KVR Audio

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Mon Sep 04, 2017 8:00 am

Flooper wrote:Thanks, the minilogue and system1 both look good on paper, need to go check them out in person.
Any other suggestions? Bargain synths?

About the virus, how complicated is it? Intuitive and can be learnt on the go or "let's go read the manual" complicated?

The Minilogue just sounds crap tbh. It's all feature, no balls. The System 1 has design issues. There were velocity and envelope glitches that had no workaround (for me) and the software implementation is dire. Many will disagree with me, of course.

The Virus is far more capable than the Nord (I've had 3-4 of each), but there IS menu diving for quite a lot of the features, and not all of it is intuitive. Once you've learned it, it's fine....but there's not getting away from the fact that the synthesis engine is deep enough to need a few button presses for some of the functionality.

In your price range and your needs, I think the Nord 2/X is about the sweet spot.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:34 pm

Synth update:
Got the chance to play a little with the Arturia Minibrute and it's a really impressive instrument, may pick it up down the road.
I also fiddled a little with the MicroBrute, and it's really cute but compared to the MiniBrute it feels a little like a toy (the mini keys aren't helping) but overall a good synth for next to no money.

I must say i was appalled by the System 1, what the hell? slim keys and no travel distance (not that it mattered to me but it really derides the instrument IMHO), not to mention the lack of velocity and aftertouch...really? It's a shame because the Plug-Out technology looks really cool, but it feels and looks like a green toy (a very green toy), not to mention that in and of itself the synth isn't really impressive when it comes to sound IMO.

I saw online someone posting a Korg 2000b and it looks really interesting, might go and check it out if i'll have the chance.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:25 pm

If really looking for hardware with great features, great sound and great build quality (like or better than your AKAI keys), you might need to double, or rather triple, your budget. Do you want something with keys (mini or full size, and how many), or a desktop unit to play with your MIDI keyboard? Mono or poly?

There are really nice analog mono desktop units with tactile knob interfaces from Doepfer, Dreadbox, Moog and Vermona for around and under 500e. I haven't checked the VA offerings, but besides Roland stuff they tend to have less hands-on control.

If you get something with proper keys, you can always use that as controller for VSTs and sell the MPK, which expands your budget a bit... because the cheapest synths with playable amount and quality of full size keys go for around 1K if bought new. Buying second hand increases the options obviously.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:52 pm

Yeah, buying quality products with little to know compromises will always be a costly adventure, even used.
I'm leaning towards buying somethings with keys, but it's a whim, and besides - decent keys are hard to come by from my limited experience with Korg's and Roland's offerings (not that the MPK's keys are amazing, but a lot better than of most synths i tried).

I have a va, and a good one (Virus b) - still craving an analogue synth for some reason...
I'd love for it to be Poly, but that means looking for a bargain or saving up.
Korg 2000b, Ms-20 mini and the Arp Odyssey all look very appealing to me, but I've yet try any of them unfortunately.

risome · Post by **risome** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:19 pm

What about a Novation Ultranova.You ask what it sounds like. I say what does it not sound like? It is wooden and metallic and harsh and gentle and shimmery and warm and if you made up a word, like gostraquilia I would say hell, the word starts and ends with patch G127. You want synch sweeps, grunge, wavetables, string machines, bloops, borborygmus, choirs, cats,Its got it.Most underrated most excellent.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:30 pm

risome wrote:What about a Novation Ultranova.You ask what it sounds like. I say what does it not sound like? It is wooden and metallic and harsh and gentle and shimmery and warm and if you made up a word, like gostraquilia I would say hell, the word starts and ends with patch G127. You want synch sweeps, grunge, wavetables, string machines, bloops, borborygmus, choirs, cats,Its got it.Most underrated most excellent.

Perhaps, but i really don't like the layout...really,really don't like the way it looks - the Novation BS2 on the other hand is a stunner and a performer, but monophonic (and i found it to be a little boring for some reason...).

Don't get me wrong, not disrespecting the synth's abilities but the way Novation designed this synth made it an acquired taste - some will like it and some won't.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:31 pm

This made me check some more Youtube videos of the Ultranova (already watched loads of those). Meh, still not my cup of tea. Sounds like a former generation soft synth for me. Thin, no balls. IMO, the older Novation synths sounded better. To each his own.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:38 pm

chk071 wrote:This made me check some more Youtube videos of the Ultranova (already watched loads of those). Meh, still not my cup of tea. Sounds like a former generation soft synth for me. Thin, no balls. IMO, the older Novation synths sounded better. To each his own.

I must admit that i never even bothered trying it for the aforementioned reason, no point in trying an instrument that isn't aesthetically pleasing. To each his own indeed.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:51 pm

Probably irrelevant to the topic, but, if i wouldn't have to care about money, and i'd be looking for a synth which i would probably use a long, long time, i'd buy one of these: http://www.vintagesynth.com/waldorf/waldorf_q.php For me, one of the best sounding VA synths, and also one of the best options feature wise, and many knobs for hands on control. On the other hand, both Blofeld and Largo feature the Q's wavetables, and, maintenance is always an issue with such old synths, i guess.

Disclaimer: Even if i wouldn't care about money, i find the used prices for synthesizers absolutely excessive...

deastman · Post by **deastman** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:13 am

If you don't like the Minilogue, I would be looking at other poly synths in a bit higher price range. DeepMind12, Q, Sledge, Virus, Nord Lead, to name a few.

By Korg 2000b, do you mean MS-2000b, or something else? I love it for what it does, but it has a very specific thin, sharp sound to it.

I'm not a fan of the Ultranova or its relatives, but there is that too if it works for you.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:28 pm

Flooper wrote:Yeah, buying quality products with little to know compromises will always be a costly adventure, even used.
I'm leaning towards buying somethings with keys, but it's a whim, and besides - decent keys are hard to come by from my limited experience with Korg's and Roland's offerings (not that the MPK's keys are amazing, but a lot better than of most synths i tried).

