KVR Audio

masterhiggins · Post by **masterhiggins** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:40 am

Taurus wrote:Yes, Cubase the DAW you buy new every year.

Steinberg's pricing schemes are pretty ballsy for what you get. I'm quite surprised people pay that much.

Daags · Post by **Daags** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:58 am

xx JPRacer xx wrote:
Bitwig wrote:Alongside the announcement of Bitwig Studio 2 we are also introducing a new license model.

Starting with the release of Bitwig Studio 2, you’ll get 12 months of free upgrades and updates with your purchase. This plan also includes email support.

After the 12 months, you can renew your upgrade plan at an attractive and affordable price.

The following FAQ section should answer any questions about our new license model. If anything is still unclear, we're more than happy to answer any questions, just drop us a line at www.bitwig.com/support.

Why is this upgrade plan better than our previous model?
We will be able to release key features as they are ready - instead of holding them back for major releases. This enables us to offer you new feature and content updates more regularly.
Additionally, if you're a new customer, you won't need to worry about any potential upcoming releases when buying your license, as any software upgrade (or update) will be free of charge within the first 12 months - from the day you registered it in your Bitwig user account.

How much will the renewal of the 12 month upgrade plan cost?
159 EUR / 169 USD*. The upgrade plan includes all updates and upgrades - also major ones - released during the time period.
^

+1

incubus · Post by **incubus** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:53 am

"I can now haz your money!"

nightkondor · Post by **nightkondor** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:58 am

Pretty expensive + inefficient model for a company who doesn't succeed to make the 'undo-button' work in version 1.3.13.

so my answer to this plan is:

undo.

maschinelf · Post by **maschinelf** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:16 am

Extremely disappointed move from a company that I thought was different from the others, but now as it turns out, may be even worse than the others.

Also the $169 upgrade/subscription is WAAAAYYYYY overpriced. Something like $100 would be a lot fairer. And they really should consider introducing a monthly plan if they want to go down the much maligned (and rightfully so) subscription path.

Needless to say, I WON'T be updating anytime soon. Will keep an eye on the development pace to see if they live up to the promise they're making, and justifying as the reason for why this makes more sense. And will also wait till it goes on sale, and there are already enough new features to justify the cost. In essence meaning that this is already having the opposite of the intended effect, atleast afaiac.

Unfortunately, I think 2nd hand prices of v1 will drop really low now. Will also be keeping an eye to see whether to sell bitwig and switch to Ableton live at some point in the near future.

Rappo Clappo · Post by **Rappo Clappo** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:39 am

Let the hipster producer use BWS. Bitwig have betrayed their community, you must have some Stockholm syndrome or simply be such a douche as they are to support them. Just such an unthrustworthy person. Or a hipster, which comes down to the same person in this case

Rappo Clappo · Post by **Rappo Clappo** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:46 am

"Unfortunately, I think 2nd hand prices of v1 will drop really low now. Will also be keeping an eye to see whether to sell bitwig and switch to Ableton live at some point in the near future."

That is exactly where they are speculating on. So they can pull this trick.

maschinelf · Post by **maschinelf** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:48 am

Not sure if ur referring to me in your post before the last one, but if you are then I got say I'm really impressed. You must be an eminent psychologist being able to make assessments based on internet posts. And thanks for the free psycho-analysis

Rappo Clappo · Post by **Rappo Clappo** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:55 am

@maschinelf
Lol, I was highlighting your comment, yes. However, I am a community man, not a person who makes money from other's misery to get me some fancy job.

machinesworking · Post by **machinesworking** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:58 am

I'm copy pasting this, but I want to add that if, and only if! the subscription works like this, you sign up, and can renew any time to the latest version for $169, then it's not bad, if you get dinged the longer you wait to "upgrade", or if you cannot upgrade after X amount of time, then it's beyond stupid and a deal killer for a lot of people.

You know what's a great "subscription" model?
ReNoise, you buy v3.7 you get upgrades to 4.7. This of course relies on the honesty of the developers, but isn't at all rigged into a time based model, because let's face flat facts, no software company ever has or ever will complete all planned upgrades on a time scale that customers expect. This model also allows for the software developer to 'speed up' or slow down development on their own schedule, not beholden to upgrade schedules. It also allows for a customer that just bought v1.3 a month ago etc. to get updates until v2.3.

