Integrating Logic with Cubase?

[elfan]

There has been a lot of talk lately about how to migrate from Logic to some other host (e.g Cubase). But of course, doing so means that you'll lose all of those amazing native plugins in Logic.

Here's two, perhaps unreal, ideas about how you can create soft integration between Cubase (or any other host) and Logic:

1. In Cubase SX3 there is a feature that allows you to connect a vst insert to a soundcard audio bus which you can route out from your soundcard, through an external hardware effect module and back into Cubase again. This while Cubase treats it like an ordinary vst effect.
Now, wouldn't it be possible to create virtual audio busses which look just like your ordinary soundcard audio busses (like one of those 8 audio output busses you might have on your soundcard)? Just like Midi Yoke, but for audio? That way you could let Cubase send audio to this virtual bus from an insert slot, let Logic listen to the bus and route the incoming audio through the logic native effects that you want to use, and then back to Cubase again.
Does _anyone_ know of such virtual audio busses? Or any freaky, experimental plugins (like Tobybear's VSTNETMID, but for audio instead?) that does this kind of thing?

2. An alternative to virtual audio busses: In Cubase you could have a simple (hypothetical) vst plugin that captures all audio sent to it by Cubase, sends the audio stream to an (hypothetical) external, standalone, process that's running outside Cubase.
At the same time, you could have another vst plugin in Logic that does the inverse thing: It receives an audio stream from the external process and outputs the audio to Logic.
Then, of course, you would also have to have the opposite: A vst plugin in Logic that sends an audio stream back to the external process and a vst plugin in Cubase that receives the audio stream from the external process and outputs it to Cubase.

So the external process acts as a bridge between Logic and Cubase (or any other VST host) and lets you treat Logic as if it was a vst plugin.

Does these ideas sound crazy? If not, does anybody know of any solutions that work like these? If not, it could be cool to see some developer taking on the task of creating such a solution. Think about it! This would enable integration, albeit not very tight integration (there is still no solution for forwarding of vst autiomation) but at least audio integration, between arbitrary vst hosts.

Then you can always control Logic using midi and midi sync and compose your vst automation within Logic. So everything besides integration of audio is already solved. So, Logic could potentially be very nicely integrated in the VST host of your choice.

Ideas? Comments?

//Tomas

[original flipper]

HI

I have just spent the last 3 hours converting my Logic compositions to Midi-files and to be honest another session tomorrow and I will have most of my compositions in some kind of form to use in SX V3 - to be honest I have only gone through all this trouble because I am midway through a project and these are mainly new tracks.

Beyond that I want shot of the program - it served its purpose, screw going through all that hassle - there are plenty of plug-ins that can get close better/worse than Logics - the only one I will miss is the tempo-delay which was SO simple to set-up, but then again I have the ohm/psp/dash ones that are good in their own right once set up.

Flipper.

[aMUSEd]

I tried something like this myself ages ago using Ntonyx Virtual audio cable to try and connect Logic with Tracktion but it wasn't too succesful - possibly as my system is quite slow and my lack of expertise (+ it was a demo version). I couldn't get it to work properly.

You could try it with the new SX though - maybe it's a better choice to use.

http://www.ntonyx.com/vac.htm

[DevonB]

HI

I have just spent the last 3 hours converting my Logic compositions to Midi-files and to be honest another session tomorrow and I will have most of my compositions in some kind of form to use in SX V3 - to be honest I have only gone through all this trouble because I am midway through a project and these are mainly new tracks.

Beyond that I want shot of the program - it served its purpose, screw going through all that hassle - there are plenty of plug-ins that can get close better/worse than Logics - the only one I will miss is the tempo-delay which was SO simple to set-up, but then again I have the ohm/psp/dash ones that are good in their own right once set up.

Flipper.

Hey Flipper, have you gotten the dxAudioware's free tempo delay? That replaced tempo delay for me from Logic.

Devon

[aMUSEd]

btw - Creamware users - do you think you could do something like this using Creamware's routing flexibility - ie fed the audio from Logic into another sequencer so you could use Logic's plugins as instruments in the other sequener.

