Syntronik [update March 2018: New T-03 Bonus Content & 4-for-1 bass synth promo] available

[ghettosynth]

missing osc is a bit of a big deal, I agree. In that alone it would be easy to say these are NOT authentic recreations, but just a cool collection of synths that are in the spirit of the originals. in my mind, still totally worth $69. Where did you get the information about no osc sync?

Read the thread, I pointed this out quite early in the thread. All the information you need to confirm this for yourself is already available. Adding drift and modeled filters doesn't make it "not a rompler." That's the definition of a synthesizer that uses sample playback in the classic sense in lieu of other oscillators.

I don't have time to read the whole thread, nor would I want to. I'd still like to know how you know the osc sync is missing, but not enough to read this whole thread, sorry.

And sorry no....its not a rompler..you're killing your credibility with that assertion. They very well may not be complete recreations of each of these synthesizers, we shall see...but if they provide the filters, modulation capabilities etc..then they are nothing short of synthesizers that simply use samples for the underlying OSC rather then generating simple waveforms algorithmically. its splitting hairs...

Like the JD800, the JV series, everything by Korg since sometime in the early 90s. Yeah, you're just wrong mate. Believe me, I couldn't give two shits about what people ignorant of technology think about my "credibility." If you want to understand, because right now you don't, you can just search this thread for my username and all will be revealed.

Romplers are synthesizers, but their lack of modeling in the oscillators implies certain limitations. This particular product has additional limitations that aren't necessary, but, are typical of simpler romplers.

Your definitions are what lack credibility mate, it doesn't take much to be a synthesizer, the Stylophone is a synthesizer, just not a very capable one.

[Dewdman42]

romplers typically start with more complex wave forms and provide extremely simplistic ability to "synthesize" timbres beyond what is in the base sample. They are sample playback machines with very minimal post processing on the sample. Some romplers can provide more enhanced processing, V.A.S.T comes to mind ..but the whole approach is to start with more complex wave forms to begin with and post process them. the very word "rompler" implies sample playback rather then synthesizing timbres from scratch.

That is not at all what we are looking at here, we are looking at synthesizers that start with simple underlying waveforms (sine, sawtooth, square, etc), that are sampled from the original hardware rather then created algorithmically; which then feed through all the same filtering and modulation capabilities of the original synth. To call this a "rompler" is disingenuous and inaccurate to the historical meaning of the word. Its still coming down to filtering and modulating those simple waveforms into more complex sound using all the same techniques that are used with the original analog synths.

I'm not really sure why you feel you need to discredit the product as something inferior to your favorite softsynths, and you can certainly choose not to use them...and it very well may turn out to be that they are not full recreations..we shall see...but to call them "romplers" is simply not true.

[ghettosynth]

romplers typically start with more complex wave forms and provide extremely simplistic ability to "synthesize" timbres beyond what is in the base sample. They are sample playback machines with very minimal post processing on the sample. Some romplers can provide more enhanced processing, V.A.S.T comes to mind ..but the whole approach is to start with more complex wave forms to begin with and post process them. the very word "rompler" implies sample playback rather then synthesizing timbres from scratch.

Virtually ALL romplers include both complex waveforms and basic waveforms. However, like this product, the simple waveforms are generally not single cycle. So even when you have, e.g., "Moog Sawtooth", for all intents and purposes it's a complex waveform in the rompler sense.

That is not at all what we are looking at here, we are looking at synthesizers that start with simple underlying waveforms (sine, sawtooth, square, etc), that are sampled from the original hardware rather then created algorithmically; which then feed through all the same filtering and modulation capabilities of the original synth.

Nope, that is EXACTLY what we are looking at here! You are looking at complex waveforms being played through a generic rompler engine. They are NOT being "fed through all the same filtering and modulation capabilities of the original synth." All of the playback controls are identical. The original TB303 did not have complex envelopes. That simple sampletank engine is NOTHING like the A6 architecture.

To call this a "rompler" is disingenuous and inaccurate to the historical meaning of the word. Its still coming down to filtering and modulating those simple waveforms into more complex sound using all the same techniques that are used with the original analog synths.

No, to call it a rompler is accurate. If you actually understood the limitations of technology you wouldn't have to read the thread. You've clearly only read the hype. This is basically a sampletank engine with some "modeled filters" and "drift", which is essentially one or more lfos.

I'm not really sure why you feel you need to discredit the product as something inferior to your favorite softsynths, and you can certainly choose not to use them...and it very well may turn out to be that they are not full recreations..we shall see...but to call them "romplers" is simply not true.

I'm not discrediting anything, I am calling it what it is, it is a rompler. It IS inferior to my favorite synths as a "synthesizer", that is a fact. I'm not sure why you feel compelled to give more credit than is due to this product. It's a set of analog samples and a modified/updated sampletank engine. All of the samples are played back through the SAME engine. It is nothing like an accurate model of, really, any of the synths in question. To the best of my knowledge NONE of them have that exact architecture.

