Fathom Synth Development Thread

[Michael L]

That gives the problem of penalizing early adopters, though. Someone buying after a year would pay less in total than an early adopter that also pays for updates.
Unless the full price of the plugin also rises for new customers with each major update.

I am an early adopter and am happy to pay more in total for updates, because I have been enjoying this synth for a more time than someone who just bought it. That time is worth money!!

However, in addition to occasional free updates with minor features, I want to pay for larger and less frequent updates with major features because they are good value, and they help ensure that you stay in business! A few developers charge too much, but you charge a bit too little, and I have enough abandonware!

[fmr]

.

I'm leaning now toward a completely voluntary recommended donation for upgrades with no penalty or time delay at all for the free upgrades. If only a fraction of users felt motivated it would still help immensely.

If you want to incentivise people to pay a voluntary fee, you MUST give them something. Make them feel special for supporting you.
If you defer the updates for just 1 month it will make a HUGE difference.
The people with free upgrades cannot complain, as they will be receiving free updates EVERY month which is very regular compared to most other companies out there.
However, the people funding you will feel valued by getting their hands on the update a month early. I think it will more than double the number of people donating and it is right that they get rewarded for their support.
Please consider this option.

I second this. I will even be more drastic, and would delay the free updates by like three months. Three months isn't still an eternity, but would put more pressur on people who want the updates right in time to support the development.

Anyway, I also second some kind of Patero scheme with a monthly subscription for the ones that want the updates right in time. These would be able to access some reserved site where they would always be able to download the latest version. The login credentials would be sent after paying the first monthly fee, and would work as long as the subscription is up to date.

This would be more transparent and would allow an easier management, IMO.

[RPH]

Maybe look at how Humble Bundle does things.
They have the model of pay what you want, with a minimum amount, for stuff.
In your case major updates plus maybe extra's.

You could do e.g. :
- Pay 3 - 5 bucks (minimum) or more: get major update
- Pay 10 bucks or more: update + get some cool presets
- Pay 15 bucks or more: update + cool presets + name in list supporters?
- Pay 20 bucks or more: update + cool presets + name listed + ..
- Pay 30 bucks or more: all above and get Fathom VSTfx (insert name) when released ( exploit your FX code more! ).

PS: love the new graphic knobs and settings options.

[Nielzie]

Since the current version is stable now, why don't you immediately stop development on version 1 and start working on version 2, which will be a paid upgrade?

All people that bought version 1 got exactly what they paid for. The synth as it was on the moment that they paid for it, or even better if they bought it in an early stage.

Version 2 will of course get some nice new features and there will be an upgrade path/price for v1 users.

I think that is the most normal way to go here, making everybody happy And it keeps things (like administration) simple for you!

You'll have to wait a little longer for the income though, but I think you'll get more in the end. You could even sell the early v2 beta versions upgrades for a reduced upgrade price, to gain some income sooner.

"Buy Fathom 2 now for a reduced price, before the price goes up when it's final!"

[elassi]

Don't mind paying for updates (whatever model it will be) but I kindly ask you to inform about updates by mail.

Never got a such an information, thus I always have to follow this monster thread with lots of stuff and chat I'm not interested in. Thank you.

___
edit: Must not take place with every micro update, but probably once a month or so as long as developing goes on so rapidly.

[SparkySpark]

Since the current version is stable now, why don't you immediately stop development on version 1 and start working on version 2, which will be a paid upgrade?

All people that bought version 1 got exactly what they paid for. The synth as it was on the moment that they paid for it, or even better if they bought it in an early stage.

Version 2 will of course get some nice new features and there will be an upgrade path/price for v1 users.

I think that is the most normal way to go here, making everybody happy And it keeps things (like administration) simple for you!

You'll have to wait a little longer for the income though, but I think you'll get more in the end. You could even sell the early v2 beta versions upgrades for a reduced upgrade price, to gain some income sooner.

"Buy Fathom 2 now for a reduced price, before the price goes up when it's final!"

What (s)he said. Simple. Normal, Not confusing to anyone, and no one feels cheated.

Plus: when downloading v2, v3 etc, it'll be like Christmas eve.

[dandezebra]

Since the current version is stable now, why don't you immediately stop development on version 1 and start working on version 2, which will be a paid upgrade?

All people that bought version 1 got exactly what they paid for. The synth as it was on the moment that they paid for it, or even better if they bought it in an early stage.

Version 2 will of course get some nice new features and there will be an upgrade path/price for v1 users.

I think that is the most normal way to go here, making everybody happy And it keeps things (like administration) simple for you!

You'll have to wait a little longer for the income though, but I think you'll get more in the end. You could even sell the early v2 beta versions upgrades for a reduced upgrade price, to gain some income sooner.

"Buy Fathom 2 now for a reduced price, before the price goes up when it's final!"

What (s)he said. Simple. Normal, Not confusing to anyone, and no one feels cheated.

Plus: when downloading v2, v3 etc, it'll be like Christmas eve.

This does seem to be the easiest route. I would gladly donate a few $ as I paid very little for V1 to help with development of v2. Paid upgrade path to v2 that is cheaper for v1 owners.

[RPH]

FYI, we're already at version 2.. ( 2.11 to be exact ).

https://www.fathomsynth.com/updates

[dandezebra]

Go for v3 then. The trifecta!

