IK MUltimedia UNO Synth

[ghettosynth]

I also wonder about the quality. It is rather cheap for a synth made in the EU. Behringer stuff is made in a huge factory in Asia, if I am not mistaken. Otherwise it would probably cost 1.5 to 2 times as much.
Are the components (filter etc.) bought from the usual suppliers or made by IKM?
Just out of curiosity, where in Italy is the factory and how many employees does it have?

Sorry I missed this one for a bit... We source or build parts ourselves based on the feasibility of doing it either way, as would be expected.

To correct fluffy's bad assumption here though, the "filter" is rarely a "component" in a modern synth and I doubt very seriously that IK has the resources to manufacturer ICs. I'm still betting on the filter being based on the LM13700 OTA which, at one point was a National Semiconductor part, not sure who's making them now.

Other than Behringer making use of the remanufactured CEM parts and SCI using the PA397 the tendency these days is not to use the "synth module on a chip" parts that were so prevalent in the 80s. This is good, it allows for more variety and is also better in terms of future obsolescence and modification. The synth modules, such as they are, are almost certainly discrete, but not in the sense of "not using ICs", but rather, constructed with, more or less, off the shelf OTAs, OpAmps, etc.

IIRC, IK partnered with soundmachines who did the analog design. I assume that's these guys, which makes sense, as they are also an Italian company.

https://www.sound-machines.it/

Eventually someone will do a tear down video/pictures of this and then we can get a better idea of what's inside.

As far as China not being a reliable OEM, this is just old news and prejudice. It's not really unlike Japan in the 60s. Low build quality with this type of product doesn't really have much to do with the active electronics components either.

https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/in ... 481605.ece

[BONES]

Absolutely, and for whoever was comparing it to the Rocket, GTFOH, I can't stand IK's marketing, AND, I think that they really missed the boat to not have at least OSC sync, but, for what it does do, the UNO sounds great.

If anyone needs to GTFOH, it's any idiot who thinks he can tell how good a synth sounds from a few YouTube videos.

@BONES - Yeah, but look at the spec and it only costs $199

2 x continuously variable VCOs both with saw/tri/pulse + separate white noise + LP/BP/HP 2 pole resonant filter with drive + 2 x full ADSR (filt env routable to waveshape/pwm according to Erik) + 7 shape multi-target LFO (inc down ramp and S&H - independently routable to each VCO shape according to Erik) + 10 pattern Arp + 16 step x 20 parameter sequencer + delay

My point, precisely. There is nothing in there to indicate it will do anything at all beyond the bog-standard basics with a few minor variations. How can you fail to see that? There is no osc sync, no FM, no Ring Mod, none of the things that normally make a two osc synth so much better than a single osc one. Even Behringer's SH-101 clone manages to fit FM into it's single VCO synth.

You can get as wide a palette of sounds from the UNO as just about any classic 2 oscillator analog synth....probably more with the continuously variable wave shape and 20 P locks....there are always limitations on analog synths, limited LFOs on moogs for examples, simple second oscillators on Juno’s...people manage...

Absolute BS. Every other two osc synth that ever made any impact in the world had cross-mod between the oscillators, which is why people looked for two osc synths. This can't do hard sync, it can't do Ring Mod and it's can't do FM, where literally hundreds, probably thousands of freeware VSTi can and any classic synth can. e.g. MiniMoog, Odyssey.

If you want a small form factor pocket synths with a good sequencer this must be towards the top of any list

Yes, and if you want a tiny plastic synth covered in a touch-sensitive membrane, this would also be at the top of your list. But it would be a pretty stupid list to make in the first place, wouldn't it?

we are blessed with many other good alternatives that may suit YOU more, but that doesn’t diminish how good the UNO is for the cost, I could make a list of why the synth you have chosen that costs more is far more limited than the UNO, but what’s the point? Make music, be happy

No you couldn't. You can't tell me one way in which this is better than a second-hand K Station, for example, and for every con you could list for a Waldorf Rocket, I could list two pros.

If this was a VSTI, there would be zero interest in it and everyone would say it was overpriced if it was $49.

except for a used waldorf rocket according to the-great-synth-arbiter

Something which you are yet to dispute, I notice. You see, I actually know what I'm talking about, as I own a Rocket and I've heard all the exact same UNO demos as you have. But let's not allow facts to get in the way, shall we?

