Synapse Audio Minimoog emulation "The Legend" for VST/AU and RE released!

[EnGee]

SA have already said D3 is in development

Great! This one will be 'checked' in my list. Let's see what SA brings in development, my money will mostly go to SA and u-he as I see Well, time will tell.

[Cinebient]

There is already a much "better" Model 15 out there as AU (no windows version yet).
The Moog app is awesome, especially for performence with MPE it is maybe one of the best and not much desktop synths can do this but it doesn't sound as good and juicy as The Legend. (Still i like P900 the most here which is a modular which also includes modelled filter from a Minimoog).
I demoed The Legend again and the added feature set is nice now....if it had MPE support (4 voices are enough) i would buy in a heartbeat. There are workarounds but i prefer it via simple switch
Dune 3 will be awesome if it includes something from the research to create The Legend.

[Ingonator]

Wow, so much drama here again and for the records i did not even post in this discussion yet...

More Polyphony, PWM, Hard Sync, etc etc etc. It wouldn't be an emulation of anything but just a good honest VA that can pass the "Three Note Test". When I first learned Legend was going to be another VA I thought to myself "Oh no not another VA, there are so many already".

Actually adding features like e.g. variable Pulse, PWM and Hard Sync would be closer to a Memorymoog emulation (or modern.

A new Memorymoog emulation with the same quality as The Legend and some additional features like e.g. extended polyphony, multimode filter, effects, polyphonic Unison mode (opposing to the 6 voice monophonic Unison in the real thing) etc. would indeed awesome.

As was discused earlier the Memorymoog is NOT just a polyphonic Minimoog also as except to the Moog 24dB Lowpass filter the circuits are based on CEM chips comparable to e.g. a Prophet 5 or Oberheim OB-Xa/OB-8.

Modern Moogs like e.g. Little Phatty or Minimoog Voyager also have Hard Sync and morphable waveshapes (which both are also included in the Minimoog Osc of Diva). I had a Moog Slikm Phatty myself but the PWM that is available from the morphable waveshapes did not realy sound similar to dedicated PWM based on a variable Pulse waveform for me (like included in e.g. my Bass Station II or Pulse 2 hardware synths).

Like the Prophet 5 the Memorymoog is also able of switching on all waveforms of one oscillator on at once (Sawtooth, Triangle and variable Pulse for all 3 Oscs) which is not possible with a morphable waveshape control.

One huge problem with emulating the Memorymoog besides the DSP coding is that the real thing is insanely expensive (beyond 10000 €) now. Doing a proper emulation like The Legend without access to the real thing would not be a really good idea IMO.
An option would be that Richard would find an owner of a Memorymoog in good condition where he could have access to it doing the development (like with 2 Minimoogs from Bigtone used during the development of The Legend).

FWIW i had discussed with Richard about a Memorymoog emulation in the past but if it will be really done is another story.

BTW one feature i would also like to see in such a new emulation is a dedicated Sine waveform. I am quite happy that my Novation Bass Station II has this in both main Oscs and also in the Sub-Osc (the Sub-Osc has Sine, Square or a Pulse).

[Ingonator]

I am not against adding new features but those must be realistic if we are taöking about the current 1.x version of The Legend. Besides that currently it is no problem to use this as an authehtic Minimoog Model D emulation and this should still be possible with further additions.

Beyond what i jsut discussed about a new Memorymoog emulation nobody said it will be impossible that further v1.x updates for The Legend could include new features while some requests like e.g. a second multimode filter are nor likely (and as mentioned earlier you could do that with adding the FX version of The Legend after the synth plugin).

For example adding simple LFo module is something that could be possible but like with e.g. teh new filter modes and teh contzrols for the aftertouch/velocity support would need a few changes to the GUI.
So far also all addition were supposed to be compatible wit th RE version for Reason which is an important point when adding new features to The Legend.

Anyway i am quite sure that this will not end up with a feature set like e.g. DUNE 2.5...

I also do not believe in a "Legend 2.0" or "Legend XL" at this moment. If such new plugin would be done it is more likely it would be a Memorymoog based emulation like discussed above.

[fluffy_little_something]

I recorded a little audio of a (what I consider) warm Hybrid 3 pad and you can try to make Legend sound that way, I don't think you will succeed.

https://app.box.com/s/nuklw6olvp410abipeutqg1gzy84ckjz

Let me know if you can get it to play.............

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6O5u ... WFIekZQZ0E

If not try this.........

http://vocaroo.com/i/s13bdssofPN2

That's exactly what I meant. It sounds hard (also, it seems you used the delay, which I did not), not nearly as fine and soft as H3 for instance, which you said is the harshest-sounding synth you have.
I am not saying that there is no use for such harsher sounds, but that was not the point.

[Ingonator]

That's exactly what I meant. It sounds hard (also, it seems you used the delay, which I did not), not nearly as fine and soft as H3 for instance, which you said is the harshest-sounding synth you have.
I am not saying that there is no use for such harsher sounds, but that was not the point.