[Dewdman42]

where do you get your information that its the "sampletank" engine?

[ghettosynth]

where do you get your information that its the "sampletank" engine?

Dude! For f**ks sake, read the god damned thread already.

[Dewdman42]

no interest too. Looking forward to a great product from IK...

[ghettosynth]

no interest too. Looking forward to a great product from IK...

Then stop arguing, all of your absurd questions and assertions have been correctly addressed in this thread. IK is backporting the filters to sampletank so that it can load the patches from this product. What the f**k else do you need to know?

If you want to live in a hype fantasy, that's your thing, you can fantasize about the emperor's shiny clothes to your heart's content. However, all of the information that you need to burst your fantasy that this is anything more than a basic rompler ala sampletank, albeit, with different filters, is right here in this thread.

So, don't say that you're interested in talking about it as if your limited technical understanding makes sense and then say that you're not interested in reading the very language that will make you realize how incorrect you are, all in the same breath that you're questioning someone else's credibility? It's pretty clear that you don't want your fantasy punctured with a triple dose of truth.

[Dewdman42]

yes sir!

[wagtunes]

where do you get your information that its the "sampletank" engine?

Dewd, Ghetto can be a little too straight forward for some folks so let me take a stab at this.

Somewhere in this thread, Peter from 1K mentioned that Sampletank would have to be modified in order to accommodate this "synth." Thus, it is implied that you're using the Sampletank engine to utilize this product. That in itself makes it more of a sample playback unit than an actual "full featured" synth. I'm stressing the "full featured" part. Many Romplers are simple synths, but nothing more. They don't go into the number crunching that synths do because they're using samples that are essentially static. Again, please read my post about the osc sync. And the way you can tell that there is no true osc sync is simply by looking at the controls for each synth. There is no osc sync control. You can clearly see this by inspecting the synth yourself.

Nobody is trying to take away your enjoyment of using this product. I have no doubt, given that you can combine samples from multiple synths, that you can get some interesting sounds out of this product. Listening to the A6, I was impressed. But you're not going to be able to get every single nuance out of this synth as you would a real A6 because it simply does not have all the controls. It will be limited to some extent. How limited? I don't know. And the only way you're going to know is by getting your hands in an A6 and getting your hands on this product. Then you will see the difference and then you will understand why people are talking about.

I think the product sounds fine. But architecture wise, for me anyway, it isn't much different from something like HALion SE, which sounds great. But it's not a synth. Correction. It's not a full featured synth. When you can't make every conceivable sound that the synth in question can make with your emulation, then the emulation, for all practical purposes is a rompler. For this product to be a true synth, it would cost a lot more and will have taken a lot more time to develop.

And the only reason I have no interest in the product has nothing to do with the way it sounds but everything to do with the fact that there is little to no programming involved, thus making this pointless in terms of my business. Given I already have all the sound generation stuff I need to make music, there's no need for me to get this for personal use.

YMMV.

[Dewdman42]

Then why are you on this thread? What I see are analog synth snobs with rain clouds over their heads. Why don't you wait until people have it in their hands?

Its pretty clear to me these are not authentic and complete emulations of the original synths, nor would I expect them to be for $69. I think its also disingenuous to label them as "romplers". Its a "synthesizer". probably more simple then most of the synths it is claiming to mimic, ok. But a simple rompler it is not. I can see that there will be some things it can't do, perhaps due to lack of sync for example, though Peter says they have sampled every conceivable combination of oscillator usage, so we shall see...but anyway I also suspect that some types of modulation will not be as interactive as a real analog synth emulation might be, in terms of things that change over time and stuff like that. Perhaps.

On the other hand, this will also provide some sonic combinations that are NOT possible on Diva, Zebra or any other of your favorite Fake Analogs because you can mix and match a lot of stuff..you can mix and match the oscillator samples (of which there are apparently a vast collection of oscillation samples), the filters, etc..and come up with who knows what..maybe cool stuff. Synthesized stuff.

Just because they are updating the sampletank engine to support playback of syntronik presets does not at all mean that this is nothing other but a sampletank library. That is a presumption being made by some here it would seem. Who knows what they are adding to sampletank under the covers to support playing these sounds?

All I'm saying is, ok..its not Diva. GET OVER IT! It could very well prove to be a monster sound machine, even for some of the snobs posting on this thread.

[Terrafractyl]

What gets my boat (and I think a lot of other peopls) is the marketing. Nothing more.

If they want to ship a bunch of samples with a GUI that's fine by me, it might even sound fantastic. Fine, no problem.

When they start talking about 'cutting edge virtual synthesizers with exclusive DRIFT technology'... well its understandable that a bunch of people passionate about synthesizers might initially be like wtf? and then realize what it actually is, and then take offence.