[aMUSEd]

I've also tried doing this with Tobybear's Mixbox but again it didn't work for me but might for someone who knows what they are doing.

http://www.tobybear.de/p_utilbag.html

[elfan]

HI

I have just spent the last 3 hours converting my Logic compositions to Midi-files and to be honest another session tomorrow and I will have most of my compositions in some kind of form to use in SX V3 - to be honest I have only gone through all this trouble because I am midway through a project and these are mainly new tracks.

Beyond that I want shot of the program - it served its purpose, screw going through all that hassle - there are plenty of plug-ins that can get close better/worse than Logics - the only one I will miss is the tempo-delay which was SO simple to set-up, but then again I have the ohm/psp/dash ones that are good in their own right once set up.

Flipper.

Yes, admittedly it would not be the easiest of solutions. And there is really only two plugins in Logic, that I haven't found equivalents of elsewhere, that would justify hanging on to Logic: Spectral Gate and ES2. However, those two have no real substitutes and are among the best there is. So if you really depend on those, it's hard giving up on Logic.

Besides, this would not be limited to Logic only. This is a way of integrating Cubase with any other VST host that perhaps couldn't be integrated otherwise. If going with Idea #2, one should even - theoretically - be able to integrate any VST host with any other VST host.

//Tomas

[elfan]

btw - Creamware users - do you think you could do something like this using Creamware's routing flexibility - ie fed the audio from Logic into another sequencer so you could use Logic's plugins as instruments in the other sequener.

Actually, I was thinking about Creamware when I thought about virtual audio busses. I too wonder about the routing capabilities of Creamware Pulsar/Scope

//Tomas

[elfan]

Wow, thanks a lot aMUSEd . I'll try Mixbox and Virtual Audio Cable .

//Tomas

[aMUSEd]

btw - Creamware users - do you think you could do something like this using Creamware's routing flexibility - ie fed the audio from Logic into another sequencer so you could use Logic's plugins as instruments in the other sequener.

Actually, I was thinking about Creamware when I thought about virtual audio busses. I too wonder about the routing capabilities of Creamware Pulsar/Scope

//Tomas

I'll know soon enough when I get mine.

[aMUSEd]

Wow, thanks a lot aMUSEd . I'll try Mixbox and Virtual Audio Cable .

//Tomas

Mixbox looked to me like it should work - if you can figure out how to set it up let me know. The virtual audio cable also looks useful but didn't like my system and I had to delete it.

[original flipper]

HI

I am happy with 'wiring' things up within a host like EXT or ERA but I get a bit nervous when I start to link two host's together as described (paranoid?).

I had actually made a bank of over 64 pre-sets in Trimmetry Tapper - alas I have lost them to Logics bloomin pst file format!

Who knows; perhaps there is a decent delay in SX3, but I think the ones I mentioned are all very good albeit less immediate, but saying that if a delay has tempo sync then you will always get a nice delay once you program one in anyway.

I think I have checked out the db delay.

I will miss the Logic bass synth now I think about it - so easy to get a sub out off, but then again Bazzoid is a RUTHLESS mother of a bass synth that messes with my monitors like no other!

Flipper.

[aMUSEd]

btw - I thought I remembered this coming up before:

http://www.kvr-vst.com/forum/viewtopic. ... udio+cable

[elfan]

btw - I thought I remembered this coming up before:

http://www.kvr-vst.com/forum/viewtopic. ... udio+cable

Awww, MAN! And I thought that thread would actually _lead_ somewhere . Okay, so we have established that ReWire is not a good idea if you wish to control Logic as slave. Good, then I don't have to worry about that. I was just trying to make ReWire work between Cubase and Logic.

So far, MixBox looks like the best alternative. If it would start working between applications and not just within the same application.

//Tomas

[Muzik 4 Machines]

i know its silly but plugging the adat out into the adat out could help to some extent(if u dont use asio in logic)
or maybe two adat equiped soundcards both asio
that could work a bit