EDIT : This topic is made to speak about your hearing : do you have hearing loss, how bad ? And how do you deal with it ?
Hi ! I am not a sound engineer, but a music passionate.
I would like to get great sounding mixes (by great I mean something that can be published).
I made an audiogramme, by curiosity, here is what I get :
http://www.noelshack.com/2017-28-7-1500 ... gramme.png
Each graph = one of my ears.
Thanks.
By the way, I heard of someone saying that he had a 100% flat audiogramme (0% of hearing loss), is it possible to get it ? Or it was a liar ?
What about your hearing ? And how do you deal with it ?
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- KVRAF
- 16840 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
These questions should be answered by the audiologist. It's his/her profession. So go back there and demand the graphs explained.
What I see there is only 5 octaves measured while our hearing goes from 20Hz to 20kHz spanning 10 octaves.
But whatever graph, it says nothing at all. Once you get over 40 the upper frequency you hear lowers to 16kHz instead of 20kHz, later it becomes 14kHz, then 12, 8... we all go deaf with age. Mozart still composed while being completely deaf.
I know of a legendary mixing engineer who was complete deaf at one ear. He made the mix and let an assistant do the stereo panning placement. By the way, I would advice any hobby producer to let the mastering do by a professional. And get reviews first from people you trust.
What I also see here (not in the graphs but in your posts) is a huge amount of insecurity. You think there are numerous reasons why you cannot do what you dream to do. Limits of your gear, limits of your hearing. Maybe there's serious limits to your skills. But don't let that stop you. We call this learning. Try things, fail and then do it a little bit better each time. It might take years, but as long as there's progress: do not give up!
What I see there is only 5 octaves measured while our hearing goes from 20Hz to 20kHz spanning 10 octaves.
But whatever graph, it says nothing at all. Once you get over 40 the upper frequency you hear lowers to 16kHz instead of 20kHz, later it becomes 14kHz, then 12, 8... we all go deaf with age. Mozart still composed while being completely deaf.
I know of a legendary mixing engineer who was complete deaf at one ear. He made the mix and let an assistant do the stereo panning placement. By the way, I would advice any hobby producer to let the mastering do by a professional. And get reviews first from people you trust.
What I also see here (not in the graphs but in your posts) is a huge amount of insecurity. You think there are numerous reasons why you cannot do what you dream to do. Limits of your gear, limits of your hearing. Maybe there's serious limits to your skills. But don't let that stop you. We call this learning. Try things, fail and then do it a little bit better each time. It might take years, but as long as there's progress: do not give up!
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated. 
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- KVRAF
- 16840 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
Short / rephrased answer:
If your aim is perfection: no one will succeed.
If your aim is to have fun: tons of fun is guaranteed!
If your aim is perfection: no one will succeed.
If your aim is to have fun: tons of fun is guaranteed!
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- KVRian
- 513 posts since 22 Sep, 2015
search for flecher- munson curves
your hearing changes depending on the volume of the sound.
your hearing changes depending on the volume of the sound.
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- KVRAF
- 7412 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
I've not looked at the graphs. When I had a high street hearing test, it was pretty useless (i.e. didn't even attempt to find the limits of my hearing, so couldn't be used to determine if these changed over time). It was aimed at selling hearing aids. After having had to go to my GP to get my ears de-waxed (nice pressure wash, felt great), I now regularly use Otex Express to keep 'em clean.
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- KVRist
- 159 posts since 2 Feb, 2017
Been stone deaf in one ear for 40-odd years. Now have fairly bad tinnitus, which not being directly related to actual hearing is the only thing I can hear in both ears! I'm also old enough that nothing over about 10KHz gets through.
None of that has stopped me playing music and making my own. But it does mean I don't publish (even in an amateur sort of way) anything I've produced until it's been checked and stereoized by someone with two ears and better HF response.