Just to be clear, I really like what I've heard in these demos and unless it turns out to be poorly made or if it doesn't sound as good in person as it is in the videos, I will probably buy one. But I don't for a minute think it's going to be much use beyond a few basic, bread and butter sounds. e.g. Anything without PWM sounds a bit thin and weak, so I reckon I'll always be PWMing the hell out of it and I can't imagine ever using it for a lead part. As an Analog Keys owner, I think the parameter locks thing is mostly a bit of a gimmick - I don't need to put a kick on one note and a snare on another - but it could have it's uses here.

Like the Rocket, it looks like it will be a lot of fun to play with, rather than a serious music making tool, and for a couple of hundred I'm fine with that. I just don't get why everyone has to talk everything they like up, well beyond its actual capabilities. At $200 it doesn't have to be versatile, it doesn't have to be the best thing ever, it just has to do one or two things well and this seems to fit that bill OK. But I'm definitely going to reserve judgement until I've played with it myself, especially in light of some of the other things that have come out of Superbooth this year.

[ghettosynth]

Absolutely, and for whoever was comparing it to the Rocket, GTFOH, I can't stand IK's marketing, AND, I think that they really missed the boat to not have at least OSC sync, but, for what it does do, the UNO sounds great.

If anyone needs to GTFOH, it's any idiot who thinks he can tell how good a synth sounds from a few YouTube videos.

The sound samples on IKs site are not youtube videos. However, this is tired old trope. We can certainly A/B synths with Youtube videos and take something away from that, well, I can, I can't speak for you. The Rocket filter does not sound as good to me and the Rocket, like most things Waldorf, is overpriced. There's not much point to comparing to used gear, that's cheating.

Look, I think that IK missed the boat by not including oscillator interaction. However, I think that you've got a bee up your bonnet about the Rocket, it's an ok synth, and yes, I've heard it in real life. I'm not chomping at the bit for a portable hardware synth, but if I were, I wouldn't choose the Rocket. I don't think that you have any objective evidence of superiority here, just your opinion and, if you haven't caught on yet, your opinion isn't particularly well respected around here.

My guess is that there's some technical reason that there's no sync beyond just cost because syncing two VCOs doesn't cost very much so it seems like a very weird thing to leave out. They've talked about autotune so that suggests that they are actual VCOs. I'm not going to buy one just to do a tear down, someone else almost certainly will and we should be able to take a good look at what's going on in there.

[samsam]

If this synth was a loaf of bread, people would say it was overpriced at 99 cents. And if it was a real rocket, nobody would fly in it. Membranes.

[ghettosynth]

If this synth was a loaf of bread, people would say it was overpriced at 99 cents. And if it was a real rocket, nobody would fly in it. Membranes.

Has anyone said that it's "overpriced?" I don't recall that. I think that the criticisms are largely falling along the lines of "even at $200 it should have certain features that seem weird to leave out."

[OneOfManyPauls]

@BONES - to be clear, you've expressed your opinion (mostly presented as fact) and I disagree with most of what you've wrote. I just don't see the point in further debating what constitutes a wide range of sound, what sounds good or bad, and my own personal preferences with you. I have no respect for your opinion and you have no respect for mine - so what's the point?

I stand by everything I've said. We have the spec and a limited pool of sample sounds. Soon enough we'll have the actual units in the wild.

[Mushy Mushy]

@BONES - to be clear, you've expressed your opinion (mostly presented as fact) and I disagree with most of what you've wrote. I just don't see the point in further debating what constitutes a wide range of sound, what sounds good or bad, and my own personal preferences with you. I have no respect for your opinion and you have no respect for mine - so what's the point?

I stand by everything I've said. We have the spec and a limited pool of sample sounds. Soon enough we'll have the actual units in the wild.

But they’re Italian so they’ll only work until lunchtime on the first day.

[SLiC]

Absolutely, and for whoever was comparing it to the Rocket, GTFOH, I can't stand IK's marketing, AND, I think that they really missed the boat to not have at least OSC sync, but, for what it does do, the UNO sounds great.

If anyone needs to GTFOH, it's any idiot who thinks he can tell how good a synth sounds from a few YouTube videos.