Yeah we all know that you love Hybrid 3 and also Sylenth1 (that AFAIK you bought again after you sold it already).

Obviously you are not interested in a Minimoog emulation (even if it has advanced features) so why not just move on and go playing with your favorite synths instead...

Maybe also your perception of what proper analog sound is about is wrong. If a Minimoog Model D and a proper emulation like The Legend is not sounding analog enough then i do not know which synths should be...

The last 13 years i always owned at least one realanalog synth so i know what real analog sounds. Often when i play with The Legend i forget that i use software and not a hardware synth.
Besides that i like adding effects to The Lgend too and this is not "cheating" and also does not make it sound bad.

FWIW i had also owned a real Roland Jupiter 8 and still wait to see and hear an emulation taht nails it in teh same way that The Legnd does with teh Minimoog Model D. Current options like e.g. Arturia Jupiter 8, uHe Diva with the corresponding modules or the Roland Boutique JP-08 (that i did not buy yet...) seems to be nice on their own but still not 100% there...

[fluffy_little_something]

Yeah we all know that you love Hybrid 3 and also Sylenth1 (that AFAIK you bought again after you sold it already).

Obviously you are not interested in a Minimoog emulation (even if it has advanced features) so why not just move on and go playing with your favorite synths instead...

Yeah, as if it were any of your business where and what I post

Listen pal, when SA includes polyphony in an emulation of a monophonic hardware synth, they need not be surprised when people compare the poly sound to other synths.

And why would you even mind my opinion? When I say it sounds harsh, that actually helps your brass patches, which don't thrive on softness.

So go back to your little sandbox and bury your head in the sand again. Legend is the bestest, everything is great

[Ingonator]

Yeah we all know that you love Hybrid 3 and also Sylenth1 (that AFAIK you bought again after you sold it already).

Obviously you are not interested in a Minimoog emulation (even if it has advanced features) so why not just move on and go playing with your favorite synths instead...

Yeah, as if it were any of your business where and what I post

Listen pal, when SA includes polyphony in an emulation of a monophonic hardware synth, they need not be surprised when people compare the poly sound to other synths.

And why would you even mind my opinion? When I say it sounds harsh, that actually helps your brass patches, which don't thrive on softness.

So go back to your little sandbox and bury your head in the sand again. Legend is the bestest, everything is great

Well, your previosu comment was not teh first of that kind and like alraedy mentioned maybe The Legend is just not your kind of synth.

The other option would be that a comparison to e.g. Hybrid 3 is just the usual apples and oranges comparison and it would simply not work.
Some peole simply seem to mix up sounding "better" with sounding "different".

And as alraedy mentioend maybe your own perception of analog sound is a bit different than what an analog synth is actualy about.

I could post 100 audio demos that show why The Legend sounds liek a proper analog synth and taht it coudl also sound warm but i know you since several years now and i know that you would always find reason to tell that it does not sound the way you want to or at least not similar to your favorite synths including e.g. Hybrid 3. It does not mean that The Legnd sounds "wrong" as it is.

[nordickvr]

...However, if SA wants to emulate/copy the Model 15 design only, and apply what they achieved from filters/oscillators ..etc to make Legend 15 or even Legend 35 or 55, then it is not a very risky business.

Legend 35 or 55 from Synapse Audio would be awesome!
I personally prefer having different niche synths with them own personality/focus.
But that is really just me.

[EnGee]

...However, if SA wants to emulate/copy the Model 15 design only, and apply what they achieved from filters/oscillators ..etc to make Legend 15 or even Legend 35 or 55, then it is not a very risky business.

Legend 35 or 55 from Synapse Audio would be awesome!
I personally prefer having different niche synths with them own personality/focus.
But that is really just me.

Who knows?! They might already have a plan for next vintage emulation (being Moog based or another brand). The success of the Legend can be a natural motive for that

[Ingonator]

Currently for the near future the more realistic options are that there would be a few more updates for The Legend 1.x (but not something as big as a second full featured multimode filter...) and based on the experiences with the analog modelling in The Legend there might be additional filter models in an upcoming Dune 3, the same way as developments in Diva or Repro-1 do influence the deveopment of Zebra 3.
DUNE 2.5 alraedy includes new analog filter modes and an analog envelope mode.

Besides that currently there is alraedy an option to combine DUNE 2.5 and the FX version The Legend (or combine The Legend synth with the FX version).

Not sure if Richard would have enough time to work on further updates for Legend v1, Dune 3 and another anlog emulation but if yes it would be nice of course. Anyway unlike U-He Richard does not seem to have several co-worksers that could help with working on multiple projects at once. .

[nordickvr]

...Not sure if Richard would have enough time to work on further updates for Legend v1, Dune 3 and another anlog emulation but if yes it would be nice of course. Anyway unlike U-He Richard does not seem to have several co-worksers that could help with working on multiple projects at once. .

Richard definitely rocks!
Respect.