[Nielzie]

FYI, we're already at version 2.. ( 2.11 to be exact ).

https://www.fathomsynth.com/updates

details, details..

[BlackWinny]

1. I second this. I will even be more drastic, and would delay the free updates by like three months. Three months isn't still an eternity, but would put more pressur on people who want the updates right in time to support the development.
2. Anyway, I also second some kind of Patero's scheme with a monthly subscription for the ones that want the updates right in time. These would be able to access some reserved site where they would always be able to download the latest version. The login credentials would be sent after paying the first monthly fee, and would work as long as the subscription is up to date.

This would be more transparent and would allow an easier management, IMO.

The best two suggestions ever, in my opinion.

Yes, one month is not enough. Far from it. Because it is very easy to wait quietly during only one month then to have the updates for free. So financially it will have for you no interest comparing to today. Three months is much longer, then much more inviting to give a humble participation to the finances of the developments.

And yes also for Patreon scheme with the subscriptions giving a kind of "privilege". The amount of the subscription doesn't need to be high. The more humble it will be the higher will be the number of subscribers. Knowing that it is a kind of permanent financial help to the developments, a very humble but monthly subscription gives then access to the immediate updates while the non-subscribers have to wait for three months... and it also allows you to know who are really the most interested users in the beta-tests and in the life of the product. And also you'll get a better total reserve of funds by a permanent humble subscription than by occasional but higher amounts.

Why are there so many abandonwares ? Because there are too many users who consider that once they have paid for a product they are granted to get all the updates for free for life, whatever the depth of the differences between the state of a product three years later and the state of the product when they bought it. Then the developers end by giving up, because they don't find any interest any more in making the product progress, the finances being never renewed. Myself I have rather considered that when one pays for a product he pays for the current state of the product and of course for the updates which are aimed at fixing the issues. But when a developer adds new features on a product, the former customers had not paid for these new features, they had paid for the features which were provided at the moment when the paid the product. Asking a small contribution for these former customers is normal in my opinion, because working on new features must not be on a junket. Each work desserves to be rewarded. Fixing "for free" the issues is normal, the users have paid for a product supposed to work without any unexpected trouble. But working for new features is like working for the creation of options for a car: it must not be free.

So, in my opinion, during several months after the release of a version, the accent should be put on the resolution of the issues. It must be free for the customers. And the number of the release is on the model X.X.01, then X.X.02, then X.X.03, then X.X.04, etc.
And it doesn't prevent to work also on new features. It is not the same work. And for the work on new features a developer needs funds. It is in this that a monthly subscription is interesting. Because the subscribers take part to the development... by their financial periodical support. So they should be considered automatically as "beta-testers" (if they want, it is their choice to be or not, anyway they have the previous version or versions if the new state is not stable or is too much buggy), meaning that they immediately get every evolution, even if it is in "beta stage", because it is the best way to thank them for their financial contribution. And these beta versions that they get are numbered X.Yb.01, then X.Yb.02, then X.Yb.03, then X.Yb.04, etc.

And when you release publicly the version X.Y you ask a small fee to the non-subscriber users if they want to get this new version which contains the new features. It is normal, because thay had not paid for these features. And the amount of the fee is nothing else than the same price as the total amount which has been paid by the each subscriber since the last version... plus 10%.

That way:

• Every customer pay for a product at a certain stage. All the issues must be fixed for free.

• Every customer, subscriber or not, pay for new features.

• The subscribers to the new features are financial contributors to the evolution of the product, it is them who allow you to eat while you're developing. So they are granted to get immediately the beta-test versions all along their evolutions. And the non-subscribers receive the new version (the new features) only when these features are achieved. And that subscribers, in addition to have seen the evolution of the product in real-time under their fingers, have paid 10% less than the non-subscribers.

When I say 10% it can be any other rate. It's at your convenience. But it must be incitative enough... without being a gift.

And that way you are sure that many people will follow you and will contribute to your developments. And the balance is respected : every customer has paid for what he gets... and no new feature is offered for free.

[Nielzie]

Why are there so many abandonwares ? Because there are too many users who consider that once they have paid for a product they are granted to get all the updates for free for life, whatever the depth of the differences between the state of a product three years later and the state of the product when they bought it.

That's why the vast majority of developers stops developing a version 1 at some point and starts developing a version 2 with an upgrade path for owners of version 1.

Why all the trouble of user subscriptions?

Aren't you overthinking this too far? I'm sure quite a lot of people (including myself) hate subscription models.. in any form.

[thecontrolcentre]

Why all the trouble of user subscriptions?

Aren't you overthinking this too far? I'm sure quite a lot of people (including myself) hate subscription models.. in any form.

Me too. A simple upgrade plan for v3 makes more sense imho.

[fmr]

Why all the trouble of user subscriptions?

Aren't you overthinking this too far? I'm sure quite a lot of people (including myself) hate subscription models.. in any form.

Me too. A simple upgrade plan for v3 makes more sense imho.

That's what we are used to, and my preferred method too. problem is Everett stated he needs some financial right now, therefore the dilemma. So, unless you are willing to pay upfront for the upgrade, a subscription model may be a solution for the dilemma.

That said, I am in favor to charge an upgrade fee for a version 3 to those that don't subscribe. People tend to devalue what they don't have to pay for (which sometimes if really unfair), and OTOH then to value much what they paid mauch for (which sometimes is also unfair, because the products don't value the amount asked for them... but I digress )

[RPH]