Soundspot Oracle

[jens]

By that logic, the 71 Ford Pinto wasn't a bad car, it simply forced you to be creative to overcome its immolation feature.

That is a veeery inadequate analogy. A more adequate analogy would be the type of vehicle: there is not a bad one. You can not use a plane instead of a bicycle - and vice versa - yet both are nonetheless very useful (and widely used) vehicles.

[jens]

We all compare reverbs and have expectations about what good reverbs sound like.

O'rly?

That's clearly nonsense. If you want a spring reverb, a 480L won't do - and if you want a (real) Plate reverb, none of those two is any good and neither a TC 6000 would be the best choice... and so forth...

[Gamma-UT]

That is a veeery inadequate analogy. A more adequate analogy would be the type of vehicle: there is not a bad one. You can not use a plane instead of a bicycle - and vice versa - yet both are nonetheless very useful (and widely used) vehicles.

You are confusing categories with implementations. This is a thread about the problems of an implementation.

A bike that can't engage most of its gears is less useful than a bike with a full working complement. Someone might attempt to use it as a fixie, but it's still not going to even work all that well as a true fixie.

[MogwaiBoy]

To be fair I think Softube 'TSAR-1R' is also very metallic and sometimes grainy... and it sounds great on electronic percussion.

[jens]

That is a veeery inadequate analogy. A more adequate analogy would be the type of vehicle: there is not a bad one. You can not use a plane instead of a bicycle - and vice versa - yet both are nonetheless very useful (and widely used) vehicles.

You are confusing categories with implementations. This is a thread about the problems of an implementation.

A bike that can't engage most of its gears is less useful than a bike with a full working complement. Someone might attempt to use it as a fixie, but it's still not going to even work all that well as a true fixie.

No, I am not confusing anything - to me it really looks like you are, though.

The bike where most of the gears don't work would be comparable to a buggy plugin where functions do not work (i.e. e.g. button and knobs that do nothing), which - as fas as I can see - is neither the case here nor has it been part of the criticism regarding Oracle which has been voiced in this thread.

[ghettosynth]

We all compare reverbs and have expectations about what good reverbs sound like.

O'rly?

That's clearly nonsense.

No, it's not "clearly nonsense." You clearly didn't get the point.

If you want a spring reverb, a 480L won't do - and if you want a (real) Plate reverb, none of those two is any good and neither a TC 6000 would be the best choice... and so forth...

Of course, however, the assertion that all reverbs are good is counter to exactly the kinds of comparisons that we make all of the time. You are doing it now, you are talking about if you want a 480, you didn't ask if one wanted a DSP-256. For certain types of reverbs there are good and bad implementations.

I didn't flesh out the argument more precisely because I didn't feel that it was necessary. I bet that if I look hard enough I can find a comment from virtually everyone in this thread comparing reverbs and saying something to the effect of "to accomplish Z, X is better than Y."

Even to say if you want a 480 contains a lot of implied preference. The 480 isn't a "type" of reverb, it's simply an embodiment of a collection of reverb algorithms. In essence, your statement is loaded with value judgement which is exactly what I'm saying that we all do.

Comparing algorithmic reverbs, it's pretty easy to assert that the 480 and the 6000 are both better than a Digitech DSP256. Most poeple will agree with that. Most people will also agree that DSP256 is better than the DSP128.

All of these products are intended to be a type, or several types, of reverb. Beyond that, of course people are interested in the details of specific hardware/algorithms. The 480, for example, will ignite passionate discussion of which emulation does a better job. However, there is almost universal agreement that the original is a "good reverb."

Oracle is priced and marketed as if it's competitive with products like Ultraverb, Pro-R, Verb 3, R2/R4, etc. It is not. Compared to the reverbs that are in its (retail) price class, it's terrible. It's less flexible, and the sound of it's simple and single algorithm does not meet the expectations that we all have for those types of reverb.

As reverbs go, Oracle is a bad reverb. As several of us mentioned, in some ways it excels at that, so, sure, if you're looking for the sound of a bad reverb, you might want Oracle. But it's not sold like that, is it? However, trying to argue that there aren't expectations with reverb is the nonsense here. Just because you can find a use for a bad reverb doesn't mean that it's now good. That's just apologetics.

[Aloysius]

Oracle - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle
In classical antiquity, an oracle was a person or agency considered to provide wise and insightful counsel or prophetic predictions or precognition of the future, ...

As can be seen, there is plenty of wise and insightful counsel in this thread.

[Gamma-UT]

No, I am not confusing anything - to me it really looks like you are, though.

The bike where most of the gears don't work would be comparable to a buggy plugin where functions do not work (i.e. e.g. button and knobs that do nothing), which - as fas as I can see - is neither the case here nor has it been part of the criticism regarding Oracle which has been voiced in this thread.

OK, if you really want to go down that road.

Unless there's a bunch of hidden controls I've missed, the reverb section on this thing has a grand total of four controls, one of which is the wet/dry mix and another is the pre-delay. So, you have two whole knobs for tuning the reverb sound. Nothing you can do with shape or room size, diffusion, early vs late, high/low cut. Y'know, the things that let you adjust the reverb sound to suit the source or the situation. There is no functional difference between knobs that don't work and knobs that don't exist.

[BRBWaffles]

So, it's the last day of the sale, and I decided to give SoundSpot the benefit of the doubt and buy Oracle. If they're serious about improving this plugin, I'm willing to see it through. Even though I was highly critical.

[tbritton]

So, it's the last day of the sale, and I decided to give SoundSpot the benefit of the doubt and buy Oracle. If they're serious about improving this plugin, I'm willing to see it through. Even though I was highly critical.

Did likewise. I'm certain I will find uses for it in doing soundscape effects at the very least. I hope they keep working on it so it lives fully up to the promo materials.

Terry

[VariKusBrainZ]

Im going to buy Cubase in the hope it can be used as a word processor

[MogwaiBoy]

I might check my "virtual cash" on Plugin Boutique later tonight and maybe take a punt, unless the sale ends before I can do that.

[Russell Grand]

By that logic, the 71 Ford Pinto wasn't a bad car, it simply forced you to be creative to overcome its immolation feature.

That is a veeery inadequate analogy.

Agreed. It's a ridiculous analogy.

[Russell Grand]

So, it's the last day of the sale, and I decided to give SoundSpot the benefit of the doubt and buy Oracle. If they're serious about improving this plugin, I'm willing to see it through. Even though I was highly critical.

Yeah, I hope Soundspot listens to users' constructive criticisms and improves Oracle as it has the potential to be a great tool.

[BRBWaffles]

Im going to buy Cubase in the hope it can be used as a word processor

If Steinberg made a statement that they would work to include word processing in their software, it might be a logical decision if Cubase was 92% off. If you're trying to take the piss out of me, the analogy you chose doesn't go very far before it breaks down.