Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

[Ingonator]

AFAIK there is no Roland hardware synth that combines a similar PCM engine, sample set and FXs as in the JV-1080 plugin.
Especially with the included FXs there seems to be a big variation along the Roland ROMplers and only the Fantom X is really similar to those in the plugin.

Roland is good at recycling its PCM engine. They've been doing that for 20 years. Just changing waveforms and FXs here and there between their synths, but since nobody really care about it they can rebrand all they want, every time.

Finally someone who get's it

Well, i got that too but i had a deeper look at the synth engines myself including checking manuals and installing some of the editors that even without having the hardware do offer checking the feature sets. This included the XV, Fantom X, Fantom G and Integra-7 editors where the Integra-7 one is a VST3 plugin.

[fmr]

I've got the data in the 1080 plugin format mapped out, apart from a 4Kish block at the end of each patch.

Basically, the 1080 plugin bin file contains some header stuff, then each patch has the following block layout:

128x
- System Common/Setup block (derived from Fantom X, not all parameters are used in the plugin)
- Patch Common
- Patch Common MFX
- Patch Common Chorus
- Patch Common Reverb
- Patch Tone Mix Table
- Patch Tone (x4, one for each of the four tones)
- Rhythm Common
- Rhythm Common MFX
- Rhythm Common Chorus
- Rhythm Common Reverb
- Rhythm Tone (x87, one for each key 21-108)
- *Unknown*

There does appear to be data in this last unknown block, as it varies in the preset patches, but I don't think it's data that is used in the plugin, as everything that appears in the plugin is pretty much accounted for. It could be remnants of the data layout from the Fantom - arpeggio data, chord data etc - there are a bunch of blocks it could be, but none of those are used in the plugin so I can likely just initialise this to default values in the conversion without problems - and the data doesn't give any useful clues to help figure out what it is (eg, names, or obvious parameter values that I can use to figure out what it is.)

Great Now, what's next? Are you already able to convert one of the XV-5080 preset banks into the plug-in, or does it still require more work before getting into it?

[beely]

Great Now, what's next? Are you already able to convert one of the XV-5080 preset banks into the plug-in, or does it still require more work before getting into it?

First step is to figure out the target format, which is more or less done (which is what I'm doing yesterday and today.)

Next step is to build the conversion tool (based on the D50 one), and figure out whatever data transformations need to be done.

As I said earlier, likely the first thing I'll do is working on importing XV-5080 patches into the plugin - the main issues here is apparently the plugin doesn't have all the 5080 FX, so I'll need to look at how to handle this.

When those conversions are working, I'll then do the 1080 syx conversions, again figuring out the various translations necessary (here, I'm helped by the 5080 can import 1080 sysex, so I can convert 1080 patches using the 5080 and see how it handles the necessary conversions. and compare with my own).

After that, I'll do the web end.

In the meantime, perhaps other folks can start gathering the various sources of 1080 patches on the net into one place... I have a load, but many were downloaded a long time ago and most now are in SVD format on a smart media card in the 5080.

[sinemotor]

Yes, I've been saying it since the beginning (many, many years ago). I called it "repackaging"

True and I really think this is deceptive. Specially when they sell you the Integra-7 for $1,500 which is in fact mostly loaded with the XV-5080 architecture and waveforms. So I'm glad they finally make a VST of this PCM engine since I think that the $240 Roland Cloud charges you for it is much more realistic compared to what it really is.

[fmr]

Great Now, what's next? Are you already able to convert one of the XV-5080 preset banks into the plug-in, or does it still require more work before getting into it?

First step is to figure out the target format, which is more or less done (which is what I'm doing yesterday and today.)

Next step is to build the conversion tool (based on the D50 one), and figure out whatever data transformations need to be done.

As I said earlier, likely the first thing I'll do is working on importing XV-5080 patches into the plugin - the main issues here is apparently the plugin doesn't have all the 5080 FX, so I'll need to look at how to handle this.

