What's up with Cubase and automation?

[keel]

After using FL's automation system for years, Cubase's automation system feels like totally retarded. And that is the main reason why I don't change from FL to Cubase. I cannot believe that it is soon 2017 and Steinberg doesn't do anything to improve their shit automation. And where is mousewheel zoom? Without shortcut keys, similar to FL. Add these to Cubase and you have new customer. Jesus.

[jancivil]

I'm not sure you know what I'm talking about.

Oh, sorry if so. I thought you meant this feature: https://i.gyazo.com/00fba238ad8cdbad482 ... 455142.png

And I'm still thinking you mean it! I meant that the only thing you can "automate" is the "wet/dry", due to pre-xfade and post-xfade. But I've never seen that screen on the right with "final oomph". I can however access to processing history by right clicking and accessing the menu on an audio file, which I think that is. It seems useful now to think of it, I just havent ever wrapped my head around it.

If you have made a 'Part' out of some audio and you double-click in that window, the Sample Editor opens up and there are the Regions icons. Make a Region out of the range selection.
But back to the point, which is that if you have specific 'gain' interests once you're dealing with audio, the Offline Process History specifically 'objectifies' the selection in order to return to the scene of the crime and alter it as so:



Yeah, that's a range selected in your pic. AFAICT 'dry/wet' belongs to the plugin's interface in that case. I mean that eg., "Gain" in Audio->Process reveals a pre-/post-crossfade interface under "More" but there is no 'wet/dry'.

[jancivil]

So I tried offline processing a bit, it actually was hugely useful for what I wanted to do. i got two parts in the vocals where I had to cut off ~4db just below 200hz to make it more consistent. It's actually very nice versus using EQ on all of it (mb-compressor wouldn't have also done much better there, in fact way too rarely find it useful at all) without automation. So this is nice I suppose. Gotta get used to doing that, especially with the regions (I found them!). Though this is still limited to some extent, as I use kind of weird signal chains with parallel processing + I love sending stuff on sends to keep reverb, delays etc separate and doing stuff with them sometimes possibly too.

Yeah, the DAW for that workflow seems to be Samplitude with Object Editing.

I don't do anything very fancy in the Audio Part/Sample Editor.
All my reverb is 'sends' (except BFD's own ambient mic mixing interface, but if very wet at all I'll still send it to _), I have very rarely put reverb on a range of an audio file. Once maybe twice. The fanciest I got was "un-mastering" a selection which ended up with more MB Comp than the rest of the track through some stupidity.

[jancivil]

Even as I'm kind of trolling the Bezier thing, I know what it is/does, and I get why one would enjoy it, it's just that this as a deal-killer seems... well, it has developed a life of its own at that point.
Don't mind me, I'm waiting for a dongle in the snail mail out here in the 7th Circle of Hell, so only so much to do a.t.m. (w. but a demo of Cubase 8 Elements to keep me out of trouble).

[ghettosynth]

While much of my automation consists of directional changes specifically at a point, critical things like opening a filter can sound rather choppy if the curve is not smooth. I would rather have a true curve for those types of things (at least 30-40% of my automation would benefit from a true curve).

Yes, and as mentioned, it's just a lot less work to grab a point and have a somewhat smooth change than it is to create a bunch of points. It can be heard on a number of different kinds of sounds. It's one of the reasons that I really like theRiser, which I don't really use very much for riser sounds as I do for long changing tones that morph smoothly.

[JonSolo]

Even as I'm kind of trolling the Bezier thing, I know what it is/does, and I get why one would enjoy it, it's just that this as a deal-killer seems... well, it has developed a life of its own at that point.
Don't mind me, I'm waiting for a dongle in the snail mail out here in the 7th Circle of Hell, so only so much to do a.t.m. (w. but a demo of Cubase 8 Elements to keep me out of trouble).

For sure I would not call it a deal breaker. I have used Cubase almost since it came out. And I use a few other DAWs as well. It feels a bit absurd that we are having this conversation for sure, but for the reason that this thing, the "b" word, should be built into everything. I am serious. It should be in VSTs and DAWs. Anywhere that you can draw it should exist. Anything that can be automated it should exist.

The fact that it does not in Cubase is what makes this a discussion. But not a deal breaker.

[jancivil]

] to create a bunch of points.

Guy to his doctor: it hurts when I create all these points.
Doctor: So stop doing that.

[incubus]

Bezier curves. Why? It has almost everything else.

Here is one of my biggest gripes about this aspect. Folks have been requesting this for....wait for it....years.

Yes. Years.

What I am finding hard to grasp is that it has not been done, despite all of the fantastic things they HAVE done, why not add in this tiny detail?

The only other thing I thought Cubase was lacking was Mixer Undo. We have that. Could they not have ALSO included the bezier curves?

I think that is the reason for this discussion. It has been a simple request over MANY years.

Oh, I get it now. At first I read that as something else.

Yeah, I mean, maybe there is some quantum flux capacitance issue why they can't be implemented but considering how many people want them (in any host) it no longer matters. Either do it, or explain why you can't.

