One Synth Challenge #98: Any One Synth (Photonic Wins!)

[ontrackp]

I always find these judging discussions interesting. I enjoy learning how others go about the process.

All good points. I've said before that the OSC is unique because we have to wear several hats - sound designer, composer, arranger, producer, audio engineer. It's a fascinating and exciting mix of skills and the bar in this group is very high in all aspects of this. All of these skills factor into scoring. I give higher scores if someone says they made all the sounds from the INIT patch, and also will be more generous for great sounding production. At the end of the day though, I find listening to the variety of pieces to be educational and fun. I don't care too much about scores, but I care a lot about the sense of community, the comments, and learning some new things each month.

[wagtunes]

The last few replies show just how heavily personal bias fits into this competition. I have mine and all of you have yours.

Guess what?

It all comes back to what I've been screaming for 40 years when people say "that's a bad song."

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS GOOD OR BAD MUSIC!!!!!!!!

But damn it to hell, if there's a track that I don't like, I can damn well tell you EXACTLY why I don't like it and what I would have done to make it a track that I WOULD like.

And that same instruction would make somebody else listen to the NEW track and go "That is GOD awful."

So, what these competitions come down to (if you care about doing well in them, which I no longer do) is careful analysis. It's taking apart the top tracks from each month and analyzing what it is that makes them top tracks.

I can pretty much tell you but I've wasted enough time already.

[Sidom]

Just checking in to tell that I voted.

[Taron]

There you see how different perception and taste is...I would say that Tarons Track lacks room and depth this month...I myself don't care about melodies, I want to have a coherent mix with depth and room and some real sub bass...take the track "vice city" as comparision

Yep, you're completely right and it makes perfect sense to me. This time I spent all the time I had on just making a piece of music and couldn't give the mix any real attention...shamefully. But I was still happy how firm a grip I'm getting on the basics. ...but I'm afraid, even when you're super strong in the engineering department, it just takes time to do a proper mix. You need to have a day or more pass to listen to it again and make better judgements. At least that's how it is for me. I expect it always to be that way, somehow.

So, yeah...mea culpa!

[] Peter:H []

There you see how different perception and taste is...I would say that Tarons Track lacks room and depth this month...I myself don't care about melodies, I want to have a coherent mix with depth and room and some real sub bass...take the track "vice city" as comparision

Yep, you're completely right and it makes perfect sense to me. This time I spent all the time I had on just making a piece of music and couldn't give the mix any real attention...shamefully. But I was still happy how firm a grip I'm getting on the basics. ...but I'm afraid, even when you're super strong in the engineering department, it just takes time to do a proper mix. You need to have a day or more pass to listen to it again and make better judgements. At least that's how it is for me. I expect it always to be that way, somehow.

So, yeah...mea culpa!

That was just meant to say, for what I'm looking in a track with giving an example. WagTunes looks for very different elements, or a combination of elements weighted differentely than I do...and all is completely okay, it's just a matter of taste and what you're looking for in track. I don't do melodies and I like monotonous tracks, so if anybody looks for melodies and a lot of variety then my track will not be the track to go. But the variety of musical expression is just trmendously big, thats why we have Bands like Devildriver and Mozart...

[EnGee]

It's your job to find out why people didn't like (or liked) your track.

And the artist is supposed to figure this out how exactly without any indication as to why the track was disliked?
Just curious.
Just getting a number gives me no indication as to what I might do differently next time.
Psychic powers are sadly lacking in my personal abilities.
Does a 2 mean my mix was disliked or my melody or maybe my lack musical style?
You say it is my job to find out, ok so how do I find out when given nothing to go on?

By analysing others tracks and compare! I don't find it nice nor practical going after people and ask them "but why you didn't like my music?"

[Taron]

Ohohoho, it's particularly hard to learn from individual rating numbers when there are some real life voting trolls as well, hehe, I've seen quite a few of them.

Anyway, my best advice for all those, who dread over their rating results: Quit being stupid and either recognize actual quality troubles in certain disciplines (composition, mix, etc...) and see how you can improve there or quit whining and just keep on doing what you love doing!
As a rule of thumb from what I observe: Though taste in music certainly matters, a quality track of a real, controlled style tends to do very well, even if people normally dislike the style. I keep calling it "sincere" music making, because to me that is what it should be. I just don't want to use it up too much... likely because some people may not understand what I mean by that in the first place.

