Fathom Synth Development Thread

[BlackWinny]

People, just a heads up, there will be a small fee for the version updates starting with 2.12. Probably between $3.00-$5.00. Please rest assured this new policy is not driven by any rapacity but really is purely just to keep the project going. Please feel free to weigh in below if you think this amount is too much (or too little).

No problem for me, Everett.

[fluffy_little_something]

I understand that he wants to earn a bit with his synth, but that makes me wonder why he did that crazy sale recently. He could easily have charged 100 bucks for it and done without any future update fees. But it's too late for that now, I suppose...

[BlackWinny]

The new GUI will offer two panel options and three dial options "Factory", "Hi-Fi" and "Industrial" (shown below).

People, just a heads up, there will be a small fee for the version updates starting with 2.12. Probably between $3.00-$5.00. Please rest assured this new policy is not driven by any rapacity but really is purely just to keep the project going. Please feel free to weigh in below if you think this amount is too much (or too little).

Well I think instead of having different knob style I would rather see more changes to UI organization. Suggestions that I already send you with email during Fathom OSC. Don't get me wrong but different looks of knobs doesn't make UI better.

3 or 5$ is not problem but it is also depened how often you will release new version . There is also another question when user skip certain update how much he will need to pay then

For each update which has been missed or skipped there will be a penalty of $10.00 added to the next payment.


I'll collect the names.

[fluffy_little_something]

Will it be cumulative updates? In that case one might simply skip a bunch and save money

[BlackWinny]

I suggest another solution :

Each user chooses the updates he wants. There is a fee for each update... and the updates are not cumulative. So if a user don't want this update but wants that update, he pays only the $3-$5 (depending the complexity of the update) for the update he wants.

And Everett maintains a few hundreds different versions of Fathom, the number of the versions being from now coded in binary so that in the version 111011011101 there is the update 1, the update 2, the update 3, the update 5, the update 6, the update 8, the update 9, the update 10 and the update 12, but not the update 4, the update 7 and the update 11. Every musician chooses regard his finances and his tastes.


















Bon courage Everett !

[bsntn99]

I can't believe this new update pricing policy. I just bought this a couple of weeks ago and now I have to pay for all updates going forward. If I knew this ahead of time, I would have saved my money and moved on. I don't mind paying for major updates like one or twice a year, but not with every increment. None of my other vsts have a policy like this.

At best I consider this current release an advanced beta. The cpu use is through the roof for anything complex and pretty much makes it unusable. Moving any dial brings on clicks that sometimes perpetuate and don't go away. I have to frequently reload. The included presets are dreadful and saving patches is unintuitive. Overall the interface is wonky and far from what is state of the art with unconventional labeling. The phaser for example is a nightmare to figure out and navigate. There are also other issues, but I can't remember right now off the top of my head.

So now if I pay for every increment over the course of the year, I would sink $40 or $50 into this thing. I would be better off waiting for a year or more, and seeing where things are at, and just paying full price again. I was going to be a proponent on other forums I frequent, but now I feel I have an obligation to let other potential buyers know about this policy. In the end, you may pull a few bucks out of the current user base, but this will be a major turn off to new buyers and cost you more in the long run.

[BlackWinny]

I can't believe this new update pricing policy. I just bought this a couple of weeks ago and now I have to pay for all updates going forward. If I knew this ahead of time, I would have saved my money and moved on. I don't mind paying for major updates like one or twice a year, but not with every increment. None of my other vsts have a policy like this.

At best I consider this current release an advanced beta. The cpu use is through the roof for anything complex and pretty much makes it unusable. Moving any dial brings on clicks that sometimes perpetuate and don't go away. I have to frequently reload. The included presets are dreadful and saving patches is unintuitive. Overall the interface is wonky and far from what is state of the art with unconventional labeling. The phaser for example is a nightmare to figure out and navigate. There are also other issues, but I can't remember right now off the top of my head.

So now if I pay for every increment over the course of the year, I would sink $40 or $50 into this thing. I would be better off waiting for a year or more, and seeing where things are at, and just paying full price again. I was going to be a proponent on other forums I frequent, but now I feel I have an obligation to let other potential buyers know about this policy. In the end, you may pull a few bucks out of the current user base, but this will be a major turn off to new buyers and cost you more in the long run.

Ha Ha ! Wait ! Nothing isn't decided yet, obviously. And Everett is a super-neat guy who is extremely kind to discuss the goods and the bads of each idea. So don't worry.

[FathomSynth]

fluffy_little, Believe me I would love to charge $100 for Fathom, but from experience I have found the price break point is $25.00, and purchases drop to zero if it goes above that amount. Also, I know the sales may seem crazy, but it actually brings in a lot of users who would otherwise never try Fathom.

