Roland Cloud

[SLiC]

The Roland Cloud is WAY more than just the plugs.

The simply remove the plug outs from the cloud, it sounds like it wouldn't make a great deal of difference in the long run if there is so much more content coming.

[PAK]

If there is no wrong or right then how come the constant whining about Roland Cloud?

There is right and wrong, though its direction depends on your own moral compass I said there is "no right and wrong" in the specific context of your own requirements, personal preferences, and what makes you feel comfortable as a person. It's not my place, nor a corporations, to dictate that to you. You should be the one who decides.

The reason people complain about Roland Cloud is that they are not giving people an option with their newest plugins. You either pay monthly or they literally refuse to sell them to you. Talk about shooting themselves in the foot.. Me: Take my money! Roland: NO! We don't want it. But, please, buy a monthly sub!

Limiting user choices like this is never a good thing. People also instinctively understand that Roland could, at any time, limit which plugins you get to own as part of your subscription, thereby attempting to "lock you in" once you are regularly using their software.

There are specific reasons the likes of MS Office and Adobe Photoshop can push a subscription. A very large amount of their user base is corporate or small business use. Even assuming you can make an income from music these days, it's more of an individual / self-employed thing. (BTW Even they offer yearly payment options.. )

In addition to this, subscriptions also tend to succeed because people rely on a tool and have invested many hours in learning it and gaining a workflow. They are already locked in. Whilst you could, eventually, come to rely on specific Roland plugins, it's never going to be the same lock in as the primary tool itself (your DAW host, in this case.)

Now add that Roland arrived late in the market, so alternatives like Diva already exist and largely cover multiple Aira offerings in a single plugin. These alternatives cost less, don't have the pay monthly requirement, and are superior in areas such as GUI and CPU management.

Right now it's hard to see where Roland think they are going. Their actions make it seem like Roland would rather sell users Roland Boutique hardware than software instruments..

[JJ_Jettflow]

If there is no wrong or right then how come the constant whining about Roland Cloud?

There is right and wrong, though its direction depends on your own moral compass I said there is "no right and wrong" in the specific context of your own requirements, personal preferences, and what makes you feel comfortable as a person. It's not my place, nor a corporations, to dictate that to you. You should be the one who decides.

The reason people complain about Roland Cloud is that they are not giving people an option with their newest plugins. You either pay monthly or they literally refuse to sell them to you. Talk about shooting themselves in the foot.. Me: Take my money! Roland: NO! We don't want it. But, please, buy a monthly sub!

Limiting user choices like this is never a good thing. People also instinctively understand that Roland could, at any time, limit which plugins you get to own as part of your subscription, thereby attempting to "lock you in" once you are regularly using their software.

There are specific reasons the likes of MS Office and Adobe Photoshop can push a subscription. A very large amount of their user base is corporate or small business use. Even assuming you can make an income from music these days, it's more of an individual / self-employed thing. (BTW Even they offer yearly payment options.. )

In addition to this, subscriptions also tend to succeed because people rely on a tool and have invested many hours in learning it and gaining a workflow. They are already locked in. Whilst you could, eventually, come to rely on specific Roland plugins, it's never going to be the same lock in as the primary tool itself (your DAW host, in this case.)

Now add that Roland arrived late in the market, so alternatives like Diva already exist and largely cover multiple Aira offerings in a single plugin. These alternatives cost less, don't have the pay monthly requirement, and are superior in areas such as GUI and CPU management.

Right now it's hard to see where Roland think they are going. Their actions make it seem like Roland would rather sell users Roland Boutique hardware than software instruments..

Like I stated before Roland is also looking into yearly payments options as well so that you have the ability to possess the plug right after payment. But like the everything else, it will be implemented in due time.

The thing is their entire catalog is going to be available...not just keyboards but drum machines, effect pedals, amps...literally 1000s of plugins. In addition, not only the Tera series will get RAINlink but the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

To each his own. I maintain a positive attitude and give Roland, an innovative and pioneering company in existence for over 40 years, the benefit of the doubt based on my personal experience with the company. The $20 for me is well worth it. And if it folds I lost a couple hundred bucks. If I counted up the cost of all the software that has gone obsolete, the money lost on RC would be a drop int he bucket.

[rod_zero]

I honestly do not see the difference if I put $20 a month away for a year to buy the plug I want or give Roland $20 month for the year...oh yeah the difference is I get to use the plug the entire year I am saving for it.