Who's the metal head among us...ah rats, I'm so sorry, I'm bad with names sometimes...either way, I can hear the roots in his tracks and am always impressed, even if I really would never dare listen to it on purpose. However, when he pulls off the soul of it with an OSC track, I kind love it! Just an example...

We're gathered here to impress each other with what we can do with One Synth. It's not the flipping pop charts or your itunes folder! It would be nice to know that most of us are mature enough to appreciate what that means and help feed confidence and energy into those, who really deserve it, too!

[wagtunes]

Ohohoho, it's particularly hard to learn from individual rating numbers when there are some real life voting trolls as well, hehe, I've seen quite a few of them.

Anyway, my best advice for all those, who dread over their rating results: Quit being stupid and either recognize actual quality troubles in certain disciplines (composition, mix, etc...) and see how you can improve there or quit whining and just keep on doing what you love doing!
As a rule of thumb from what I observe: Though taste in music certainly matters, a quality track of a real, controlled style tends to do very well, even if people normally dislike the style. I keep calling it "sincere" music making, because to me that is what it should be. I just don't want to use it up too much... likely because some people may not understand what I mean by that in the first place.

Who's the metal head among us...ah rats, I'm so sorry, I'm bad with names sometimes...either way, I can hear the roots in his tracks and am always impressed, even if I really would never dare listen to it on purpose. However, when he pulls off the soul of it with an OSC track, I kind love it! Just an example...

We're gathered here to impress each other with what we can do with One Synth. It's not the flipping pop charts or your itunes folder! It would be nice to know that most of us are mature enough to appreciate what that means and help feed confidence and energy into those, who really deserve it, too!

I do, by all the 4s and 5s I give every month and almost always grading above the average curve determined by the other contestants.

Conversely, you can tell the ones who either don't like anything or are just, as you say, trolls (-50% under the average, and so on)

[Frostline]

By analysing others tracks and compare! I don't find it nice nor practical going after people and ask them "but why you didn't like my music?"

But without knowing a basis to fashion a comparison how can one compare anything?
Track A which scored poorly might differ from Tracks B-G which scored well by a plethora of reasons.
And how is an outside party to speculate your inner thought process?
Could one guess?
Perhaps.
Would it be more practical and efficient to simply ask if no hint as to the cause was provided?
I would say yes.
Otherwise one could be left chasing a mixing phantom when in fact the only issue was style choice.
One might go so far to say it could possibly be considered quite not nice to publicly judge anything harshly without being willing to provide some foundation for that assessment.

If I were to directly ask someone "what could I change in my next submission that might improve the score I receive from you?" or "what was it about this track you felt was lacking?" that would be because I find them to be a person I feel I could learn something from and it would indicate that I value and respect their opinion and their work as an artist.
I actually consider it a compliment to ask someone for artistic advice. They are performing at a level I would like to reach someday and I value their opinion/input. I have found quite a few OSCer's that have been quite forthcoming when approached for advice.

Not nice or practical to ask? Good to know that is how you feel.

I wonder if that that is the majority opinion?

[Taron]

I do, by all the 4s and 5s I give every month and almost always grading above the average curve determined by the other contestants.

Conversely, you can tell the ones who either don't like anything or are just, as you say, trolls (-50% under the average, and so on)

THERE! Wag, look what just happened! This is the source for your troubles here. This is GREAT! Because this example could help you and everyone, who might recognize this as possibly relevant: You didn't just chime in with some additional information. You made it about you right away! "I do,....". And immediately it's like your throwing yourself into the middle of a crowd, almost as if you were hoping some would draw guns and you'd find yourself in the middle of some crossfire, hehehe.
And immediately the topic isn't "informative" anymore, but personal, because you're making it personal.

To the right of each post, we see the name of who was writing that post. In your case, we can even see a picture of you, albeit...well...never mind. SO, when ever you write something, we know that you are writing this, endorsing what ever idea you are presenting and so on. You do not need to give a personal account of your actions. In fact, when ever you share your votes here in the posts, you immediately provoke others. I almost cannot believe you wouldn't realize that?!