[wagtunes]

Then why are you on this thread? What I see are analog synth snobs with rain clouds over their heads. Why don't you wait until people have it in their hands?

Its pretty clear to me these are not authentic and complete emulations of the original synths, nor would I expect them to be for $69. I think its also disingenuous to label them as "romplers". Its a "synthesizer". probably more simple then most of the synths it is claiming to mimic, ok. But a simple rompler it is not. I can see that there will be some things it can't do, perhaps due to lack of sync for example, though Peter says they have sampled every conceivable combination of oscillator usage, so we shall see...but anyway I also suspect that some types of modulation will not be as interactive as a real analog synth emulation might be, in terms of things that change over time and stuff like that. Perhaps.

On the other hand, this will also provide some sonic combinations that are NOT possible on Diva, Zebra or any other of your favorite Fake Analogs because you can mix and match a lot of stuff..you can mix and match the oscillator samples (of which there are apparently a vast collection of oscillation samples), the filters, etc..and come up with who knows what..maybe cool stuff. Synthesized stuff.

Just because they are updating the sampletank engine to support playback of syntronik presets does not at all mean that this is nothing other but a sampletank library. That is a presumption being made by some here it would seem. Who knows what they are adding to sampletank under the covers to support playing these sounds?

All I'm saying is, ok..its not Diva. GET OVER IT! It could very well prove to be a monster sound machine, even for some of the snobs posting on this thread.

I assure you I'm not an analog snob. I make just as much music with sample libraries and non synth sound generation as I do with synths. Maybe more. In fact, lately, I've been doing a lot of songs using guitar libraries, MODO Bass, drum libraries, organ simulations, Mellotron simulations and tons of orchestral libraries. In fact, I could probably get rid of 90% of the synths I own and not miss them.

None of that has anything to do with what I'm saying. As I said, I listened to this product and it sounds great. It's simply not a full featured synth. Whether or not that's even going to matter will depend on how people use it and what they expect to get out of it.

That's all I'm saying. Nothing more. Nothing less.

[Dewdman42]

except that a lot of what I'm reading is nothing other then disgruntled speculation. I think what is driving them crazy is that their sacred analog synthesizers are being represented, by something which is not a faithful, authentic and compete emulation of the original synthesizers. It is rather its own beast...with its own approach to synthesis, which happens to use a lot of sampled oscillator combinations from a collection of famous synths for the starting point. The DRIFT and so forth has been added to warm up those. It captures the spirit of the originals, in a different way that perhaps doesn't provide the ability to program certain things the originals can, yet also provides new possibilities that the originals can't.

To call it a "bunch of samples with a GUI", is yet another disingenuous description of the product. Would you call omnisphere a bunch of samples with GUI? I sure hope not, I sure do not. Nor do I consider that a "rompler", but I imagine some here might for some religious notion about what narrow definition of "synthesis" is to them.

[wagtunes]

except that a lot of what I'm reading is nothing other then disgruntled speculation. I think what is driving them crazy is that their sacred analog synthesizers are being represented, by something which is not a faithful, authentic and compete emulation of the original synthesizers. It is rather its own beast...with its own approach to synthesis, which happens to use a lot of sampled oscillator combinations from a collection of famous synths for the starting point. The DRIFT and so forth has been added to warm up those. It captures the spirit of the originals, in a different way that perhaps doesn't provide the ability to program certain things the originals can, yet also provides new possibilities that the originals can't.

To call it a "bunch of samples with a GUI", is yet another disingenuous description of the product. Would you call omnisphere a bunch of samples with GUI? I sure hope not, I sure do not. Nor do I consider that a "rompler", but I imagine some here might for some religious notion about what narrow definition of "synthesis" is to them.

Omnsiphere is an odd animal. Were it not for the extensive synthesis engine, it WOULD be a rompler. But it has modulation options out the wazoo and can do things that a lot of synths can't do.

Syntrax, or whatever this thing is called, it no Omnisphere. It can't be. Not at $69 like you yourself said. I mean how much synth are you getting for $69 when the product is emulating I don't even know how many synths. It's a lot. A ton.

I mean think about it logically from a development standpoint. You can't sell a dozen or so "synths" for this kind of money unless a lot of corners were cut doing it. From a business standpoint it would make no sense. Or U-he would sell Zebra 2 for $29.

There is an old saying that, in my almost 60 years on this planet I have found to be painfully true.

You get what you pay for. And sometimes, not even that much.

We'll see just how much synth this product is when it comes out.

[Terrafractyl]

To call it a "bunch of samples with a GUI", is yet another disingenuous description of the product. Would you call omnisphere a bunch of samples with GUI? I sure hope not, I sure do not. Nor do I consider that a "rompler", but I imagine some here might for some religious notion about what narrow definition of "synthesis" is to them.

LOLOLOL. To compare this product with Omnisphere is just laughable. I still think my description of this product is closer to the truth than IKM's.