Basic DAW and audio latency recording question

[yul]

Hello!

I want to increase my use of recording within my DAW (presently Mulab) while overdubbing on an existing midi track playing VST synths.

What are the latency issues to consider here to maintain good timing on the final take? I presently monitor my external audio separately and can clearly hear the delay (manageable).

1- I know there is latency coming in from the audio in to my DAW.
- Will my DAW correct for this latency on playback? Do I have to manually make the corrections?

2- I also know there is latency between a midi note and VST playback on the audio out.
- Do I need to worry about this side? On final playback both audio+vst tracks will have equal latency.

Also, where does PDC come into play here?

Any suggestions welcome! Thanks!

[thecontrolcentre]

You could try lowering the audio buffer on your soundcard first. Do you use an external ASIO audio interface?

[bustedfist]

Hello!

I want to increase my use of recording within my DAW (presently Mulab) while overdubbing on an existing midi track playing VST synths.

What are the latency issues to consider here to maintain good timing on the final take? I presently monitor my external audio separately and can clearly hear the delay (manageable).

1- I know there is latency coming in from the audio in to my DAW.
- Will my DAW correct for this latency on playback? Do I have to manually make the corrections?

2- I also know there is latency between a midi note and VST playback on the audio out.
- Do I need to worry about this side? On final playback both audio+vst tracks will have equal latency.

Also, where does PDC come into play here?

Any suggestions welcome! Thanks!

1. It may, or not, depends on things like in question 2.

2. This is where PDC comes in. It's one of the factors for things lining up automatically, but not the only one. Cubase recently allowed setting up an external instrument so PDC could be applied to it, just like internal processes, don't know about other DAWs.

Best to just do it, see what does what, and then come back giving a specific scenario and complete system specs if something goes sideways.

It's the parachute syndrome where worry prevents action. This is the push out the door, let the static cord do it's job and enjoy the ride.

[tehlord]

Worst case scenario is you nudge your audio back in time after you record. The biggest issue with latency is playing along in time if you're monitoring through your DAW, latency can drive you mad here.

[yul]

Thanks a lot guys! Yes I have ASIO, I will test out and see how things go.

I really wonder how the high end studios do it though?

I can't imagine having engineers moving the audio by x samples/ticks manually?

[bustedfist]

Thanks a lot guys! Yes I have ASIO, I will test out and see how things go.

I really wonder how the high end studios do it though?

I can't imagine having engineers moving the audio by x samples/ticks manually?

Not only do they do it, but through everyday use, probably have a key command to automate the task. Never heard of an Engineers Edition of any DAW where these things just don't happen.

I have no alignment issues in my DAW, regardless of source.

[yul]

Wow I learned something today thanks!

[db3]

latency can drive you mad here.

Indeed! Many DAWs have options for latency compensation, and lower latency when monitoring etc. But I found this to be a bit hit and miss, and certainly a cause for much frustration when recording midi live.

I just stopped using Overbridge and Virus TI because of the latency the plugins introduce. Annoyingly neither have the option to put the plugin into a simple VST editor/midi mode. I'm now using Moog hardware with their fantastic VST editor plugins - for me this is seems to offer the best of both worlds for tight integration.

My latency also improved when I changed my USB interface to a new 2nd gen Focusrite model—and was also able to lower the audio buffer.

[barryfell]

latency can drive you mad here.

Indeed! Many DAWs have options for latency compensation, and lower latency when monitoring etc. But I found this to be a bit hit and miss, and certainly a cause for much frustration when recording midi live.

Yeah Live was a real nightmare for this issue, and still is as far as I know. It was one of the reasons I left it a few years ago. Also, the playhead would appear out of time with the sound the more latency you were inducing which was annoying.

Cubase has ASIO Guard which lowers the latency for any monitored track, plus it has a button you can click and it disables all the high latency inducing inserts/sends in the project so you can can play a part in with low latency and and then just click the button again to re-enable all the high latency plugins. Very handy!

I also found out last week after having some mysterious high ASIO usage even with just my default template open and be only being able to play my default templates instruments when the buffer was at 512, which is obviously useless for many parts, that it was down to my AMD R290 GFX card. That's an issue i've never seen anyone mention in all my years of system optimisation of audio, but when I investigated it I read that I may be an issue so I changed the 'graphics profile' under the Radeon tool tray app from 'balanced' to 'optimise performance', my ASIO meter halved and I was able to play my default template instruments with a 48 sample size buffer no problem.

Well worth investigating if you haven't already.

I just stopped using Overbridge and Virus TI because of the latency the plugins introduce. Annoyingly neither have the option to put the plugin into a simple VST editor/midi mode. I'm now using Moog hardware with their fantastic VST editor plugins - for me this is seems to offer the best of both worlds for tight integration.

Likewise, I stopped using both due to buffer size (which always goes up to at least 1024 near the end of the project but not before I want to bounce my hardware), plus the Ti software was never that stable for me and I had frequent errors with it.

I assume you've never heard of the Virus Ti panel's someone made for the Ctrl hardware synth editor VST?

http://ctrlr.org/access-virus-ti-snow/
or
http://ctrlr.org/snowed/

They are pretty much identical to the official software other than no audio over USB. It's great!

[db3]

I assume you've never heard of the Virus Ti panel's someone made for the Ctrl hardware synth editor VST?

Yeah, I looked at Ctrl & Mystery Islands. I was in two minds whether to put faith in a third party. You do wonder why Access can't simply do the same. I asked Elektron this question, and they said it was something they'd like to offer, but they didn't have a timeframe.

[barryfell]

I assume you've never heard of the Virus Ti panel's someone made for the Ctrl hardware synth editor VST?

Yeah, I looked at Ctrl & Mystery Islands. I was in two minds whether to put faith in a third party. You do wonder why Access can't simply do the same. I asked Elektron this question, and they said it was something they'd like to offer, but they didn't have a timeframe.

I've seen that Mystery Islands one before but it sure does look ugly.

I agree Access should release a version that doesn't process audio and thus allow all the people that function doesn't work or work well for use their interface.

The CTRL one looks pretty much identical though.