Multisampling an old 16-bit sample based synthesizer (Yamaha S90)

[zihlmannsven]

Hi folks!

First, i hope i`v chosen the right subforum for this topic. If not, please let me know.

I want to sample some sounds of my Yamaha S90 synthesizer and then make multisampled instruments out of it. I really like some of them and want to use them in my DAW, because i`m lacking of some instruments in there.
So the idea is to get the same 16-bit audio files which come from the output of the synthesizer.

What do you think is the best way to do that?

My ideas:
I thought perhaps it`s possible to extract the database direct from the ROM? like this i would not have the synthesized files, but rather the raw audio files. This would be really nice, because then i could process them how i want without the limitations of the instrument. If i could do that, would this be legal if i use the instruments i build only for myself (don`t share or sell)?
For the synthesized files from the instrument i`ll try to find out how many samples there are for pitch and velocity, which i could easily find out with the raw files, and then program some midi which plays the instrument so that i can record the exact sounds i need.

What`s your advice? Somebody already done something like that?

And am i right that if i record them with the same sample rate and bit depth this would be the exact same audio the instrument puts out?

Thanks a lot!

Sven

[thecontrolcentre]

I usually record every C and F# and map them in a sampler, or a rack of Simplers in Live. It gets pretty close to the original sound coming from the synth (assuming you have a clean recording path, etc). For more accuracy, sample every note (and 3 or 4 velocity layers if needed).


Legally, its fine to sample anything for your own use ... but if you want to release, sell, or give away stuff, that's different. Pretty much anything that is sample based needs permission. This can include presets from digital synths too afaik. Stick to recording analog sources, and the samples then belong to you, so you can do what you like with them. With your Yamaha, if you make your own sounds, then sample those, you should be fine if you wanted to redistribute them. But for own use, I think you can sample what you want to

[Numanoid]

2003 is not what I think about when I think old synths....

As I understand from this review, the synth came with a voice editor plugin. Can you use that to import the patches from the synth directly into your computer ?

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/yamaha-s90

[Romantique Tp]

Which DAW do you use? The Cubase Pro version of Halion Sonic SE already comes with 99% of the samples used by the Yamaha S90/Motif Classic, along with about a hundred presets using samples from newer Yamaha keyboards.

[bbaggins]

I have sampled patches from the S90's near-identical sibling, the MO8. It was time-consuming, but worth the effort because although I no longer have the MO8 I still have my favorite sounds from it.

Start by analyzing the patch by ear, figuring out how many velocity layers it has. You can usually determine that by programming a series of MIDI notes at different velocities and listening for when they make an obvious timbral change. It's not hard; most ROMplers of that era have only between 1 and 3 velocity layers, so it's not hard to tell them apart. This will let you know how many velocity layers you'll have to map.

Next step is harder: determining the sample intervals. You could sample each note, but the limited ROM on those synths necessitated far fewer samples. On my MO8 some patches consisted of a single sample stretched across the entire keyboard. The most sophisticated patch (the grand piano) appeared to sample 1 to 4 notes in a group, with the lowest and highest octaves consisting of a single sample stretched to an octave. You could record the waveforms and examine them visually for clues, but I took the lazy approach and simply sampled every fourth note.

To capture the samples, create a MIDI track that plays each note at each velocity and record the audio via the S/PDIF port. That will give you the cleanest waveform. No, there is no way to dump the samples directly from ROM. I found it easiest to record all of one velocity, then all of the next velocity, etc.

After you've recorded every pitch and velocity combination, split the recording into individual clips in your DAW, adjusting each clip to start exactly on the zero-crossing. Then export these files with sensible names, e.g. C0-64 or F#5-124 and drag them into the Kontakt map editor. Did I say this was a lot of work?