why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
zoogoo
KVRist
435 posts since 21 Feb, 2006

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:53 pm

EnGee wrote:Why don't you upgrade to Windows 10? I have never had such problem since I used Win 10 (the laptop was also upgraded to Windows 10 and it works perfect!). Unless, something that really stops you from the upgrade, then I believe Windows 10 would be the better choice.
the ssd i swapped out had windows 10 on it, same problem

EnGee
KVRAF
5032 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:06 pm

VariKusBrainZ wrote:Did you build it yourself?

The fact that you didnt know how to access Windows Power Management via the Control Panel reveals alot.

Do you know someone with more technical knowledge than yourself who can look at your setup.

Im betting on a BIOS setting if its not the soundcard/driver
Good advice if the OP hasn't enough experience. I would first of all reset the BIOS to its default. It is rare we need to mess with the advanced settings unless we are overclocking CPU or Memory (even this is made easy by a motherboard utility mostly).

The settings you might need to experience with the BIOS are mostly disabling some devices to see if the problem goes away, for example the network. Or even the sound card itself, taking it off or change the PCI slot (like the old days!). But my guess, if the hardware installed correctly, it is some Windows 7 driver is causing the problem.
the ssd i swapped out had windows 10 on it, same problem
It might be a motherboard problem then! Which motherboard is that MSI (I don't trust this brand because I had very bad experiences with it in the past). Anyway, I suggest if you tried everything, then it is better to see a PC technician. The most difficult thing to discover is if the motherboard has a fault somewhere.
Let's donate to help the kids and save our planet.
--------------------------------------------------------
Windows 10 & Maschine 2

pottering
KVRian
650 posts since 14 Dec, 2014

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:49 pm

Running LatencyMon may help identifying what is causing (some of) those problems.


http://www.resplendence.com/latencymon

User avatar
EvilDragon
KVRAF
17192 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:57 pm

He already did that.

pottering
KVRian
650 posts since 14 Dec, 2014

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:07 pm

Oops, sorry. I searched for "latency" and only looked at the red/pink results.

[fast edit:]

I tend to blame power supply for any mysterious system-wide problems like this, but if it is a laptop...

Googling "ataport.sys" (from a previous latencymon screenshot in this thread) actually gives a lot of results (for problems), some even mention DPC latency (also, searching for "dpc latency" instead of just "latency" can help).

example: https://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/350 ... t-sys.html

zoogoo
KVRist
435 posts since 21 Feb, 2006

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:52 pm

EnGee wrote:
VariKusBrainZ wrote:Did you build it yourself?

The fact that you didnt know how to access Windows Power Management via the Control Panel reveals alot.

Do you know someone with more technical knowledge than yourself who can look at your setup.

Im betting on a BIOS setting if its not the soundcard/driver
Good advice if the OP hasn't enough experience. I would first of all reset the BIOS to its default. It is rare we need to mess with the advanced settings unless we are overclocking CPU or Memory (even this is made easy by a motherboard utility mostly).

The settings you might need to experience with the BIOS are mostly disabling some devices to see if the problem goes away, for example the network. Or even the sound card itself, taking it off or change the PCI slot (like the old days!). But my guess, if the hardware installed correctly, it is some Windows 7 driver is causing the problem.
the ssd i swapped out had windows 10 on it, same problem
It might be a motherboard problem then! Which motherboard is that MSI (I don't trust this brand because I had very bad experiences with it in the past). Anyway, I suggest if you tried everything, then it is better to see a PC technician. The most difficult thing to discover is if the motherboard has a fault somewhere.
yes in fact it is an MSI curently im troubleshooting hardware changing. right now i swapped out the graphics card.

im about to see if that was the issue.

EnGee
KVRAF
5032 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:14 pm

Sorry, I meant which model is it? I know it's MSI because you mentioned it.
Let's donate to help the kids and save our planet.
--------------------------------------------------------
Windows 10 & Maschine 2

zoogoo
KVRist
435 posts since 21 Feb, 2006

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:15 pm

ok, im not %100 sure, but i think i fixed the problem.

