KVR Audio

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:56 am

Hi.

When I zoom in waveform (audio clip) to a certain zoom level in the arrangement view (and sample view too) the interface gets really unresponsive. I drag to zoom or to move some audio or something, and it sometimes takes up to ~2s for anything to happen.

Here are my specs:

Windows 10 (Single language) 64 bit
Ableton Live Lite 9.7 (tried it even on 8 version)
i5-6600K
ASUS Z170a
8 GB RAM DDR4
GTX 950
SSD 960GB
Monitor 24' 1920x1080 (i don't know why, but i think it's important information

)

I don't have any CPU spikes. DPC Latency is perfect. There is no audio lag, the latency and audio performance is absolutely fine, it's just the GUI lagging.

I know that it's only Windows issue (tried it with the same hardware on a Mac and everything works fine, no issue). The only way to zoom smoothly is checking RAM button on every audio clip.

Can someone reproduce this problem?

risome · Post by **risome** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 8:23 am

Ive seen a mate have this issue on Windows .I think it maybe a minor bug.Send a report to Ableton .They will fix this with there updates I'm sure.Dont have the issue as on a mac

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 10:40 am

risome wrote:Ive seen a mate have this issue on Windows .I think it maybe a minor bug.Send a report to Ableton .They will fix this with there updates I'm sure.Dont have the issue as on a mac

I don't think that it's a minor bug, cause i've found some posts on other forums about that issue. I've read that some people got this issue on older versions, like Live 5 or 6. So it was enough time to fix it, but it still not working propely.

I can't write to Ableton AG cause i've got Lite version, they don't have a support for it.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:14 pm

Strange, I have very similar setup, just a lot older but with same GPU (ASUS Strix), and haven't experienced this ever. Zooming is buttersmooth. I got 16G memory, 1920*1280 screen.

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:18 pm

.jon wrote:Strange, I have very similar setup, just a lot older but with same GPU (ASUS Strix), and haven't experienced this ever. Zooming is buttersmooth. I got 16G memory, 1920*1280 screen.

Yeah, that's what i'm talking about. I think if everyone would have this problem, it would be fixed already.

Maybe it's all about new CPUs and how they work with reading files from SSD and RAM on Windows systems. When audio clip on RAM everything run very smooth, like it should be. That's why i think it's all about reading information from disk.

I've test it already on a few different hard drives results are the same. And i simply can reproduce it on my old laptop:

OS: Windows 8.1
CPU: Intel Core i3 - 3217U
MB: Asus P500CA
RAM: 4GB DDR3 1600 Mhz
GPU: Intel(R) HD Graphics 4000
SSD: Kingston SV300S37A120G

Can you tell me what audio interface are you using? And can you make a small test for me, please:

1) Close web browser and any other DAW apps running on a background.
2) Run Ableton with ASIO4ALL (i'm not using ASIO4ALL, so it's just for experiment)
3) Create 4-8 audio tracks with 8 bar audio clips (in Arrangement View)
4) Try to zoom in/out fully

Thanks.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:37 pm

Audio driver doesn't seem to have any effect, tried that test with both ASIO4ALL and my native driver, literally ancient M-Audio Fast Track Pro ASIO v 5.10.00.5134. No glitches in zooming.

You don't happen to have any CPU throttling / power saving enabled?

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:43 pm

.jon wrote:Audio driver doesn't seem to have any effect, tried that test with both ASIO4ALL and my native driver, literally ancient M-Audio Fast Track Pro ASIO v 5.10.00.5134. No glitches in zooming.

You don't happen to have any CPU throttling / power saving enabled?

Nope.

My energy settings running on a maximum performance in Windows. Also I turned off all CPU power saving setting in BIOS, like Speedstep, C States and so on. I've read a lot information on internet about optimizing PC for audio production.

I can reproduce that issue on two different PCs.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:02 pm

Yeah, just checking but I guessed your setup was tuned well. Sounds like a really annoying issue, and most likely not only in Lite as it's the same engine.

BertKoor · Post by **BertKoor** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:10 pm

Could it be disk related?
If you zoom in, some peak metadata isn;t sufficient and all samples must be loaded.
With SSD drives that's fast, spinning disks not so much...

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:37 pm

BertKoor wrote:Could it be disk related?
If you zoom in, some peak metadata isn;t sufficient and all samples must be loaded.
With SSD drives that's fast, spinning disks not so much...

I've test it on 2 different PCs, and 4 different disks:

- Smartbuy SSD
- OCZ Triton SSD
- Kingston SSD
- Toshiba HDD

And there is no difference. So i think it's OS related. I've got Hackintosh on the same PC and everything works fine with it.

JSL_music · Post by **JSL_music** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 3:24 pm

I have the same problem, very frustrating bug.

I have reported the issue to Ableton support.

Let's hope for a quick fix

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 8:44 pm

JSL_music wrote:I have the same problem, very frustrating bug.

I have reported the issue to Ableton support.

Let's hope for a quick fix

Hi.

Please, be in touch if you find any solution.

Thanks.

kresbeatz · Post by **kresbeatz** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:07 am

I experienced same issue. After several tries I found out, that Live is not like when your Zoom Display level is other that 100%. Check out your "Zoom Display" field under Preferences - Look & Feel, it should be 100%. Hope it will fix the problem for you.

BadFormat · Post by **BadFormat** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 5:38 am

kresbeatz wrote:I experienced same issue. After several tries I found out, that Live is not like when your Zoom Display level is other that 100%. Check out your "Zoom Display" field under Preferences - Look & Feel, it should be 100%. Hope it will fix the problem for you.

I've already check it. My zoom display option is 100% by default and Windows scale settings are 100% too.

So it's not solving issue for me. But anyway, thanks for your help.

JSL_music · Post by **JSL_music** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:42 pm

BadFormat wrote:
JSL_music wrote:I have the same problem, very frustrating bug.

I have reported the issue to Ableton support.

Let's hope for a quick fix
Hi.

Please, be in touch if you find any solution.

Thanks.

So Ableton got back to me. They are aware of the issue, but can't say anything about when it will be fixed... Let's hope that the reason why they are not prioritizing to fix such a huge flaw in basic functionality is because Live 10 is just around the corner.

All my scaling in windows is set to 100%, no luck.

Ableton visual lag zooming waveform