The upshot is, it's not a display of interest for others and that never sits well. Like, when I write all this here, I don't care about myself, I'm entirely focused on you. It's actually even weird for me to think about myself right now... anyway.

So, yeah, don't throw yourself into the middle of the crowd with this waving flag "look at me!" or "Somebody please draw a gun now!", hahaha. If you care about something truly, try first to focus on this something and not yourself. Crisis almost averted then!

[Taron]

If I were to directly ask someone "what could I change in my next submission that might improve the score I receive from you?" or "what was it about this track you felt was lacking?" that would be because I find them to be a person I feel I could learn something from and it would indicate that I value and respect their opinion and their work as an artist.
I actually consider it a compliment to ask someone for artistic advice. They are performing at a level I would like to reach someday and I value their opinion/input. I have found quite a few OSCer's that have been quite forthcoming when approached for advice.

One of the biggest and most valuable reasons to participate in the OSC is that fact that we CAN help each other. +1 on the compliment sensation, it really feels wonderful to be asked. Equally it is most exciting to be allowed to ask!
The OSC is not your career! But it (and thereby most of us) could very well help you with your career, if it was related, of course.

[EnGee]

If I were to directly ask someone "what could I change in my next submission that might improve the score I receive from you?" or "what was it about this track you felt was lacking?" that would be because I find them to be a person I feel I could learn something from and it would indicate that I value and respect their opinion and their work as an artist.
I actually consider it a compliment to ask someone for artistic advice. They are performing at a level I would like to reach someday and I value their opinion/input. I have found quite a few OSCer's that have been quite forthcoming when approached for advice.

Not nice or practical to ask? Good to know that is how you feel.

I wonder if that that is the majority opinion?

In that case, post your song to be analysed (for example in the Music Cafe forum) and then ask those whom you value their opinions to analyse and comment on your work! Nothing strange about it!

And yes, it is not nice to ask everyone to tell you why he/she didn't like your work. You can ask your friends, or specific persons whom you value, but it is not a mandatory that everyone must explain to you why he/she didn't comment on your track!

[wagtunes]

I do, by all the 4s and 5s I give every month and almost always grading above the average curve determined by the other contestants.

Conversely, you can tell the ones who either don't like anything or are just, as you say, trolls (-50% under the average, and so on)

THERE! Wag, look what just happened! This is the source for your troubles here. This is GREAT! Because this example could help you and everyone, who might recognize this as possibly relevant: You didn't just chime in with some additional information. You made it about you right away! "I do,....". And immediately it's like your throwing yourself into the middle of a crowd, almost as if you were hoping some would draw guns and you'd find yourself in the middle of some crossfire, hehehe.
And immediately the topic isn't "informative" anymore, but personal, because you're making it personal.

To the right of each post, we see the name of who was writing that post. In your case, we can even see a picture of you, albeit...well...never mind. SO, when ever you write something, we know that you are writing this, endorsing what ever idea you are presenting and so on. You do not need to give a personal account of your actions. In fact, when ever you share your votes here in the posts, you immediately provoke others. I almost cannot believe you wouldn't realize that?!

The upshot is, it's not a display of interest for others and that never sits well. Like, when I write all this here, I don't care about myself, I'm entirely focused on you. It's actually even weird for me to think about myself right now... anyway.

So, yeah, don't throw yourself into the middle of the crowd with this waving flag "look at me!" or "Somebody please draw a gun now!", hahaha. If you care about something truly, try first to focus on this something and not yourself. Crisis almost averted then!

No, here's what happened.

Person A: "I'm disappointed by the tracks this month"

Wagtunes: I'm disappointed by the tracks this month

Person B: Wagtunes I'm offended by what you said.

In fact, 2 other people said exactly what I said in this thread. I just was a little more long winded and not quite as tactful. But it was the same thing. I was the only one attacked.

So yeah, I'm now defending myself by pointing out how I vote fairly compared to the average voter. I only had to make this about me because others made it about me when all I did was say what 2 other people said.

You don't have to believe me. Go back and look at the first comment made about the quality of the tracks and then my reply when I said I was glad somebody else said it because I'd been wanting to say it for days but didn't because I KNEW this would happen. I figured with somebody else saying it first, I was safe.