I anticipated that people would object being charged for software upgrades, and I do understand the logic of these objections and perhaps even their validity, but trust me it really is necessary. Also, keep in mind it is going to be an incredibly low amount like three bucks.

I do aspire to running an ethical company so if there are people who really do object on moral grounds or perhaps are students and literally do not have three dollars, then I am willing work something out on a case by case basis.

I don't want this to prevent anyone from using Fathom.

That being said, come to think of it, there has been one bug report on 2.11 in the last month. So 2.11 has been incredibly stable (to my knowledge). So if anyone really does object to new features 2.11 is already a pretty good option.

Another solution would be the old "pay for the cutting edge" ...

I would work like this, we simply charge for the latest upgrades for the first month the release is out, then when the next release comes out the former release becomes free. That way people who are willing to support feature development can get the latest features and those who object to paying for upgrades can still keep Fathom updated on their system and have only to wait a couple weeks for their upgrade. The older release which is already built simply becomes the free release. The funny thing is that users opting to wait a couple weeks for each release would still be getting software upgrades faster than most other products.

The beauty of this system is that it would require no work on my part and both camps would have their upgrade path.

EDIT:

bsntn99, Like I said, I realized some people would object since this is a new policy, so let me know what you think of the proposed solution above. You could still get the upgrades you just have to wait one release. Is that not reasonable?

Also, you are correct about some of the shortcomings, however, are you seriously suggesting that I stop all software releases until the synth is perfect and then release such a version a year from now with no upgrades while I do the work? The incremental delivery is for your benefit, and was not designed frustrate anyone.

[VariKusBrainZ]

Have CM done a review yet?
That would push sales through the roof.

[bsntn99]

Like I said, I just bought this and it is practically unusable for me in its current state, and I haven't even got one comped update. There was no advanced warning of this impending update policy. How about a grace period for people like me that are just buying in?

[fluffy_little_something]

fluffy_little, Believe me I would love to charge $100 for Fathom, but from experience I have found the price break point is $25.00, and purchases drop to zero if it goes above that amount. Also, I know the sales may seem crazy, but it actually brings in a lot of users who would otherwise never try Fathom.

I don't think a price of 100 bucks is a problem, after all people gladly pay 150+ bucks for any U-he synth, and even for ancient Sylenth1.

If people stop buying it above 25 dollars, there must be some other problem, like GUI, CPU efficiency, sound character, something like that.

[VariKusBrainZ]

If you have to charge for updates, the easiest way (other than charging everyone) to manage is to manage it like a sub.

Ie after a certain period after purchase you need to pay.

[fmr]

If you have to charge for updates, the easiest way (other than charging everyone) to manage is to manage it like a sub.

Ie after a certain period after purchase you need to pay.

This would make more sense. Either that or when you have added some big features, like sampling (as I referred earlier). Mentioning CPU optimization as a "new feature" is unjustifiable, since that's pretty much what almost all of the updates are about (not only bug corrections but also optimizations).

I'm not saying I would not pay the $3 dollars asked for the next update, but if I am asked to pay that fee every month, I would certainly have objections, of course. If it will be like twice a year, then I would be fine.

Regarding GUI, I don't see any mention to a skinning feature. Opening the instrument to third party "skins" (making it "skinnable") would help you, and remove the burden of coming up with new GUIs out of your shoulders, at least in part.

[FathomSynth]

OK, based on input I think the time delay system would be the best.

I will make paying for upgrades entirely voluntary and shorten the time delay for the latest upgrade for everyone to only around two weeks.

I strongly suspect that a good percentage of people will be willing to pay for the latest as soon as it comes out, and that will suffice.

I just watched an Amazon movie last night and it cost me $14.00 (can't find anything I like on Netflix) and a movies only lasts 2 hours, LOL, and think of all the happyness you get out of struggling with Fathom for a month.

I see the points that have been made above and I don't want to upset anyone who bought the product without knowledge of any changes to how things operate. People in this camp will still be able to get the latest software in a reasonable amount of time.

[BlackWinny]

Like I said, I just bought this and it is practically unusable for me in its current state, and I haven't even got one comped update. There was no advanced warning of this impending update policy. How about a grace period for people like me that are just buying in?

Unusable ?



After such an awesome OSC and all these wonderful songs ???

Aren't you a bit abusing?

What kind of music do you compose to qualify Fathom of unusable ?

You are composer for J-M Jarre, Klaus Schulze?

Or perhaps... for David Guetta, the inverse of the former two above ?

I'm pretty sure that even Jarre, Schulze or Guetta would NEVER qualify Fathom of unusable!

What size do you need when you have to cover your head with a hat or any other cover?