When those conversions are working, I'll then do the 1080 syx conversions, again figuring out the various translations necessary (here, I'm helped by the 5080 can import 1080 sysex, so I can convert 1080 patches using the 5080 and see how it handles the necessary conversions. and compare with my own).

After that, I'll do the web end.

In the meantime, perhaps other folks can start gathering the various sources of 1080 patches on the net into one place... I have a load, but many were downloaded a long time ago and most now are in SVD format on a smart media card in the 5080.

OK, I guess I can collaborate in that part. What format do you need? I guess it's SYX, right (I never used any PCM Roland synth except the V-Synth, which unfortunately has no software support that I'm aware, therefore, I have no idea what are the formats available out there).

[beely]

OK, I guess I can collaborate in that part. What format do you need? I guess it's SYX, right

Yep, JV-1080 patches will likely be in SYX or MIDIfile format.

There are other synths that are patch compatible though - not the JD series directly (I'd like to do a convertor for those to the XV/plugin, but it's likely complicated, not perfect, and Roland seem to have a JD plugin coming anyway so it's not really that important) - but the JV/XP synths should all be 1080 compatible, as is the 2080, and any XV patches.

But the bulk of those available online will be JV-1080 format, I'm sure.

I'll be able to export the XV-5080 presets from mine.

[beely]

It seems like *everyone* on the Roland Cloud Facebook page is asking for the JV-1080 plugin to support the expansions - so they are definitely aware of the demand for this...

[EvilDragon]

and Roland seem to have a JD plugin coming anyway so it's not really that important

THEY DO?! Which one, 800, or 990?


(990 owner here - thing is awesome!)

[beely]

and Roland seem to have a JD plugin coming anyway so it's not really that important

THEY DO?! Which one, 800, or 990?

Yes, they already said last year the JD-800 is coming (and the JV-1080, and they weren't lying on that one!)

Looking at what they did with the 1080, I'd expect a "JD-800" branded/styled plugin with the full architecture and patch compatibility with the 990. They could brand it the JD-990 but I think as far as marketing is concerned the JD-800 brand is stronger (exactly what happened with the 1080 plugin.)

They've said on their Facebook page in response to a question about expansions that a lot of cool stuff is coming in 2018, so...

(990 owner here - thing is awesome!)

Yep.

[EvilDragon]

There's quite a lot of differences between 800 and 990, though... let's see what happens.

[egbert101]

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[beely]

There's quite a lot of differences between 800 and 990, though... let's see what happens.

The 990 is based on the JD-800, with, as you know, a better sounding engine, a stereo engine and expanded waves and synthesis.

If the 1080 was *only* a 1080, I would expect a JD-800 to be *only* a JD-800 - but in light of what we have with the 1080, it's certainly more possible the forthcoming JD plugin supports both JD-800/990 patches. As you say, we'll have to see what they do...

[beely]

How many Roland synths are left? I know people are expecting 100+ synths in order to get imaginary value from the Roland cloud, but what they have pretty much covers it. Sure, an Alpha Juno and a TB-303, another TR-808 clone, we're running out of synths guys.

Off the top of my head:
Jupiter 4. VP-330. SH5/7. Jupiter 6. JX3P. JX8P/JX10. MKS80. MKS20. System 100. JD990. VP9000...

Shall I keep going..?

[EvilDragon]

I do hope they go with the 990-in-800 (and then adding all the expansion cards, haha). Let's see.


BTW, regarding the JV-1080 plugin. Choosing a waveform is a fecking chore, with all those menus. Why couldn't we get a nice browser like Korg M1 plugin has it, where you can choose waveforms by tags?!

Roland definitely needs somebody who actually knows something about proper UI/UX.

[sinemotor]

It seems like *everyone* on the Roland Cloud Facebook page is asking for the JV-1080 plugin to support the expansions - so they are definitely aware of the demand for this...

I really hope they release them. They were a big reason to invest in a JV/XV back in the days.