[Ingonator]

Opposing to some other requests that were done more often a funny thing is that there was only a single request for a Bandpass filter here and that back in September 2016:

This is maybe a bit stupid but could it be possible to add highpass and bandpass modes to the filter? Like they wouldn't be visible in the frontpanel but when you flip it around.. You could for example switch lowpass to bandpass.

Now that we have two Bandpass modes (where a 24dB BPF is more rare with vintage analog synths, especially polyphonic ones) it was quite an obvious addition and i really like this.
On the other hand this did not need a big change to the GUI as only a single switch had to be added (And due to that it is not a huge probem to also add this to the RE version).
The controls for aftertouch and velocity needed more space at the GUI (in the back panel) so this must have been a bigger problem in that respect.

AFAIK aftertouch/velocity support was one of the most requested features and we gotthat too with this update.
So to sum up it' not like Richard does not listen to requests but as i already said they must be realistic which also means not having to do a major redesign of the GUI (except top a few parts like with this update) and also to keep the RE version compatible.

The FX plugin of The Legend was another major addition but in discussions this is mostly ignored or people say that you could not save a setup involving this with a synth preset. This is true but still the FX plugin could be useful and quite powerful, also in combination with other synths (even more if you route a MIDI track to the FX plugi nto also use teh built-in envelopes and oscillators)
It would be also possible to provide a combinations of the synth and FX plugin of The Legend as templates for hosts (e.g. as Instrument racks for Ableton Live 9).

[fluffy_little_something]

Well, your previosu comment was not teh first of that kind and like alraedy mentioned maybe The Legend is just not your kind of synth.

The other option would be that a comparison to e.g. Hybrid 3 is just the usual apples and oranges comparison and it would simply not work.
Some peole simply seem to mix up sounding "better" with sounding "different".

And as alraedy mentioend maybe your own perception of analog sound is a bit different than what an analog synth is actualy about.

I could post 100 audio demos that show why The Legend sounds liek a proper analog synth and taht it coudl also sound warm but i know you since several years now and i know that you would always find reason to tell that it does not sound the way you want to or at least not similar to your favorite synths including e.g. Hybrid 3. It does not mean that The Legnd sounds "wrong" as it is.

Why? Both are subtractive analog-style synths, so I am comparing apples to apples.

I don't think I used any of those words such as analog in this thread. I could not care less whether it sounds authentically analog or not. I judge sound in absolute terms. And in this respect I continue to think Legend sounds harsher than other synths. Analog does not mean better, the old gear only sounded the way it did because that's all there was. It's not the holy grail.

All I said was, I quote "Anyway, for pads I don't really like Legend, it sounds harsh to my ears."
Live with it, not everyone shares your enthusiasm.

For mono basses I like Legend, though. So stop telling people what synth is right for them, you are in no position to tell.

[Ingonator]

Why? Both are subtractive analog-style synths, so I am comparing apples to apples.

Minimoog Model D, Oberheim SEM, Sequential Circuits Pro One, Korg MS-20, Roland SH-101, Roland TB-303, Yamaha CS-30 and EMS VCS3 are all analog subtractive synths but many if not most people will agree that those in combination of features and basic sound are too much different do a proper comparison.

Even a Minimoog Model D and a Minimoog Voyager are differnt in their basic sound and the difference to other modern Moogs like e.g. Little Phatty or Sub 37 is even bigger (which does not mean that those modern Moogs are bad at all, just different...).

Speaking about compaisons of e.g. The Legend to teh Moog Modular 15 app i would also not diretly compare the sound of a Moog Modular with that of a Moog Minimoog Model D just because they are from the same company. FWIW i have Arturia Modular V3 here and like it but it does not replace The Legend for me just because it has many more features.

Two comparisons of the Minimoog Model D and Voyager posted at Gearslutz:

they dont sound even remotely close. I have owned both of them as well as dozens of other vintage synths and I can tell you honestly that if you want the model D sound a voyager wont replace it. That said I did like my voyager for certain things. When compared to the model D the voyager sounds very tame, it is much smoother and less aggresive. OSCs are much more stable and thus you dont get the grit and character of the old beauty. Overall the model D just sounds more robust, its just a lot bigger sounding. I wouldnt say you need them both though. put them side by side and decide which one you like best and put the money from the lesser one into something else. There are tons of other monosynths that sound just as good if not better. FWIW I think the pro one and oberheim OB-1 kick the minis ass.

I own an original minimoog model d and i have played the voyager as well.Like the previous poster said they are slightly different.The old model d has more grit and is not as tame as the new voyager.I have owned and compared many classic synths and nothing imo sounds as kik ass as the original mini.Synths i have owned are,Prophet 5 rev 2,Arp odyssey,Ob matrix 6,Roland super jupiter mks 80,Pro one and i compared all of them at one time or another.

So due to that comparison you might be more intereted in a polyphonic Minimoog Voyager emulation at it seems to sound more "tame" in comparison..