Synapse Audio Minimoog emulation "The Legend" for VST/AU and RE released!

[fluffy_little_something]

Well, visual reality, it is not a lie detector, of course

[zerocrossing]

Wrong because of so many variables from person to person.

Hearing loss, especially in frequency ranges. For example, a harsh cymbal sound won't be interpreted the same by a person who has lost the upper frequencies as I have. That's why I have to consciously put an EQ on the upper frequencies of my cymbals out of habit because I know I'm not hearing that harshness.

Then there is how we emotionally identify with each instrument. You can't remove emotions from the equation of how we "hear" sound. We are not robots. If we were, everybody would love or hate the same songs the same way.

But again, taking emotions away, as even you yourself admitted plays a part in the "hearing" process, all our hearings are not equal. You have absolutely no idea what I hear and I have absolutely no idea what you hear. So to make a blanket statement that everybody hears things the same is just flat out wrong purely from a physiological standpoint.

Your ears and my ears are not the same.

I disagree, our ears and hearing are virtually the same, in all humans, just like our eyes and vision. (Problems such as color blindness, tinnitus etc. excluded, of course). If it were not, humans could not communicate and agree on anything. Actually, we would have died out early during out evolution.

Only the interpretation of what we all hear differs. But even that interpretation is often pretty consistent within a given culture.
To get back to topic, most people seem to agree that Legend sounds powerful. Sure, some will say it sounds thin. But when 9/10 say it sounds powerful, it does sound powerful. You know, when it walks like a duck...

I’m not sure how you can make this statement. It’s well known that our ears and eyes deteriorate throughout our lives. We mostly start off with the famous “20-20K” frequency range, but that’s some platonic ideal. If you’re an adult male, chances are you are not hearing over 15 khz. If you’ve abused your ears, it’s probably worse. Eyes too. I went though my childhood to about 25 with perfect vision, but then I noticed that my right eye was still fine, but my left eye was slightly off. Now on the precipice of 53, both eyes are borked. Not badly, but if you bring me a check in a dim restaurant that’s printed in tiny gray text, I won’t be able to read it with my regular glasses. My daughter, OTOH, can see it all perfectly. My grandmother, nearing 100, can barely see or hear. We do not see and hear the same.

Of course both hearing and vision deteriorate with age. But that is no longer normal hearing and vision.
Our entire bodies work the same way, which is what makes medicine possible in the first place. Just because some people get cancer does not mean that our bodies work differently. The normal body works how it is described in countless medical books. Only thanks to our knowledge of the normal, healthy human body can we tell when there is an illness, i.e. a departure from the way it should be.

Same with sound. I have heard many people say that the reverb in Sylenth1 sounds metallic, and I agree.
Why is that? There is a double consensus:
- we hear that the sound is not the way it should be
- we agree linguistically on the way it departs, i.e. metallic

Dude, you’re logic is broken. So, it’s normal for vision and hearing to deteriorate with age, yet older people with that deterioration are not normal? You can’t have both arguments... not unless we lived in a Logan’s Run situation.

[fluffy_little_something]

Since we live "too long" these days, I think it makes sense to assume that the poor hearing and vision of old people shouldn't be declared the norm, despite being more and more common. I am talking about the normal, ideal status typical of healthy, young people. The reference to which older people's deteriorating hearing and vision are compared. In order to stay as close as possible to that norm they will resort to tools such as hearing aids and glasses.

[v1o]

Wrong because of so many variables from person to person.

Hearing loss, especially in frequency ranges. For example, a harsh cymbal sound won't be interpreted the same by a person who has lost the upper frequencies as I have. That's why I have to consciously put an EQ on the upper frequencies of my cymbals out of habit because I know I'm not hearing that harshness.

Then there is how we emotionally identify with each instrument. You can't remove emotions from the equation of how we "hear" sound. We are not robots. If we were, everybody would love or hate the same songs the same way.

But again, taking emotions away, as even you yourself admitted plays a part in the "hearing" process, all our hearings are not equal. You have absolutely no idea what I hear and I have absolutely no idea what you hear. So to make a blanket statement that everybody hears things the same is just flat out wrong purely from a physiological standpoint.

Your ears and my ears are not the same.

I disagree, our ears and hearing are virtually the same, in all humans, just like our eyes and vision. (Problems such as color blindness, tinnitus etc. excluded, of course). If it were not, humans could not communicate and agree on anything. Actually, we would have died out early during out evolution.

Only the interpretation of what we all hear differs. But even that interpretation is often pretty consistent within a given culture.
To get back to topic, most people seem to agree that Legend sounds powerful. Sure, some will say it sounds thin. But when 9/10 say it sounds powerful, it does sound powerful. You know, when it walks like a duck...

