To moderators: Why no ST 2 LE with group buy package?

[Meffy]

Meffy, no offence, but I reckon they would've considered all that and posted after a fair wait. It comes across like you're speaking to a couple of children and they're not.

munchkin, sorry my messages read that way to you. That's not the intent, as you know. Several new users here and on other forums have run into frustrations from not knowing exactly what was in the box, and I've talked to at least two people who ordered two library CDs and wondered why there was no ST2LE disc in the box. Makes sense to rule out the things I know have given other people problems. Got them working, after all.

Since the suggestions that got other people going didn't work here, support will just have to come from eSoundz. They have no reason to short anyone deliberately. They'll make things right for everyone who's missing part of their order. Why would any business do otherwise?

Patience, people. It's hard, but it's the only way to set things right. I was frustrated too, over other issues. But I waited my turn and the eSoundz and IK tech guys got me straightened out. Give them a chance to help those who got on line first -- everyone who's submitted a request for help will get it, I'm sure.

bithead: if, after you've contacted a seller (any seller), they refuse to fulfill your order, then you have every right to complain. I would too. Starting to panic before even receiving your order strikes me as premature to say the least. Wait and see. If you do run into problems, consider that some early rough spots have already been smoothed over for you by us earlier buyers.

Meffy

[Squids]

Ok. I blink and this thread is this long before I even got a chance to say anything... that was fast!

So, a couple of things. First, the ST2 LE possibly missing from anyone's package is either:

a. It was not actually ordered correctly because it had to be selected in the "add freebies" part of the order.

b. WAS ordered correctly in the "add freebies" part of the order (ie. chosen as ST2 LE + 1 free library) in which case shipping made a mistake (which of course they will fix right away for you)

c. That you changed your order after the fact and perhaps this was missed (when going through hundreds of orders, more chance for human error if it is not IN the system which is why it is best to try to get the original order correct as much as possible)


Now, if it is A. which I have heard then it is not our fault. It was explained on the page that if you don't already own ST2 that you have to select ST2 LE in the order and that it doesn't "automatically" come with it as the rest of the bundle are "sounds only" and you can choose ala carte.

Let me tell you something. I feel bad. Because this whole "choose your freebie" thing was my idea to give you guys MORE for your money and some flexibility if you already owned ST2. I think it was a big mistake to offer it because it increased the chance of error on your part or ours by a large percentage. But, that's already past so we'll of course make sure that you get whatever you ordered and also find a way for you to get whatever else you need. Chances are you'll even end up making out better for the mistake.

If it is B. and you ordered it correctly but didn't receive it in your shipment then this is pretty serious. Somebody in shipping is responsible for this error and it is not going to be very good for them if this is the case. I need to know about it so CC me to your email to shipping: dave@esoundz.com

If it is C. then please understand that a LOT of people came back and changed their order info around. It was unusually high for address changes, freebie changes and all kinds of things. We had a good system for cross-checking changes but unfortunately in the last several days Dan who was handling that part became ill. Hopefully he'll be in today. But, Marcos and Dave- the main shipping guys had to go by his notes. They SHOULD have gotten it correct. But if they didn't I would also like to know about it. Still, I am sure Dan feels bad but he was unavoidably out the poor guy. He would have followed up on it as an extra customer support. If you sent an email to dan@esoundz.com in the last few days and didn't get a response then this is why.

I gave you guys dan@esoundz.com so you could talk personally with one of the head people at the company. But, there's also Mark, Rob, Marcos, Dave (not me, we call him LD), Ben, Dustin, Jimmy and interns who help out part time. So, the best thing is to send an email to either these three email accounts depending on what type of email inquiry it is:

shipping@esoundz.com - for questions about the shipment, any issues with the package etc.

support@esoundz.com - any issues getting up and running, any problems with the sounds (any problems with the software part you can also email and we at esoundz will walk you through IK tech support and follow up to make SURE you have everything up and running- this is a new level of support that we're going to be doing more and more for our customers... because we can.)

sales@esoundz.com - any issues with needing to make special order arrangements or to discuss products, orders etc.


Personal emails are:

mark@esoundz.com - operations manager
dan@esoundz.com - customer support manager
dave@esoundz.com - the big cheese

But, only CC the personal ones and try to mostly use the general ones because the whole dept sees those emails as opposed to JUST Dan (who might be sick... rarely is btw but...).

Phone number if you are in the US is toll free

800 232 6186

International including the US and Canada + the rest of the world

954 846 9447

If you don't get somebody keep trying back. I don't hear the phone going all day. We also have a roll over to several other lines. However, I am going to check to make sure that rollover is working. I have a suspicion that it isn't in which case I want to have a talk with the phone system guy. We'll have that fixed. Honestly, for what we pay for our "deluxe" phone system and for the amount of personel we have around it should NEVER be the case that you can't get through. I hate hearing this. So, it will be solved today so it rolls over to even a few more lines if that is what needed. I'd be surprised if anyone ever had this problem again.

Oh, except the voice mail is also an issue where it gets clogged up when we're not there. We are there 10-6 Florida time to be able to answer. We're not there before or after this time usually so try to call in that window of business hours.

If you follow the procedures in this email you WILL absolutely be taken care of. Please don't even worry about the possibility that you won't be.

Thanks.

[munchkin]

Meffy, no offence, but I reckon they would've considered all that and posted after a fair wait. It comes across like you're speaking to a couple of children and they're not.

munchkin, sorry my messages read that way to you. That's not the intent, as you know. Several new users here and on other forums have run into frustrations from not knowing exactly what was in the box, and I've talked to at least two people who ordered two library CDs and wondered why there was no ST2LE disc in the box. Makes sense to rule out the things I know have given other people problems. Got them working, after all.