If they charged $240 for one of these plugins people would laugh at them and say no f-in way. They are no where near the overall quality of other plugins that cost considerably less.

You can buy both The Legend and RePro-1/5 for a chunk less than just 1 Roland plugin.

The only way this appears to be a decent deal is because you get all of them to use (which masks the very high cost)... but then you will be paying $20+ (They can raise the price whenever they want) per month for the next 10 years. Which makes it, in effect, a subscription.

Quality is subjective. The same as the tone. The same as the value for your money. That's all ujp to the individual to decide. Legend? Yeah, I owned it...and sold a month after I start RC. To me, IMO, the tonal character of the RC beats anything out there...including U-he (which I owned 3 products by), by miles. The only thing that hangs with the Roland stuff is Omnisphere, tonal quality-wise. So for me, $20 month to use stuff this good, is a real value. But then again, that is my opinion.

I happen to find they function fine and since I started the sub, they have reduced the CPU load, upgraded the GUI, fixed the preset save feature, fixed bugs that were causing crashes and added MIDI learn.

Whatever, you want to call it a subscription or whatever.

So much quality I can't use them because they crash Live every single time.

The GUI is shameful, the preset managing system very archaic.

The Cloud manager produces high latency in game, have to quit it Everytime I want to play.

If I didn't have a system 8 I would have not tried to make this Roland cloud thing work.

The truth is that apart from the sound the plugouts feel prehistoric, like from 1999. I don't think users should expect this BS in 2017.

[JJ_Jettflow]

So much quality I can't use them because they crash Live every single time.

The GUI is shameful, the preset managing system very archaic.

The Cloud manager produces high latency in game, have to quit it Everytime I want to play.

If I didn't have a system 8 I would have not tried to make this Roland cloud thing work.

Some of the issues you have mentioned have been addressed:
https://www.rolandcloud.com/news/perfor ... pdate_news

The truth is that apart from the sound the plugouts feel prehistoric, like from 1999. I don't think users should expect this BS in 2017.

Well to some, like myself, "the sound" is considered to be the most important feature. The other issues can be fixed but if the sound is not there, it never will be.

[kbaccki]

[...]the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

[JJ_Jettflow]

[...]the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

This is some info I found in FB:

Today, I'm announcing what I believe to be my proudest achievement. This experience has been a sacrifice as I have had to largely give up much of my composing to devote time to what will likely impact every musician worldwide for decades to come. Today, I announce #RAINLINK.
For my entire career I've made music with MIDI. MIDI is what I use to record the notation and performance of virtual instruments. MIDI is an 8-bit instrument control standard that was introduced by Roland in 1981. It is still mighty given how widely it has been adopted and it was quite powerful. MIDI changed the world of music and not just creatively. It is estimated that MIDI contributed $1 trillion to the world economy.
But today, MIDI is like having a camera that can only capture 127 colors. It really hasn't fundamentally changed since 1981 and yet the whole world is using it even as I type this. Again, if you've heard any of my scores that use virtual instruments, you've heard MIDI at work.
Now, what has been my secret project in recent times? I'm proud to say I have created RAINLINK. RAINLINK is my answer to the limits of MIDI in the context of cloud computing. And, appropriately in a nod to MIDI's legacy and co-creator, RAINLINK has been introduced by Roland at NAMM.
For one thing, I wish to be clear. RAINLINK is not a MIDI replacement. And at the same time, it is more than MIDI in ways that no one could foresee in 1981. Virtual Reality, near-field communications, cloud computing and other realities of today's technology weren't on anyone's radar then. Yet, for one reference of comparison, RAINLINK's velocity sensitivity is not 10 times, a 100x or even 1000x higher resolution than MIDI. It is over 132,000 times higher resolution than MIDI.
RAINLINK is powerful, comprehensive, extensible and capable of fulfilling dreams in music. Music with RAINLINK will change. Gone is the wobble, jitter, drop out and generally depressing playback of virtual instruments in the creative process. Now, your creativity and expression can be fully realized just as in high-fidelity audio recordings, but with the intense flexibility of full virtual control.
I have my fellow musicians and engineers at Roland Virtual Sonics to thank in this journey. I also want to thank my brother, Julian, as he is the co-creator of RAINLINK. Without his guiding vision in technology, my music wouldn't be what it is today. And, without the support of Roland, this giant step for Musiciankind would not be possible. At Roland, once again, we design the future.

