Good Intimate, Singer Songwriter Type Orchestral Bundles?

[Local Man]

Everytime I look at orchestral libraries they always seem to be geared toward big cinematic or lush symphonic sounds.
Are there any high quality orchestral libraries that have a more intimate sound, that are designed to be used in a pop/folk/rock context, but that still feature a full compliment of orchestral instruments?
For an example of the kind of sound I am talking about, listen to "Legend of a Girl Child Linda" by Donovan. There are more recent examples of course but that song is my all time favorite in terms of orchestral elements in a pop music context.
There are many Mellotron libraries that work in this context but that is not what I am talking about here. I am looking for something with more realism than that. Something that sounds like it was recorded in a room and not a concert hall.
Maybe something that is halfway between a Mellotron sound and the East West or VSL sound. Any ideas?

[jancivil]

VSL makes chamber music orch libraries and these are recorded on the Silent Stage. Also see solo strings. A string quartet, cf Eleanor Rigby.

Then you may place the 'group' in a convolution of impulses of an appropriate sound stage without all the intensive reflections.

[tatanka]

Not exactly what you might looking for but I thing its more then worth a try:

https://vi-control.net/community/thread ... ors.72277/

And whats best: its FREE ! And really easy to us.

What I love most that you can just switch on and off sections, so if you only need strings or woodwinds or.....

[DSmolken]

VSL's a good place to look.

The upcoming Soundiron Hyperion strings are a smaller ensemble recorded dry. Spitfire LCO Strings and ASS are also like that, though both are a very modern sound, maybe more indie than classic major label pop - they're not recorded all wet in a concert hall, unlike most Spitfire stuff. For a full orchestra, the Bernard Herrmann Toolkit is probably closest, but it's also geared at a specific era and a specific composer's movie scores. Big Fish's Vintage Strings and Vintage Horns would fit the bill for an old-school sound too, but they aren't terribly detailed.

Sample Modeling and Audio Modeling brass are supposed to be good for pop brass and woodwinds, and Impact's Straight Ahead Jazz Horns are good at the big band sound, so very usable for pop trumpets and trombones, but you don't get tuba or flugelhorn or French horns there.

[Local Man]

Not exactly what you might looking for but I thing its more then worth a try:

https://vi-control.net/community/thread ... ors.72277/

And whats best: its FREE ! And really easy to us.

What I love most that you can just switch on and off sections, so if you only need strings or woodwinds or.....

No, not really what I am looking for but that does look like it would be fun to explore. Unfortunately it requires the full version of kontakt which I don't have.

[Local Man]

Thanks for the recommendations.
Some good stuff here for me to look into but it reinforces my impression that there really isn't anything thing that is designed specifically for this purpose. And to be clear, what I am looking for is a collection of solo instruments that includes members of the various orchestral families and not necessarily ensemble type stuff, nor just strings for that matter. So for example, a nice sounding, deeply sampled bassoon that when you combine it with an acoustic guitar track it sounds like two people playing in a room together, not an acoustic guitar awkwardly sitting on top of something that sounds like a solo from Carnegie hall. Something with a nice woody sound. And a solo violin where you can actually hear the bow hair a little.
My problem with the big symphonic and Hollywood stuff is that it is designed to be blended together in huge arrangements and with tons of acoustic reverb so that the nuance of the individual instruments isn't really that important. And just aesthetically it is designed to have this very perfect concert hall sound that doesn't really work in the context of a simple folk song for example.
The VSL sounds closest but still I wish someone would release a nice library that is designed specifically for the baroque pop sound.
I still haven't explored all of the suggestions here thouroughly though so maybe I will find something close. Thanks again.

[donkey tugger]

This cello sounds like it might be the kind of thing you're after;

http://vstbuzz.com/freebies/pocketblakus-cello/

Maybe a start...

[tatanka]

Only two companies come to my mind where you might find something like this, but you have to look and BOTH need kontakt full version:

- Soniccouture
- Cinematique instruments

Both have THEIR owne idea of "how to", so that might not be yours, but its the closest I can imagine. Cinematique instruments has a freebie of ensemblia which might give you a idea of how they "think".