Since the suggestions that got other people going didn't work here, support will just have to come from eSoundz. They have no reason to short anyone deliberately. They'll make things right for everyone who's missing part of their order. Why would any business do otherwise?

Patience, people. It's hard, but it's the only way to set things right. I was frustrated too, over other issues. But I waited my turn and the eSoundz and IK tech guys got me straightened out. Give them a chance to help those who got on line first -- everyone who's submitted a request for help will get it, I'm sure.

bithead: if, after you've contacted a seller (any seller), they refuse to fulfill your order, then you have every right to complain. I would too. Starting to panic before even receiving your order strikes me as premature to say the least. Wait and see. If you do run into problems, consider that some early rough spots have already been smoothed over for you by us earlier buyers.

Meffy

My apologies if I made the wrong assumption and I know you're trying to be helpful Meffy but I think sometimes instead of responding to the issue time is spent challenging the person over whether they have created the problem. I realise there are all levels of users out there but assuming that everyone doesn't know the basics can be as unhelpful as assuming everyone is a poweruser.

I admit that this is an issue that comes out of my own frustrations with various support services in the past (not Sonic Synth as I have only just bought one of their products.) Where the level of advice initially is pitched at asking me whether I have the computer switched on. This is after I've sent them the fullest details possible of the bug I'm experiencing. Then when I reply that the computer is switched on they advise me to change my mobo! It goes form one extreme to another! There doesn't seem to be a middle ground with some support services.

Of course, I'm parodying the whole support experience with the above example but sometimes it has felt pretty frustrating as advice runs along similar lines leaving me without a resolution. I suppose support is never perfect and is highly individual to the person with the bug but...in customer relations that platitude is called a cop out and one used occassionally at KVR. It's the classic shut down line when someone doesn't want to deal with the issue or doesn't know how to resolve it. This is just a general observation not drawn from specific experience of particular developers/KVR members. But I think it exists.

The psychology and practice of customer support is a whole field in itself. As with any relationship there are ways to handle complaints, resolving disputes etc. that maximise the positive outcome for both the customer and trader. I know that traders/employers often prioritise the product development over customer relations and employee satisfaction. But productivity rises when the opposite is the case.

I think Squids is being supportive, don't get me wrong. But I've seen threads about support issues at KVR in all the forums that have degenerated into slagging matches because the issue is turned into a case of oneupmanship over who holds 'the knowledge' and who doesn't. Or it becomes a judgement over who is 'a time waster' and who deserves support.

Phew! Better get back to work now...

[marcpl]

Squids,

I'm not affected by this in anyway but I just wanted to say that you're a good man and you and your staff run a great company. That's why you always get my business.

I wish all companies were like you guys.

Thanks,
Marc

[Meffy]

[edit] [Oops, this should have been addressed to munchkin.]

Understood. I'm not tech support, though -- just another customer. One who got confused, muddled through, found that others ran into problems similar to the ones reported here, and offered a possible solution that has worked for others. I nowhere suggested that anyone "caused a problem," just telling what's worked for other people, hoping to turn another user's sour experience into a joyous one.

I'm not setting myself up as any kind of authority or expert. That would be absurd, as anyone knows who's seen me blunder stupidly about. :-D

Anyway, Squids has set things straight so my suggestions are superfluous and I'll drop out of the thread.

Meffy

[unknown user]

@squids:
Thanks for the solid info and explanation. No worries, I'm chillin. Just wanted to put my story out there. Note that I wasn't in the group buy, but obviously still affected. Sorry to hear that Dan was out sick, but it all makes sense now--yes, it's the classic small-company quandary. Been there myself!

People based systems are dynamic and fluid, and require less infrastructure. However, people-based systems degrade rapidly when key performers are absent or impaired (Think: band member absent from or drunk at a gig.) Better to create and document reliable process-based systems and empower all the people to drive them. Sorry I know that sounds like a PHB (pointy haired boss from Dilbert).

[Squids]

It's also small company becoming medium sized company growing pains. But, these are FAST. We do things super fast around here. Rob implements eRewardz and ePointz and account things at lightning speed, I hire the appropriate people to handle whatever level of business we're doing and we make it happen.

Plus, there are two ways that we improve. One is looking at any issues and coming up with the best solution so it never happens again and the other is to just look at ways to make the site better and better until it is just TIGHT as the ultimate place it can have the potential to be. More products, more information, more deals and breaks, interaction, freebies, rewards, incentives... esoundz is becoming a monster resource for sounds (oh and yes, eventually downloadable sounds to that you can apply ePointz to and other things...)

You'll like the way you look. I guarantee it.

[Meffy]

You'll like the way you look. I guarantee it.

*snerk!*

Squids, this suit you sold me is cut all wrong! The trousers have no hole for my tail.

On the plus side, download-print-cut-and-stitch clothing is definitely the wave of the future, and you're smart to get in on it now.

Meffy

[frootbat]

Squids,
I'm going to assume you're sincere and that eventually, someone will respond to my many e-mails over the past several days, noting that I did not receive ST 2 Le and including your documentation indicating that it should have been included in your shipment to me.

I did indicate on my initial order to include ST 2 LE and did not try to include it at a later date.

For whatever reason, I'm still waiting for a response to my many e-mails.

Regards.

[Kim Lajoie]

The trousers have no hole for my tail.

Forever,




Kim.

[Meffy]

Aren't you glad your tailoring problems are simpler than mine?

--


[edit] P.S.: The line of Squids' that I quoted is the catchphrase of a line of discount men's-wear stores (that apparently advertises in Florida as well as hereabouts).
As Flo and Eddie sang: o/~ Eddie, are you kidding? o/~