[JJ_Jettflow]

[...]the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

This is some info I found in FB:

Today, I'm announcing what I believe to be my proudest achievement. This experience has been a sacrifice as I have had to largely give up much of my composing to devote time to what will likely impact every musician worldwide for decades to come. Today, I announce #RAINLINK.
For my entire career I've made music with MIDI. MIDI is what I use to record the notation and performance of virtual instruments. MIDI is an 8-bit instrument control standard that was introduced by Roland in 1981. It is still mighty given how widely it has been adopted and it was quite powerful. MIDI changed the world of music and not just creatively. It is estimated that MIDI contributed $1 trillion to the world economy.
But today, MIDI is like having a camera that can only capture 127 colors. It really hasn't fundamentally changed since 1981 and yet the whole world is using it even as I type this. Again, if you've heard any of my scores that use virtual instruments, you've heard MIDI at work.
Now, what has been my secret project in recent times? I'm proud to say I have created RAINLINK. RAINLINK is my answer to the limits of MIDI in the context of cloud computing. And, appropriately in a nod to MIDI's legacy and co-creator, RAINLINK has been introduced by Roland at NAMM.
For one thing, I wish to be clear. RAINLINK is not a MIDI replacement. And at the same time, it is more than MIDI in ways that no one could foresee in 1981. Virtual Reality, near-field communications, cloud computing and other realities of today's technology weren't on anyone's radar then. Yet, for one reference of comparison, RAINLINK's velocity sensitivity is not 10 times, a 100x or even 1000x higher resolution than MIDI. It is over 132,000 times higher resolution than MIDI.
RAINLINK is powerful, comprehensive, extensible and capable of fulfilling dreams in music. Music with RAINLINK will change. Gone is the wobble, jitter, drop out and generally depressing playback of virtual instruments in the creative process. Now, your creativity and expression can be fully realized just as in high-fidelity audio recordings, but with the intense flexibility of full virtual control.
I have my fellow musicians and engineers at Roland Virtual Sonics to thank in this journey. I also want to thank my brother, Julian, as he is the co-creator of RAINLINK. Without his guiding vision in technology, my music wouldn't be what it is today. And, without the support of Roland, this giant step for Musiciankind would not be possible. At Roland, once again, we design the future.

[JJ_Jettflow]

[...]the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

This is some info I found in FB:

Today, I'm announcing what I believe to be my proudest achievement. This experience has been a sacrifice as I have had to largely give up much of my composing to devote time to what will likely impact every musician worldwide for decades to come. Today, I announce #RAINLINK.
For my entire career I've made music with MIDI. MIDI is what I use to record the notation and performance of virtual instruments. MIDI is an 8-bit instrument control standard that was introduced by Roland in 1981. It is still mighty given how widely it has been adopted and it was quite powerful. MIDI changed the world of music and not just creatively. It is estimated that MIDI contributed $1 trillion to the world economy.
But today, MIDI is like having a camera that can only capture 127 colors. It really hasn't fundamentally changed since 1981 and yet the whole world is using it even as I type this. Again, if you've heard any of my scores that use virtual instruments, you've heard MIDI at work.
Now, what has been my secret project in recent times? I'm proud to say I have created RAINLINK. RAINLINK is my answer to the limits of MIDI in the context of cloud computing. And, appropriately in a nod to MIDI's legacy and co-creator, RAINLINK has been introduced by Roland at NAMM.
For one thing, I wish to be clear. RAINLINK is not a MIDI replacement. And at the same time, it is more than MIDI in ways that no one could foresee in 1981. Virtual Reality, near-field communications, cloud computing and other realities of today's technology weren't on anyone's radar then. Yet, for one reference of comparison, RAINLINK's velocity sensitivity is not 10 times, a 100x or even 1000x higher resolution than MIDI. It is over 132,000 times higher resolution than MIDI.
RAINLINK is powerful, comprehensive, extensible and capable of fulfilling dreams in music. Music with RAINLINK will change. Gone is the wobble, jitter, drop out and generally depressing playback of virtual instruments in the creative process. Now, your creativity and expression can be fully realized just as in high-fidelity audio recordings, but with the intense flexibility of full virtual control.
I have my fellow musicians and engineers at Roland Virtual Sonics to thank in this journey. I also want to thank my brother, Julian, as he is the co-creator of RAINLINK. Without his guiding vision in technology, my music wouldn't be what it is today. And, without the support of Roland, this giant step for Musiciankind would not be possible. At Roland, once again, we design the future.