Scientists don’t think humans all see colours the same. What you see as red I might see as blue, we just call them the same name because of what we learned growing up. The problem is it’s impossible to get inside another humans head and see the world from their eyes.

https://www.livescience.com/21275-color ... tists.html

http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=719

[Richard_Synapse]

My hearing also varies with the time of the day, but it is not my ears that vary, it's my mind.

Synth developers actually use the assumption that we all hear more or less the same. Else Richard could not make a synth whose sound appeals to so many people. While developing and testing he assumes that the vast majority will hear what he hears. If he likes what he hears, so will we.

That's true for most stuff we do, but when it comes to analog emulations, we do quite a few measurements as well. For example, if we compare two harmonic spectra (sw/hw) and they match down to a fraction of a decibel, then they simply sound the same, regardless of how good or bad anyone's hearing is.

Furthermore, it requires several people to listen and a/b compare, one dev is not nearly enough. We did The Legend in collab with Bigtone and still work with them, this has proven to be extremely valuable. Without them we would have missed out on at least half of the critical details. The downside in our approach is simply that it takes ages to get an emulation to a level where noone involved can hear a difference anymore.

Richard

[fluffy_little_something]

Scientists don’t think humans all see colours the same. What you see as red I might see as blue, we just call them the same name because of what we learned growing up. The problem is it’s impossible to get inside another humans head and see the world from their eyes.

https://www.livescience.com/21275-color ... tists.html

http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=719

I mean it like it is explained in answer 4 of your second link:
http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=719

Colors are defined by wavelengths, and when there is an apple that reflects red light, that is what everyone sees, no matter what they call that color or what it actually "looks like" in their heads.
Obviously the human mind is rather imaginative and converts something as simple as light of a certain wavelength into a concept of color. Add to that all the emotional associations.
One problem in this discussion is that color can mean different things, in the other link for instance it is used both for the perception of wavelengths (what we think we see and refer to with words) and for the wavelengths themselves, i.e. the merely physical definitions.

With hearing things are a bit simpler, I think. For instance, what aspect of sound would people with defect hearing confuse or ignore (like color blind people do)?

[wagtunes]

Scientists don’t think humans all see colours the same. What you see as red I might see as blue, we just call them the same name because of what we learned growing up. The problem is it’s impossible to get inside another humans head and see the world from their eyes.

https://www.livescience.com/21275-color ... tists.html

http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=719

I mean it like it is explained in answer 4 of your second link:
http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=719

Colors are defined by wavelengths, and when there is an apple that reflects red light, that is what everyone sees, no matter what they call that color or what it actually "looks like" in their heads.
Obviously the human mind is rather imaginative and converts something as simple as light of a certain wavelength into a concept of color. Add to that all the emotional associations.
One problem in this discussion is that color can mean different things, in the other link for instance it is used both for the perception of wavelengths (what we think we see and refer to with words) and for the wavelengths themselves, i.e. the merely physical definitions.

With hearing things are a bit simpler, I think. For instance, what aspect of sound would people with defect hearing confuse or ignore (like color blind people do)?

The most common is upper frequencies because that's the first thing to go. So when I did this one song and somebody said to me "Dude, the cymbals are way too harsh and need to be EQ'd" I didn't hear it because I don't hear upper frequencies. So now I have to make a conscientious effort to simply EQ cymbals even though I can't hear how harsh they are.

None of that, of course, has anything to do with whether or not somebody likes the harsh sound of cymbals.

[nichttuntun]

https://knowledgenuts.com/2016/03/31/wh ... fferently/

..."it has at least something to do with the way our skulls are shaped, and the variations in individual bone structures likely has something to do with why we hear the same noise in a slightly different way".

Saying we all hear the same is like saying we can all run the same speed because we all have legs.

Anyway WTF does this have to with The Legend ?

Oh now I've gone and done it.....I've joined the loony bin.......

Now you know how I feel.

No One ever will have the slightes chances to know that. I think that position became clear in the discussion

[Mutant]

Can we please stop the human perception offtopic now ?

Back to The Legend.

[nichttuntun]

Can we please stop the human perception offtopic now ?

Back to The Legend.

Yes yes. It's possible. Please do go on

Beside that off-topic discussion. Maybe some get a feeling now for how obsolete some general discussions about "better than...xyz" and the likes are. It could help to keep threads in KVR a tiny little more direct to the topic in the future.

[v1o]

Can we please stop the human perception offtopic now ?

Back to The Legend.

[Mutant]

Very nice.

[EvilDragon]

Now THAT is what I call proper return to the topic.

[Yorrrrrr]

Legend sounds incredible, can't wait for Synapse's Oberheim (OB-Xa) emulation.

[Examigan]

Legend sounds incredible, can't wait for Synapse's Oberheim (OB-Xa) emulation.

Are they really working on that? If so, is there an ETA?