This graphics card i had in it was some $30 radion dell card, which i think is culprit here. I swapped it out with a gtx 660 and tested the set up. I think the graphics card was like hogging the flow on the board or something, because i put the gtx card on top of board in a dedicated slot.

I ran 17 midi channels with 6 lfos, and some automation mapped to CYclob synth. Each also had izotope Ozone 5 this is a very intensive load) I noticed the cpu handle was good, only got to about 36%.

The pops and clicks i have not noticed yet, im still testing it. and Latencymon still gives the same error, allthough the error now is not hilighted in red and the DPC bar as you can see isnt spiking.

it doesnt make sense a graphics card could effect my DAW and audio buffer so much.

So im assuming my problems are over. a mixture of sound buffing, power management and what im assuming faulty hardware. I still dont understand completely the specifics though.

thanks, i left some pictures.
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tooneba
KVRian
1044 posts since 6 Nov, 2012

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:47 pm

M4L integration caused this problem?

zoogoo
KVRist
435 posts since 21 Feb, 2006

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:29 pm

EnGee wrote:Sorry, I meant which model is it? I know it's MSI because you mentioned it.
MSI B350 PC MATE AM4 AMD B350 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard

zoogoo
KVRist
435 posts since 21 Feb, 2006

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:30 pm

tooneba wrote:M4L integration caused this problem?
no, power,hardware, buffer

tooneba
KVRian
1044 posts since 6 Nov, 2012

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:39 pm

Then why 9 not suffered from this?

EnGee
KVRAF
5032 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:01 pm

zoogoo wrote:
EnGee wrote:Sorry, I meant which model is it? I know it's MSI because you mentioned it.
MSI B350 PC MATE AM4 AMD B350 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard
It seems a good motherboard. Very similar to mine (Asus B350 Plus).

What about your other components spec? Are the memory compatible with the motherboard? Also, although you don't need that much of watts, but it is better to have 500w and above PSU.

I think 36% usage is really a good result ;) Anyway if you don't hear any noise over a period of time, then the problem is solved :)
Keep in your future shopping list, a good audio interface to replace that dinosaur!
Let's donate to help the kids and save our planet.
--------------------------------------------------------
Windows 10 & Maschine 2

User avatar
Guenon
KVRAF
1506 posts since 17 Jun, 2005

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:14 pm

zoogoo wrote:it doesnt make sense a graphics card could effect my DAW and audio buffer so much.
It makes perfect sense :). Realtime operation in low-latency tasks like audio/music production is quite a delicate use case, heh. It's the totality of the system that counts, i.e. all the components and how they work in combination, the OS, drivers and finally other (application, plugin, tool, utility, etc.) software. It's good to know it seems you aren't being hit hard with the Live 10 CPU issue, and can instead improve this to usable levels with some component swapping and power configuration. To be honest, based on the latencymon screenshot, in its current state the system is still far from optimal, though, and basically you are still paying for parts that can't be used to their full potential in the intended use, as the system as a whole bottlenecks in realtime operations far before the system would run out of steam otherwise.

User avatar
Guenon
KVRAF
1506 posts since 17 Jun, 2005

Re: why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.

Post Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:27 pm

So for example, I would be surprised if this five and a half year old i7 system wouldn't run more demanding low-latency projects:

Image

It's not about the numerical specs of the machine alone. Raw CPU power literally cannot be fully utilized in a realtime DAW context if the system is incapable of piping stuff uninterrupted to the audio interface under load. This is also the reason why the audio interface and its drivers play a role in how performant the system is, even though it's a "dumb" output device instead of actively doing DSP calculations. When the audio interface and its drivers are the bottleneck, it's holding the rest of the system down, no matter how much CPU power there is (and no matter how everything is calculated on the CPU anyway).

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