Steve
None of that has stopped me playing music and making my own. But it does mean I don't publish (even in an amateur sort of way) anything I've produced until it's been checked and stereoized by someone with two ears and better HF response.
Steve
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- KVRAF
- 16840 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
I suffer from some mild tinnitus, which is the result of rehearsing three hours a week with my rock band (amps at eleven) for 20 years or so. Also I hold a phone in my left hand. Not because I write with my right hand, but because my left ear hears somewhat better than my right ear.
Does that all matter for a producer? I think it doesn't. Ofcourse being stone deaf does hinder your abilities. But for the rest it's just another slightly blurring factor, just like a DA-converter with non-optimal filters, speakers with a limited frequency response and being in a non-ideal room for listening. The world (including your own ears) is not perfect and it does not need to be. Because your brain will compensate for discrepancies anyway.
After some hours of producing you need to take a break, or put on some commercial music. It's always good to have some reference tracks. To reset the compensation mechanism of your brain, have a listen again with fresh ears.
And what matters most is not the technical side of hearing (what are the frequency limits, what is the softest sound you can distinguish of a given frequency) but what you do with what you hear. Can you truely listen, process what you hear and make judgements based on the gathered information in your head. To make sense of the wall of sound, and what you want to change in that as the producer. Because these are the true listening skills you need. All the rest will be compensated for.
Same with hearing... By the definition 0 dB SPL is absolute silence. For the average person. There is a category of people that can hear sounds of -5 dB SPL. So their hearing is better than average and thus they should get a score above 100%.
Is it possible to have perfect hearing? Sure! Everybody (with some exceptions) is born with 100% or better ears. With age and visits to the disco it only gets worse...
Does that all matter for a producer? I think it doesn't. Ofcourse being stone deaf does hinder your abilities. But for the rest it's just another slightly blurring factor, just like a DA-converter with non-optimal filters, speakers with a limited frequency response and being in a non-ideal room for listening. The world (including your own ears) is not perfect and it does not need to be. Because your brain will compensate for discrepancies anyway.
After some hours of producing you need to take a break, or put on some commercial music. It's always good to have some reference tracks. To reset the compensation mechanism of your brain, have a listen again with fresh ears.
And what matters most is not the technical side of hearing (what are the frequency limits, what is the softest sound you can distinguish of a given frequency) but what you do with what you hear. Can you truely listen, process what you hear and make judgements based on the gathered information in your head. To make sense of the wall of sound, and what you want to change in that as the producer. Because these are the true listening skills you need. All the rest will be compensated for.
When I last checked my eyes I got a score of 125% while 100% supposedly was already "perfect". Because I could read one more row of letters, so my eyes are somewhat better than what an average person would be able to see.NotreDame wrote:By the way, I heard of someone saying that he had a 100% flat audiogramme (0% of hearing loss), is it possible to get it ? Or it was a liar ?
Same with hearing... By the definition 0 dB SPL is absolute silence. For the average person. There is a category of people that can hear sounds of -5 dB SPL. So their hearing is better than average and thus they should get a score above 100%.
Is it possible to have perfect hearing? Sure! Everybody (with some exceptions) is born with 100% or better ears. With age and visits to the disco it only gets worse...
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- KVRAF
- 35684 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
Frankly, i rather think most tinnitus' rather have to do with a shortage of circulation in the middle ear, than with too much noise. At least, it's surely the case in my case. Literally everyone in my family also suffers from tinnitus. Rather an inheritance thing, at least here.
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- KVRist
- 159 posts since 2 Feb, 2017
Since my tinnitus started after a long time playing loud bass and driving noisy race cars and was specifically kicked off by a day standing beside a race track with some VERY VERY loud classic cars going round...I'm going for loud noises damaging the hearing.
Steve
Steve
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- KVRAF
- 35684 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
Ok, there's probably multiple reasons, which could be cause of it. I'm pretty sure smoking makes you more prone to get tinnitus too. e.g., because it is generally bad for blood circulation.