KVR Audio

inkwarp · Post by **inkwarp** » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:24 am

touché..
i still think my old copy of reason 5 is worth keeping as a rewire device. if only for drum instruments...
there was a time when i used it as my one and only daw... ahh
memnons.

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:13 pm

I think it was a dumb decision to go with Rack Extension. Like Nokia going for Symbian, instead of Android.

Had they instead opened up for VST plugs, they would have attracted a whole new market.

softska · Post by **softska** » Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:42 pm

Rack Extension doesn't bother me, in fact some good device came out worth spending for IMO; What bothers is their complete standstill of built-in devices that you can actually build interesting stuff with.

And NNXT and Dr Rex disk streaming is way overdue.

Winstontaneous · Post by **Winstontaneous** » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:20 pm

softska wrote:Rack Extension doesn't bother me, in fact some good device came out worth spending for IMO; What bothers is their complete standstill of built-in devices that you can actually build interesting stuff with.

I agree, I still use Reason a bit (but not as often as Live/Logic). I've never bought a Rack Extension and don't think I will. I think P-heads took the wrong fork in the road a few years back, making it a fairly complete so-so DAW rather than an ever-improving super-stable virtual instrument suite. Still, I find it an inspiring tool, especially for rippling, evolving, harmonically complex soundscapes.

deep'n'dark · Post by **deep'n'dark** » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:31 am

My opinion is that all the best VSTs and DAWs haven't made people making better music than what they did 10 years ago. Propably some users are exception, but mostly everyone uses their tools just the same way as they did 10 years backwards. Propably the limitations we had back then made us more focused than now. When will people admit that we are like spoiled kids with all these hundreds of toys? There will be threads complaining about something new, even after Reason getting a VST support.

V0RT3X · Post by **V0RT3X** » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:47 am

I'm glad I ditched reason.

It was a good learning tool, and in that sense it will have a place in my heart because it was my first DAW.

I think I'll stick with my copy of Bitwig/Ableton and my huge assortment of plugins.

I used to recommend Reason to newbies who wanted to get into electronic music production. Now i just tell them to demo Ableton or Bitwig.

Reason is neat, but honestly at this point it's been left in the dust by the other DAW programs.

As for the diehard Reason fans, well I'll say this. You do whatever makes you happy, and enjoy reason.

If you're happy with a bunch of the Reason factory devices that havn't been updated since Version 5. Then that's great! Continue to enjoy reason! Each to their own.

deep'n'dark · Post by **deep'n'dark** » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:09 am

There's no must to rely on the Factory presets as there's so many 3rd party sound-designers - or then you make your own sounds yourself.
And one more time: Reason is a DAW that is ahead for it's own strengths. And try to make your own trend, how your music should sound, not how someone else wants it to sound.

jjpscott01 · Post by **jjpscott01** » Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:47 pm

There is so much bad information contained in this ridiculous thread that its hilarious. Propellerhead saw record sales numbers in 2016, Reason 9 has seen glowing reviews across the board, and new users have been flooding Youtube with music making videos non-stop over the last year. The Rack Extension format has been a huge success for the company and has only gotten stronger over time.

Now, I know that last sentence burns you Reason-haters up to hear, but lets just think about this logically ... RE's have been going strong now for 5 YEARS. Now year after year, I hear detractors claim that "the format is getting ready to die" or that "RE's have been a total failure". I'm assuming those same critics have no clue what working for a software company is like but NEWS FLASH.... Developers don't waist 5 years of product development on a format that loses money. The very idea that anyone would still be making claims like this in 2017 is becoming almost embarrassing.