I have a va, and a good one (Virus b) - still craving an analogue synth for some reason...
I'd love for it to be Poly, but that means looking for a bargain or saving up.
Korg 2000b, Ms-20 mini and the Arp Odyssey all look very appealing to me, but I've yet try any of them unfortunately.

MS-2000b is poly (4 voices) but a VA with mini keys, no aftertouch. Looks good, haven't heard it.
MS-20 mini is mono (MS=MonoSynth), no velocity or aftertouch on it's mini keys. The layout looks very inviting for sound diving.
(K)ARP Odyssey is duophonic, no velocity or aftertouch and mini keys. Quite interesting synth, also very inspiring layout. Also comes as module if you prefer to use more and bigger keys.

Only the MS-2000b would work as midi controller, the other two only send note messages afaik.

Check out the superb reviews by Sonic Lab: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 91981D0464, they go through tons of gear very thoroughly, and Nick Batt is just awesome.

The Korg Minilogue and Monologue are certainly worth a look, sexy, sweet sounding synths with rather clever modern features.

I have a Dave Smith Instruments Mopho SE, a fairly basic two-osc mono wrapped up in a premium casing with pretty much the best keys I've tried. For me, it's a great controller with a DSI analog synth built in, I didn't really like any of the pure midi controller keyboards, and this cost barely more 2nd hand (it's discontinued, was too expensive new to compete with the recent monos). There's a 4-voice version, Mopho X4, still in production, in the same high quality full metal & wood outfit. I totally get your wish of being able to play without a computer, there's a different kind of connection with the instrument. Anyway, rambling a bit here, but take your time and explore all the numerous options, there's bound to be a synth that really works for you.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:46 pm

chk071 wrote:Probably irrelevant to the topic, but, if i wouldn't have to care about money, and i'd be looking for a synth which i would probably use a long, long time, i'd buy one of these: http://www.vintagesynth.com/waldorf/waldorf_q.php For me, one of the best sounding VA synths, and also one of the best options feature wise, and many knobs for hands on control. On the other hand, both Blofeld and Largo feature the Q's wavetables, and, maintenance is always an issue with such old synths, i guess.

Disclaimer: Even if i wouldn't care about money, i find the used prices for synthesizers absolutely excessive...

Looks amazing, but to find one (in good condition) is a whole other thing.

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:53 pm

MicroQ ?
https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/waldorf-micro- ... nav=SEARCH

I've no idea what these are like. There's a rack version too. Id likely go for an X-Station or Nord Lead if I wanted a cheap poly synth. I like the Nord Modular too.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:59 pm

deastman wrote:If you don't like the Minilogue, I would be looking at other poly synths in a bit higher price range. DeepMind12, Q, Sledge, Virus, Nord Lead, to name a few.

Yup, Nord Lead 1 came to mind and Sledge 2 - Q, and DM12 are too expensive.

deastman wrote:By Korg 2000b, do you mean MS-2000b, or something else? I love it for what it does, but
it has a very specific thin, sharp sound to it.

It looks amazing, and has (according to youtube) a very distinct sound.

deastman wrote:I'm not a fan of the Ultranova or its relatives, but there is that too if it works for you.

Me neither, not my cup of tea.

Flooper · Post by **Flooper** » Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:19 pm

.jon wrote:
Flooper wrote:Yeah, buying quality products with little to know compromises will always be a costly adventure, even used.
I'm leaning towards buying somethings with keys, but it's a whim, and besides - decent keys are hard to come by from my limited experience with Korg's and Roland's offerings (not that the MPK's keys are amazing, but a lot better than of most synths i tried).

I have a va, and a good one (Virus b) - still craving an analogue synth for some reason...
I'd love for it to be Poly, but that means looking for a bargain or saving up.
Korg 2000b, Ms-20 mini and the Arp Odyssey all look very appealing to me, but I've yet try any of them unfortunately.
MS-2000b is poly (4 voices) but a VA with mini keys, no aftertouch. Looks good, haven't heard it.
MS-20 mini is mono (MS=MonoSynth), no velocity or aftertouch on it's mini keys. The layout looks very inviting for sound diving.
(K)ARP Odyssey is duophonic, no velocity or aftertouch and mini keys. Quite interesting synth, also very inspiring layout. Also comes as module if you prefer to use more and bigger keys.

Only the MS-2000b would work as midi controller, the other two only send note messages afaik.

They look decent synths, but i never liked Korg's keys - would love to find one of these and try them out.

.jon wrote:Check out the superb reviews by Sonic Lab: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 91981D0464, they go through tons of gear very thoroughly, and Nick Batt is just awesome.

Yeah, i watched almost all of them - i'm dreaming of Nick demoing a sawtooth

.jon wrote:The Korg Minilogue and Monologue are certainly worth a look, sexy, sweet sounding synths with rather clever modern features.

Look decent, shouldn't be an issue finding them - not over-enthused though.

.jon wrote:I have a Dave Smith Instruments Mopho SE, a fairly basic two-osc mono wrapped up in a premium casing with pretty much the best keys I've tried. For me, it's a great controller with a DSI analog synth built in, I didn't really like any of the pure midi controller keyboards, and this cost barely more 2nd hand (it's discontinued, was too expensive new to compete with the recent monos). There's a 4-voice version, Mopho X4, still in production, in the same high quality full metal & wood outfit. I totally get your wish of being able to play without a computer, there's a different kind of connection with the instrument. Anyway, rambling a bit here, but take your time and explore all the numerous options, there's bound to be a synth that really works for you.

No rush, btw - the mopho looks awesome!

First hardware synth