[epiphaneia]

The thing is their entire catalog is going to be available...not just keyboards but drum machines, effect pedals, amps...literally 1000s of plugins. In addition, not only the Tera series will get RAINlink but the synths will also have access to high-resolution rendering as well.

Is there some statement by Roland I´ve missed regarding this? I´d reckon they try to avoid cutting into their hardware sales too much, that´s why there is no virtual Integra 7 (even though that should be a lot easier to program than a virtual Jupiter-4?) and I guess there won´t be one in the foreseeable future... I hope I´m wrong though... I´d be glad to "rent" that one.

[pdxindy]

Well if there is no wrong or right, then why all the constant complaining about the sub model.

Cause the subscription model is disliked by many people... for obvious and real reasons

[pdxindy]

Not agree with me, just not be continuously negative. Give credit where credit is due.

I enjoy giving credit when it is due... IMO the main purpose of Roland is to keep people on the hook and paying paying and paying. Their business model is all about planned obsolescence.

Then there was the complaint about having to be tethered to the internet 24/7 so now they have a feature where you only have to check-in once a week at a time convenient for you. Lennar Digital checks your PC every time you load up Sylenth 1 for the entire duration of the rent-to-own agreement. After that it no longer checks. Yet I do not see as complaints about that with the Lennar Digital rent-to-own deal than with the Roland, yet the Roland is now better because it is once a week; not every time lie Lennar Digital is.

For one, anyone can go out and buy Sylenth if they want to. Second, they are not also buying into a subscription model designed to be an endless revenue stream keeping people paying $20 or more per month for years to come.

[pdxindy]

For the subscription model to be a success, it has to rely on memberships and if they sell the product, it could undermine the subscription model and therefore not bring it to its full potential; which is to offer a virtual library of every product Roland ever made along with the high resolution rendering RAINlinkk and well aa Rolonad Cloud collaboration.

Glad you are finally being honest about it being a subscription model... that after bashing people for calling it that!

[JJ_Jettflow]

For the subscription model to be a success, it has to rely on memberships and if they sell the product, it could undermine the subscription model and therefore not bring it to its full potential; which is to offer a virtual library of every product Roland ever made along with the high resolution rendering RAINlinkk and well aa Rolonad Cloud collaboration.

Glad you are finally being honest about it being a subscription model... that after bashing people for calling it that!

With the benefits with the RC would provide, like thousands of plugins and high-resolution rendering, you think that is something to bash?

[rod_zero]

So much quality I can't use them because they crash Live every single time.

The GUI is shameful, the preset managing system very archaic.

The Cloud manager produces high latency in game, have to quit it Everytime I want to play.

If I didn't have a system 8 I would have not tried to make this Roland cloud thing work.

Some of the issues you have mentioned have been addressed:
https://www.rolandcloud.com/news/perfor ... pdate_news

The truth is that apart from the sound the plugouts feel prehistoric, like from 1999. I don't think users should expect this BS in 2017.

Well to some, like myself, "the sound" is considered to be the most important feature. The other issues can be fixed but if the sound is not there, it never will be.

So I went ahead and updated and there are big improvements in all the plugouts when it comes to CPU use, even the monophonic ones which introduce a flat 20% use don't increase their CPU cosnumption in a linear way when more instances are used, so I can have 3 system 100 for 23% CPU, big improvement.

The Poly ones have had their CPu consumption decreased about 10% and are much more usable, great work by roland, but still using 20% just for initiating them seems like a lot.

Another point: Roland should offer different plans, I don't care about the Tera or the anthology series, and the other sampled stuff, I just dont care for any of it. I just want the Plugouts that work with my System8.

BTW, they just added Plugout buttons to the Juno and Jupiter, that means they can now be send to the System 8 if you want two junos (for more patch memory) or maybe if you replace them with...anything new they will launch?

Gives me a little hope they will continue to develop new stuff. Personally I think Roland should look into developing plugouts of non-Roland gear, an Oberheim or Prophet emulation could be very cool.