KVR Audio

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:53 am

Hey out there,

So help me understand something here, if I am not getting something about this - well I would surely re-align my thinking...but, hey waddaya guys think?

The VST 3 "standard", it clutters up my plug list...what is it for actually, any ideas?

I found VST 2.4 to be quite reasonable...am I just an old curmudgeon?

imrae · Post by **imrae** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:41 am

There's no real benefit at the moment except for slightly better sidechaining support from developers who didn't get it working with VST2 (including Steinberg!). Developers are expecting Cubase to drop VST2 support one day and are trying to be ready for that. Some discussion here:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=496614

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:50 am

imrae wrote:There's no real benefit at the moment except for slightly better sidechaining support from developers who didn't get it working with VST2 (including Steinberg!). Developers are expecting Cubase to drop VST2 support one day and are trying to be ready for that. Some discussion here:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=496614

Even if Cubase drops VST 2, there is still the rest of the industry, though, right?

imrae · Post by **imrae** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:07 am

Well, Pro Tools and Logic don't support VST at all and a lot of developers try to accommodate their users.

As a day-to-day Linux user I used to be disappointed that so few developers make the effort to compile their plugins to a Linux-native VST, let alone port to LADSPA. But increasingly I'm impressed with the large range of formats that they do support in this horribly fragmented plugin ecosystem.

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:23 am

Oh, golly, you are into Linux and that is a whole other thread!

I would be all over Linux if there was similar variety of software products, not to mention hardware support, as on the "main" platforms.

As for VST 3, so there is some sidechaining advantage, cool, but not enough, IMHO, for a new "standard".

nIGhT-SoN · Post by **nIGhT-SoN** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:11 am

What about the performance? I heard VST3 doesn't use cpu cycles while audio is not passing through the plugin. With other words, plugin acts as if it would be turned off if no audio is played through that specific plugin.

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:38 am

Yes, I know there are some technical improvements, but they are subtle, and you can't install where you want to, and frankly, it all kinda seems like such a put down...

Now then, I haven't used a recent version of Cubase, but I think it likely has superb plug-in management, so perhaps Steinberg thinks it is unimportant to allow users to install where they want to, since they can rearrange everything in the DAW...

Is this correct?

Reefius · Post by **Reefius** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:14 am

VST3 seems to have custom tags. In VST2 there's only instruments and effects, while VST3 plugins can have any tag.
In Cubase all my VST3 plugins are automatically sorted by category (EQ, dynamics, synths, drums, ...). That makes organizing a lot easier.

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:29 am

Reefius wrote:In Cubase all my VST3 plugins are automatically sorted by category (EQ, dynamics, synths, drums, ...). That makes organizing a lot easier.

Right, and in Studio One it is all organized too. Sure, they made it convenient for casual hobbyists, I get that.

But I like organizing my own way, and I think many other folks do as well...

Kinh · Post by **Kinh** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:41 am

Vst3 aint noth'n worth discuss'n

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:52 am

Kinh wrote:Vst3 aint noth'n worth discuss'n

If you could explain why, I would be eager and broad minded to listen...I am open to ideas, as I said in the original post...

I think we should talk about it. Technological improvements to VST 2.4 would have been the cooler thing, IMHO.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:04 pm

Grizzellda wrote:
Kinh wrote:Vst3 aint noth'n worth discuss'n
If you could explain why, I would be eager and broad minded to listen...I am open to ideas, as I said in the original post...

I think we should talk about it. Technological improvements to VST 2.4 would have been the cooler thing, IMHO.

This is kvr ....

I use Cubendo and for me indeed, the sidechaining is critical and not either 'slightly better' or 'some sidechaining advantage', for me it is night and day. The do not process audio when no sound option is nice for real time, but I suspect (haven't tested it properly) that it may have issues when rendering tracks and the cpu spikes......and most importantly Steinberg, the developers and patent owners of VST format are trying to steer the industry into that direction.

All of that being said, if indeed vst2 for you is quite reasonable... stick with it.
my 2 cents
rsp

Grizzellda · Post by **Grizzellda** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:24 pm

zvenx wrote:I use Cubendo and for me indeed, the sidechaining is critical and not either 'slightly better' or 'some sidechaining advantage', for me it is night and day.

Understand! And...thanks for expressing.

Yes, it is Steinberg's trip, I get it...but are you saying that you could not ever have done side chaining without VST3? Because with the right plugs you can, as far as I know.

Hey, I know VST3 is "here to stay" I just don't think everyone agrees it is necessary.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:27 pm

Grizzellda wrote:
zvenx wrote:I use Cubendo and for me indeed, the sidechaining is critical and not either 'slightly better' or 'some sidechaining advantage', for me it is night and day.
Understand! And...thanks for expressing.

Yes, it is Steinberg's trip, I get it...but are you saying that you could not ever have done side chaining without VST3? Because with the right plugs you can, as far as I know.

Hey, I know VST3 is "here to stay" I just don't think everyone agrees it is necessary.

There was/is a workaround, for me it was too cumbersome and not worth it.....and as a result I never used sidechaining in Cubendo before vst3.

agreed not everyone thinks it is necessary.
rsp

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:10 pm

Steinberg could have improved the sidechain implementation in their host (to how it was done in most other VST2 hosts - and still works well to this day!) as opposed to making a whole new plugin standard (which didn't catch on too well even after all these years)... Perfect example of putting the cart in front of a horse.

So, VST 3...