WRONG!!!!

I am NEVER safe around here. 20 people can say the same thing but I'll be the one singled out.

This thread is proof of it.

Anyway, I'm done. I've said my peace and now I am leaving this thread and the OSC for good.

Good luck to all the contestants.

[EnGee]

No, here's what happened.

Person A: "I'm disappointed by the tracks this month"

Wagtunes: I'm disappointed by the tracks this month

Person B: Wagtunes I'm offended by what you said.

In fact, 2 other people said exactly what I said in this thread. I just was a little more long winded and not quite as tactful. But it was the same thing. I was the only one attacked.

So yeah, I'm now defending myself by pointing out how I vote fairly compared to the average voter. I only had to make this about me because others made it about me when all I did was say what 2 other people said.

You don't have to believe me. Go back and look at the first comment made about the quality of the tracks and then my reply when I said I was glad somebody else said it because I'd been wanting to say it for days but didn't because I KNEW this would happen. I figured with somebody else saying it first, I was safe.

WRONG!!!!

I am NEVER safe around here. 20 people can say the same thing but I'll be the one singled out.

This thread is proof of it.

Anyway, I'm done. I've said my peace and now I am leaving this thread and the OSC for good.

Good luck to all the contestants.

How do you think it is the same!

I'll post again photonic's post and your reply to it:

Voted!

Honestly I was surprised that there are not more outstanding tracks, when we are allowed to use any synth. Outstanding not in the meaning of qaulity, more in the meaning of variety in sounds and possibilities.
But on the other hand it maybe shows, that in every other round, with any given synth, this community is able to produce so stunning results, that the benefit of "any" synth is not so much.

Thank you. I'm glad somebody said it besides me because if I had said it, I would have been jumped on like a hooker in NYC.

I was extremely disappointed in this contest. The mixes were great. These guys really know their stuff. But the sound design and the songs (if you can call them songs) were mundane and disappointing. Sure, there were some exceptions from the usual suspects (thank you guys for the great stuff) but for the most part, this competition put me to sleep. And given that you could use any synth you want meaning you could pick the synth you had the absolute best relationship with, I was stunned at the mediocrity.

Now I understand the mediocrity from myself. Because I suck at this stuff. But I could tell by the mixes that you guys really know your stuff. But damn, that's where it ends. Everything else was the same old same old. Nothing new. Nothing interesting outside of those few tracks (thanks doc for the jazz piece. Amazing)

Maybe part of the problem is that this is what people think they have to do in order to win. Maybe they're right. I don't know. But I expected better this month. Truth is, with being confined to one synth, and one that maybe you never even used before, I've heard results infinitely better than this month's.

Like I said. I expect the same old same old from me because I have zero talent. But damn, I know you guys can do better. Your mixes prove that.

I'll be happy when we go back to what OSC actually stands for. One synth. Not any synth on the planet.

It didn't work guys.

I found your post a mess really! What exactly that you want to say? photonic was clear in his post and opinion. He/she didn't disrespect anyone! Didn't accused the others to be hypocritical! While you did! After that you come and cry "Why me? Why you hate me? "

[Frostline]

but it is not a mandatory that everyone must explain to you why he/she didn't comment on your track!

Please show where I stated or implied that it should be mandatory for everyone to comment on my track.
I will happily apologize and edit the offending post.

I believe I suggested an opt-in option for those people both wanting real feedback and possessing the willingness to also provide real feedback. And leaving the ability for those not wanting to participate in mutual feedback to abstain. Not sure how you are getting everyone must comment about my track out of that.

You feel it's cool to judge a track as bad yet have no responsibility to justify your opinion or any obligation to any sense of community to help those you deem producing poor work to improve.

Or am I reading you incorrectly?

I mean I am not trying to change how you feel about it. More power to ya and all that if that is the way you want to be. Just trying to understand an opinion I don't share.

I just personally feel it is important for any judgement that I might make about another's artistic work that I have an open willingness to share the basis of that judgement if asked especially if said judgement is in public.
Just seems polite to me.
But now that you have indicated your opinion on that I now know at least one person I do not have the necessary permission to ask.

@Taron
Glad to see you take my questions to you about my tracks as intended and not as a bother.