I use Reason as one of 5 DAW's that I know inside out and my VST collection is massive, but I will still tell anyone out there that The Rack Extension format is my favorite. I've lost years of my music making life on troubleshooting DAW compatibility, trying to find missing plugins, losing finished projects and fixing broken software after faulty Windows and Mac updates. That is except for my Reason stuff. Its always there, it always works, and I can forget about all that other crap. From a coding standpoint, its actually quite brilliant what Propellerhead have accomplished in a world where computer technology is moving and changing so quickly.

bungle · Post by **bungle** » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:10 am

What a nonsense post, I was going to give a full reply but then you typed developers don't work on a format for five years without success, and I was laughing too hard to even remember my reply.

jjpscott01 · Post by **jjpscott01** » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:50 am

bungle wrote:What a nonsense post, I was going to give a full reply but then you typed developers don't work on a format for five years without success, and I was laughing too hard to even remember my reply.

Haha...Read again

"Developers don't waist 5 years of product development on a format that loses money." Rack Extensions became a nice source of income for Propellerhead after they were released. You think they kept pushing the format, centered all forthcoming sales pitches around them, continued updated on the SKD, worked with multiple 3rd party developers, designed their own line of RE's, did multiple tutorial videos based around them, wasted all of that man-power, money, resources, and time on a format that was losing money all along? For what?

I'm confused at why you think any company would do business this way let alone Propellerhead, who's history has taught us quite the opposite. Their Balance Interface, despite being garnering positive reviews, was dropped immediately with no plans for future hardware development as soon as sales showed lower than predicted. "Record" was canned shortly after it came out because they found a way to integrate it into the core program. This isn't a company afraid to abandon an idea if it doesn't work the way they want it to. That's all I'm saying.

bungle · Post by **bungle** » Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:04 pm

You dont even see it do you, balance = outlay to market Record = outlay to market RE = zero outlay to market, just take a cut.

There is a massive difference and your argument is massively flawed, note here that i never said any of the things you said you think i think, but keeping RE marketplace active is a no brainer, succesful or not.

ChamomileShark · Post by **ChamomileShark** » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:11 pm

Other DAWs sound better because they licensed the technology derived from "this plugin".

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:36 pm

deep'n'dark wrote:My opinion is that all the best VSTs and DAWs haven't made people making better music than what they did 10 years ago. Propably some users are exception, but mostly everyone uses their tools just the same way as they did 10 years backwards.

Well, you really can't know what people do. I could not work with the limitations, it isn't a thing where the discipline of a much smaller palette makes one 'creative', it's the opposite, I'm inspired by SOUND, and those sounds are turn-of-the-century.

'How one uses her tools' doesn't trump 'what are the tools' if they're better tools.

incubus · Post by **incubus** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:40 am

ChamomileShark wrote:Other DAWs sound better because they licensed the technology derived from "this plugin".

As close to the truth as anything else.

Honestly, being banned for speaking the truth is absurd, but at the risk, and long "should be dead" thread being resurrected for further nonsense is worse.

kmonkey · Post by **kmonkey** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:56 am

jjpscott01 wrote:
Now, I know that last sentence burns you Reason-haters up to hear, but lets just think about this logically ... RE's have been going strong now for 5 YEARS.

I am not Reason hater - actually a fan. And i think you are quite wrong. Why? Because in 5 years several top notch developers abandoned RE (you have info here), and quite a few of them reported concerns and completely unexpected bad sale numbers. Mind you these where developers from products which are seen as quite popular in RE world by public (such as Echobode). There is a thread somewhere in reasontalk forum about it.

If you think constant mediocre releases at RE world with 90% subpar ugly i mean really ugly devices which offer nothing more then usually what is given for FREE in VST world - is a sign of RE going strong - you are being very naive (i am telling you this in a friendly way).

On the other hand there is Synapse which produce top notch RE amazing devices. And few of there pop out occasionally from indie never heard developers which are likely making their first (and possibly last) adventure.

I think Reason CEO really talk big nut words and deliver nothing but reinvented wheel sold as something better when it is not. As i am being told two great guys (on high position) left Propellerhead last year. If they go wrong (i don't think they will - Reason is badass music app now) with all these Verdane and stupid nonsense crap - Reason CEO is to blame for wit his "revolutionary" ideas..

They (Propellerhead) just released Acoustic Guitar rompler for kids. For Christ sake i miss times when they put us on fire and when we expected (and was provided with) their amazing devices.

Reason sound doesn't sell is not true