with 1.0.22.

30min now with GUI open 100% and no fan noise. Perhaps 1.0.22 is ECO mode.
Anyone confirm the same?

No, can't confirm here:

- only my DAW open (no other programs running)
- Only 1 instance of Avenger in Reaper Project (also tested in Live 9 latest version), no other tracks in Project.

Outcome: fan noise fairly noticeable on my macbook retina, although it seems lower than the fan noise created when Avenger is at 100% scaled GUI.

OSX 10.12.1
Macbook Retina 2016, Core I7, 16 gigs RAM, 512 gb SSD.