DUNE2 vs Sylenth1

[izonin]

@chk071 You misquoted. That is HcDoom's opinion, not mine.

[chk071]

I don't know what HcDoom and izonin consider the "Supersaw oscillator" of some Roland synths, but, regarding unison on oscillator level, and detune laws, i guess that both Dune 2 and Spire can do what the Roland oscillator does. Spire even has a density setting which is supposed to be a copy of the detune spread laws of the Roland JP-8k oscillator, according to the manual. Both Dune 2 and Spire can do 7 voice unison on oscillator level too, so you can copy that too. Of course, it will still sound different due to the overall engine, differences in the raw waveforms, and so on.

[chk071]

@chk071 You misquoted. That is HcDoom's opinion, not mine.

You're right. Fixed now.

[4damind]

IMHO the sound of Diva and Spire is superior to that of Dune2. Both the oscillators and filters have better quality in those synths. The advantage of Dune is the user wavetables and more advanced FM.

IMO the main advantage is the incredible unison support of Dune2. No synth has a similar feature/implementation and this is something you need for all kind of pads, evolving sounds or layered sounds.
The overall sound is a bit "Rolandish" IMO.

[basslinemaster]

Maybe it was just too different under the hood to make it compatible with version 1. But then again, they could have given it a completely different name. But then again, in that case v1 customers would not have received a generous upgrade

Yes, that follows... (sarcasm)

[EnGee]

Between Sylenth1, Dune 2, Spire and Hive, I choose Dune 2 (actually, I already chose it!). It can create a wide range of sounds due to its synthesis. But I'm not into Trance or other modern dance, so Dune is enough for my needs (It is not my main synth however!).

If I am into Trance and House, I would buy the four of them! They are all have different characters and it would be nice use them in one song

[Ghost Dog]

My take on it (as someone who likes DUNE2): generally speaking, when it comes to DUNE2, the sound is there, but the envelopes can't hold a candle to Sylenth1's envelopes. Period.

They aren't nearly as "snappy" (especially the release, with really low values).

DUNE2 with envelopes that perform as well as Sylenth1's envelopes would be a really, really decent synth (then again, so would Sylenth1 with DUNE2's low CPU usage (without sacrificing the sound quality, of course)).

[AnX]

[Cinebient]

Not that "snappy" again
Turn on audio rate in settings and use MSEG and create your own snappy envelopes in ms.
It will bite your ass
But "snappiest" synth is ES2 anyway.....

[Yorrrrrr]

This got silly now, with these 'snappy' and 'strawy' envelopes thingy that no one can describe clearly. I guess envelopes down to the milliseconds, with whatever shaped curves, at audio rate modulation, are not 'snappy' enough.

[recursive one]

Good envelopes are not only about how fast the sound hits. E.g., the "concavity" of the attack and decay phases is important as well.

Enentually it comes down to that the plucks and basses made with one synth sound nice and organic, and those made with another one - not so.

[Ghost Dog]

I'm surprised by the "laughing" comments but, whatever rocks your boat, guys.

If you can't discern those things, what can I say.

[chk071]

Good envelopes are not only about how fast the sound hits.

Actually, it's mostly about that. In my experience, there's only so much you can do with exponential envelopes, or MSEG's. Just take a look at how few soft synths can do the "click" on a sine wave. As far as I know, the absence of that is a sign of "too slow" envelopes.

[Yorrrrrr]

I legitimately want to learn more about it. I really want to be able to discern. Can you guys please post some sort of an audio example or a comparison between synths with good and bad envelopes or whatever, to educate us?

[recursive one]

I legitimately want to learn more about it. I really want to be able to discern. Can you guys please post some sort of an audio example or a comparison between synths with good and bad envelopes or whatever, to educate us?

I can only say that I never managed to create a really good psytrance bass with Spire or Dune. This is very simple sound, a saw wave with very fast attack and decay and fully closed LP assigned to an envelope. In either of the above synths these kinds of basses always sound not quite right. Sylenth does this effortlesly at the same settings. I can't say that I understand the technical detalis well enough but I was told that it somehow depends on the actual shape of the envelope curve and, in partucular, zero attack doesn't always mean that the sound starts at its maximal volume.

Parawave Rapid allows setting the concavity for attack and decay, you may download the demo and investigate how it influences the sound of short plucky patches.