@BONES - Yeah, but look at the spec and it only costs $199

2 x continuously variable VCOs both with saw/tri/pulse + separate white noise + LP/BP/HP 2 pole resonant filter with drive + 2 x full ADSR (filt env routable to waveshape/pwm according to Erik) + 7 shape multi-target LFO (inc down ramp and S&H - independently routable to each VCO shape according to Erik) + 10 pattern Arp + 16 step x 20 parameter sequencer + delay

My point, precisely. There is nothing in there to indicate it will do anything at all beyond the bog-standard basics with a few minor variations. How can you fail to see that? There is no osc sync, no FM, no Ring Mod, none of the things that normally make a two osc synth so much better than a single osc one. Even Behringer's SH-101 clone manages to fit FM into it's single VCO synth.

You can get as wide a palette of sounds from the UNO as just about any classic 2 oscillator analog synth....probably more with the continuously variable wave shape and 20 P locks....there are always limitations on analog synths, limited LFOs on moogs for examples, simple second oscillators on Juno’s...people manage...

Absolute BS. Every other two osc synth that ever made any impact in the world had cross-mod between the oscillators, which is why people looked for two osc synths. This can't do hard sync, it can't do Ring Mod and it's can't do FM, where literally hundreds, probably thousands of freeware VSTi can and any classic synth can. e.g. MiniMoog, Odyssey.

If you want a small form factor pocket synths with a good sequencer this must be towards the top of any list

Yes, and if you want a tiny plastic synth covered in a touch-sensitive membrane, this would also be at the top of your list. But it would be a pretty stupid list to make in the first place, wouldn't it?

we are blessed with many other good alternatives that may suit YOU more, but that doesn’t diminish how good the UNO is for the cost, I could make a list of why the synth you have chosen that costs more is far more limited than the UNO, but what’s the point? Make music, be happy

No you couldn't. You can't tell me one way in which this is better than a second-hand K Station, for example, and for every con you could list for a Waldorf Rocket, I could list two pros.

If this was a VSTI, there would be zero interest in it and everyone would say it was overpriced if it was $49.

except for a used waldorf rocket according to the-great-synth-arbiter

Something which you are yet to dispute, I notice. You see, I actually know what I'm talking about, as I own a Rocket and I've heard all the exact same UNO demos as you have. But let's not allow facts to get in the way, shall we?

Just to be clear, I really like what I've heard in these demos and unless it turns out to be poorly made or if it doesn't sound as good in person as it is in the videos, I will probably buy one. But I don't for a minute think it's going to be much use beyond a few basic, bread and butter sounds. e.g. Anything without PWM sounds a bit thin and weak, so I reckon I'll always be PWMing the hell out of it and I can't imagine ever using it for a lead part. As an Analog Keys owner, I think the parameter locks thing is mostly a bit of a gimmick - I don't need to put a kick on one note and a snare on another - but it could have it's uses here.

Like the Rocket, it looks like it will be a lot of fun to play with, rather than a serious music making tool, and for a couple of hundred I'm fine with that. I just don't get why everyone has to talk everything they like up, well beyond its actual capabilities. At $200 it doesn't have to be versatile, it doesn't have to be the best thing ever, it just has to do one or two things well and this seems to fit that bill OK. But I'm definitely going to reserve judgement until I've played with it myself, especially in light of some of the other things that have come out of Superbooth this year.

I actually owned a rocked (had it for 120 from eBay) but I sold it after a few months as I realy didn’t like the sound of build (knobs) bought a dark energy 2. I still have my blofield. Both (and many of my hardware synths) could probably be beaten for features by any free VSTs.

I don’t think you can compaired something that is just a sound module and something that is more of a groove box with performance controls and P-locks etc, I have the dark trinity (A4, OT and RTYM) and is all about the sequencing rather than the sound potential, it’s intigrated to workflow. If you do t w t the sequencer, p locks, portability etc the. As I said, there may be better options. I don’t want/need a flexible sound engine, I have 200hp of modular...I want a portable fun little analog sequencer to go with my OP-1. For me, this is perfect...I guess you don’t want one, so why are you even on this thread, to try and persuade other peiople they domt want one?

[OneOfManyPauls]

I guess you don’t want one, so why are you even on this thread, to try and persuade other peiople they domt want one?

Self-aggrandizement.

[ghettosynth]

I guess you don’t want one, so why are you even on this thread, to try and persuade other peiople they domt want one?