The endless bitching from oh, about 10 people, on these forums about why we shouldn't want them is boring and pointless.

[ghettosynth]

] to create a bunch of points.

Guy to his doctor: it hurts when I create all these points.
Doctor: So stop doing that.

Yeah, I don't try to. But sometimes something of a curve does matter. Really, one of the reasons that I'm back on cubase is because of the curve editing for sample fade in and fade out. I use those features creatively, not really as fade ins or fade outs so much.

[aMUSEd]

According to this automation is only available in the full version?

https://www.steinberg.net/en/products/c ... rison.html

[jancivil]

ya know, there's a number of things in Cubase that one could be pretty bothered by but I choose not to be. In C5 (which I'll still prefer to say 8, based in this month's experience. I_hate_the_mixer.) the parabola tool in CC lanes will not get you to '0' no matter what, for instance. They didn't care enough to fix that bug.

I don't know what curves really would do for me in its automation lane/Project Window, but I'm good if the thing is strictly from me and my retarded use profile.

[Functional]

Yeah, that's a range selected in your pic. AFAICT 'dry/wet' belongs to the plugin's interface in that case. I mean that eg., "Gain" in Audio->Process reveals a pre-/post-crossfade interface under "More" but there is no 'wet/dry'.

Yup so I just realized that indeed it was a mistake by me. So I can't control the speed of x-fade, instead I can control when the x-fade begins (I'm not sure how I got so confused, but it happens). But yeah, we were talking about the same feature.

Yeah, the DAW for that workflow seems to be Samplitude with Object Editing.

Interesting, gotta perhaps check that out some day. But I really want to avoid getting drawn into other DAW's because eventually I want to adopt Symbolic Sounds Kyma X, which is a literal black hole in itself. Though it'll probably have limited use for music due to its cumbersome workflow. Maybe the so-called spectralists would enjoy it, dunno.

I don't do anything very fancy in the Audio Part/Sample Editor.
All my reverb is 'sends' (except BFD's own ambient mic mixing interface, but if very wet at all I'll still send it to _), I have very rarely put reverb on a range of an audio file. Once maybe twice. The fanciest I got was "un-mastering" a selection which ended up with more MB Comp than the rest of the track through some stupidity.

Well, yesterday I managed to do a lot with it, was actually pretty fun. I had this nice clockwork foley sound and at one point I decided to have it go through interruptors bionic delay (lovely freeware delay) with ping-pong. I took the last ping, panned it into middle, then let it go through huge reverb after which I got a nice flange on it (first time I've ever found flanger useful, gotta use the effect more). Then I time-stretched it with tape algo 2x longer. Sounded nice. After that I started duplicating it and made pitch changes to the duplicates for a little bit of melodic effect.

But obviously this isn't what you meant exactly, as the processing history isn't useful here. But it's useful for example those vocal cuts I made, if I'd have done them earlier. Never thought of that, you see. Just gotta learn to use this feature more, especially for plugins, not just pitch shifting or time stretching (though I love doing those two things very often; if only PaulStretch was a VST-plugin... )

Even as I'm kind of trolling the Bezier thing, I know what it is/does, and I get why one would enjoy it, it's just that this as a deal-killer seems... well, it has developed a life of its own at that point.
Don't mind me, I'm waiting for a dongle in the snail mail out here in the 7th Circle of Hell, so only so much to do a.t.m. (w. but a demo of Cubase 8 Elements to keep me out of trouble).

Haha, I don't mind at all. I get what you're saying and I was saying bit tongue-in-cheek that once a DAW does what Cubase does + the automation, I'm gonna switch. Based on what I know right now about other DAWs, that time is nowhere near to come. And hey, Cubase still keeps surprising me (I can't go through the whole goddamn manual, I'm only a man and it's 1400 pages long), so there's that.

Sad part is, I have so much to do and yet, here I am. But that's just related to my neurology, unfortunately.

Guy to his doctor: it hurts when I create all these points.
Doctor: So stop doing that.

So the guy replies to the doctor: but what is there to live for if not creating all these points efficiently?

According to this automation is only available in the full version?

https://www.steinberg.net/en/products/c ... rison.html

Not sure but I think so. I've never used any other version than the full version to be honest, got it way back with EDU discount.

I don't know what curves really would do for me in its automation lane/Project Window, but I'm good if the thing is strictly from me and my retarded use profile.

Well, if you're using C5, I guess you are safe either way!

[jancivil]

According to this automation is only available in the full version?

No, apparently not. C8 Elements has an automation lane, I'd bet it's normal.

[jancivil]

I looked at the comparison chart a little, maybe they've cut Elements down more for 9.
Says that 'realtime time stretching only for playback', which I have no idea what that means.
But I've done little but time stretching in Elements, C8. It's labeled differently, the custom algo is called 'Custom' now, it's more or less the same workflow.

[jancivil]

I don't know what curves really would do for me in its automation lane/Project Window, but I'm good if the thing is strictly from me and my retarded use profile.

Well, if you're using C5, I guess you are safe either way!

I don't know what that means. There's a parabola tool but

I can make three dots work though.