What isn't as pretty for the end user is to think that yearly they should buy the upgrade version, no matter how little or how much improvements have been made.

I buy v2.0 now and in six months they put in the proposed modular tools and Web collaboration features I'm not at all upset if all I get is bug fix updates and it's only 10 months before they release 3.0. Or conversely it takes them longer to do what they said 1 1/2 years say, then finally release 3.0 I'm still OK with that. I buy v2.0 now and it takes them longer than a year to integrate those features they mentioned for 2.0 years and years ago and I'm livid.

This is why subscription models of any kind suck, tracking down "bug free on your system" versions also becomes an issue....

machinesworking · Post by **machinesworking** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:03 am

Adding,... MOTU do not ding you no matter how far back your version is. I upgraded from DP2.7 to DP5 for $199 and from DP5 to DP7 for $199.
A friend has Performer 1.0 and his serial is still valid for upgrade to DP9 at $199.

Bitwig add in that one clause, that you can skip around updates upgrading wise, and it's not a terrible plan if you're capable of holding out. I don't always upgrade if the features aren't what I want or need, so subscription without the ability to drop it for a while is a no go for me.

maschinelf · Post by **maschinelf** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:48 am

Hmm yea that would explain it. I've encountered that type before. The community men, or those who hide behind the guise of one, and randomly pronounce judgements and declare douchery when they feel like, behind the safe anonymity of the internet. Honestly can't think of a bigger type of douchebag .. and guess now I'm a psychologist too

jclosed · Post by **jclosed** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:15 am

masterhiggins wrote:
Taurus wrote:Yes, Cubase the DAW you buy new every year.
Steinberg's pricing schemes are pretty ballsy for what you get. I'm quite surprised people pay that much.

While I am not disagree with you, I must point out that at least Cubase users get updates for older versions, even if they do not update. Cubase 9 is out now, but Cubase 8.5 (and even 8.0) still get updates. For Bitwig that's not the case at all.

And on top of that, Cubase users pay about €150 in TWO WHOLE YEARS, while for Bitwig you do NOT get updates for older versions and have to pay even more (€156) for only ONE YEAR. To sum it up... You pay €312 in two years for Bitwig to keep it up to date, while keeping Cubase up to date is €150 in that same amount of time.

So - At the end buying a full version of Cubase and buy upgrades for it, will turn out much cheaper than doing the same for Bitwig within only a few years.

That's a pity, because I really like the ideas that are incorporated in Bitwig. For now, however, they priced themselves out of the market in my humble opinion. The competition is fierce, and If somebody already owns other DAW's (let's say Cubase and Ableton Live), the urge to buy Bitwig has just dropped a fair amount.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:34 am

maschinelf wrote: Also the $169 upgrade/subscription is WAAAAYYYYY overpriced. Something like $100 would be a lot fairer. And they really should consider introducing a monthly plan if they want to go down the much maligned (and rightfully so) subscription path.

I agree regarding the $100 top as a fair price for an annual subscription. But the monthly subscription will not work for them, because, since people could pay and renew anytime, they would only pay the subscription for the months where there were releases that matter to them, and that way, they would end like paying just three or four times per year - even at the current $169 annual, we, the users, would pay less than $100.

Monthly subscriptions only work when users lose access to the program when they stop paying, like it happens with Adobe or East West.

poonna · Post by **poonna** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:58 am

fmr wrote:
maschinelf wrote: Also the $169 upgrade/subscription is WAAAAYYYYY overpriced. Something like $100 would be a lot fairer. And they really should consider introducing a monthly plan if they want to go down the much maligned (and rightfully so) subscription path.
I agree regarding the $100 top as a fair price for an annual subscription. But the monthly subscription will not work for them, because, since people could pay and renew anytime, they would only pay the subscription for the months where there were releases that matter to them, and that way, they would end like paying just three or four times per year - even at the current $169 annual, we, the users, would pay less than $100.

Monthly subscriptions only work when users lose access to the program when they stop paying, like it happens with Adobe or East West.

Or like Cakewalk's rent-to-own model. You have to pay at least 12 consecutive months to own it. Any less than that and you'll lose access once you stop paying.

bitwig 2 is here