Self-aggrandizement.

In fairness though, l don't want one (today), but I'm still interested in new hardware. Especially since 1) the filter sounds really good to me, and if you follow my posts to any degree then you know that I don't say that very often, and 2) I'm interested in why there is no sync purely from a curiosity point of view.

[OneOfManyPauls]

I don't think the discussion should be limited only to people who want one or only people who think it's a great unit -there's nothing wrong with healthy discussion from both sides. That's different to sprinkling every post with one's greatness and ad-hominem attacks.

[Scotty]

The presenters cleared up the "membranes" questions. There are no membranes it is capacitive touch technology.

[samsam]

If this synth was a loaf of bread, people would say it was overpriced at 99 cents. And if it was a real rocket, nobody would fly in it. Membranes.

Has anyone said that it's "overpriced?" I don't recall that. I think that the criticisms are largely falling along the lines of "even at $200 it should have certain features that seem weird to leave out."

I know, was just a bit of a nonsense post in response to other NONSENSE posts in the thread. Apologies for my ramblings.

[OneOfManyPauls]

A video from the Soundmachines design/architecture perspective:

[BONES]

The Rocket filter does not sound as good to me and the Rocket, like most things Waldorf, is overpriced.

What? It's Au$325, which is around US$240, and that includes taxes. For that you get an 8 voice paraphonic synth with PWM, Hard Sync, the ability to play 1 finger chords, plus one of the best filters, analogue or otherwise, I've ever used. But don't take my word for it, this is what Sound On Sound had to say when they reviewed it - "this is a fab-sounding analogue filter".

There's not much point to comparing to used gear, that's cheating.

It's not cheating at all, it just doesn't suit your argument. If you are on a budget and you only have $200 to spend, then you are absolutely going to compare this to what you can get on eBay (if you have even half a brain). I got my Rocket off eBay for $150 and my Ultranova for around $300. You just can't argue with that kind of value but companies definitely have to compete with it.

Look, I think that IK missed the boat by not including oscillator interaction. However, I think that you've got a bee up your bonnet about the Rocket, it's an ok synth, and yes, I've heard it in real life.

I'd be very surprised if that's true. because it is simply amazing. I can't believe that anyone would spend any time with one and not buy it. You'd seriously have to have rocks in your head or concrete in your ears not to hear how amazingly good it is. I prefer it to the Pulse 2 I also own. There's just something about the way it sounds that defies what it appears to be when you look at it.

When we played in Germany last year, I could have taken my Ultranova, which is an absolute beast of a machine, or I could have taken my Korg Minilogue, but instead I took the Rocket (and a Keystep to play it) because it just sounds so freakin' good (and the parts I play tend to use very similar sounds so I didn't have to do much adjusting on stage).

I'm not chomping at the bit for a portable hardware synth, but if I were, I wouldn't choose the Rocket. I don't think that you have any objective evidence of superiority here

Really? 8 voice paraphony that allows for 1 finger chords and hard sync isn't better than neither and just two oscillators? In what universe? And from what I've heard o f the UNO demos, I'd be surprised if the Rocket's Boost wasn't much better, too.

just your opinion and, if you haven't caught on yet, your opinion isn't particularly well respected around here.

Thank Dog for that! Given the unbelievable stupidity you idiots come up with around here on a daily basis, I find it hard to believe we're the same freakin' species most of the time. You really do all come across as both brainless and clueless more often than not, yet you seem completely oblivious to the fact.

My guess is that there's some technical reason that there's no sync beyond just cost because syncing two VCOs doesn't cost very much

I'm not sure that it works like that. I think they have to work with whatever parts they can get and some ICs allow for some features that others don't. So yeah, maybe they'd have had to spend more money on different chips to get those features but if you look at the front panel, it's equally likely they just didn't have room for the controls for that stuff. It may have required an extra column or two in the control matrix, which would mean trying to fit an extra pot or two on the front panel somehow. If that's why and it was me making the decisions, I'd have got rid of that row of performance buttons - Dive Scoop Vibrato, etc. and put a SYNC row into the control matrix. But IK might have thought the other stuff would be a better selling point. Who knows?

I stand by everything I've said.

I hope you're wearing a disguise, you wouldn't want to be recognised standing next to that stinking pile of krap.