[nordickvr]

http://www.swamengine.com/products/

[jancivil]

Thanks for the recommendations.
Some good stuff here for me to look into but it reinforces my impression that there really isn't anything thing that is designed specifically for this purpose. And to be clear, what I am looking for is a collection of solo instruments that includes members of the various orchestral families and not necessarily ensemble type stuff, nor just strings for that matter. So for example, a nice sounding, deeply sampled bassoon that when you combine it with an acoustic guitar track it sounds like two people playing in a room together, not an acoustic guitar awkwardly sitting on top of something that sounds like a solo from Carnegie hall. Something with a nice woody sound. And a solo violin where you can actually hear the bow hair a little.

The VSL sounds closest but still I wish someone would release a nice library that is designed specifically for the baroque pop sound.

Basically you want something prefabricated that suits your notion of sound design perfectly, where you could build that group up and do your own sound design towards it.

I have never bought this in a bundle, I work from solo instruments, not entirely exclusively but nearly so. Bassoon and acoustic guitar recorded in a samples bundle in a room just how you picture it, not likely to exist. In the 'real' world, people did the work, there was no 'that baroque pop sound' in a preset. It could be fun to roll your own.
Place the two things - strictly from dry - in the same virtual room.

VSL Solo Strings is a good start, really you're going to need something on that order for a start since the imaginary product exists only in the mind of the imaginer. Your specificity is yours, own it.

[Bug Music]

I'm not sure if you know the song, but I would suggest you give a listen to 1000 Umbrellas by XTC.

This has to be one of the most beautiful, tightest, and most intricately arranged string quartet arrangements in modern music IMHO.

Then you should check out this interview with Dave Gregory, from XTC about how he actually went about putting that track together (skip to the 52:00 minute mark).


Honestly, after hearing this interview with Dave a few years back, it changed my whole thinking about how to arrange for strings (even though I use them very sparingly myself).

A very interesting interview start to finish, and well worth listening to the whole thing if your an XTC fan, but he talks about that particular arrangement near the end at 52 minutes in.

One solo instrument at a time, layered one on top of another like the real thing, reverb to taste (and very time consuming).

Hopefully this helps.

- Jay

[DSmolken]

Place the two things - strictly from dry - in the same virtual room.

Yeah. Dry samples placed in the same studio room will do. Also, while acoustic guitar and bassoon might be recorded in the same room, everything on classic records often was not, once multitracking became common. Strings might be recorded in a larger room just to fit in all the players, drums in another room, vocals in a booth... So having some things recorded in other spaces is perfectly normal and acceptable.

[counterparty]

I think Native Instruments Session Strings is designed for pop/rock/etc. They just released a new version.

[brainzistor]

Everytime I look at orchestral libraries they always seem to be geared toward big cinematic or lush symphonic sounds.
Are there any high quality orchestral libraries that have a more intimate sound, that are designed to be used in a pop/folk/rock context, but that still feature a full compliment of orchestral instruments?
Something that sounds like it was recorded in a room and not a concert hall.
Maybe something that is halfway between a Mellotron sound and the East West or VSL sound. Any ideas?

You are completely misguided by their presentation. Basically every single library out there has close mic, dry sound, dry as powder.
The whole point is that nobody out there is gonna present you for example cello with absolutely dry, dumb, sound.
If you go to Orchestral Tools and hear their presentation/examples of Nocturne cello,
you will just hear it with reverb.
http://www.orchestraltools.com/soloists ... _cello.php

However, you can set the wet sound, actually reverb to zero and here how it sounds, completely dry:
https://soundcloud.com/brainzistor/nocturne

Same thing applies to all other sound libraries. NOBODY is making sound libraries with just hall reverbs.
You obviously have minimal experience with sound libraries.
The reason why you must have dry samples is that user can use his own reverb(s) which is the most crucial thing next to having good samples.

That's why you can combine different orchestral sound libraries and solo instruments.
If it was about everything being wet with reverb, nobody would be buying anything, it would be close to useless.

[bigcat1969]

You might take a look at VSCO2. It has a ton of dry solo instruments. There isn't the same sample density as some of the bigger studion's offerings and the players are more college level than London Phil, but for the price I think it is a very nice collection with lots of stuff. Note I created a Kontakt version and cocreated a VSTi version based on the CC0 community samples, so I'm biased.

Also note that this month you should be able to get Kontakt for $125 if you crossgrade from Drummica. Kontakt can open up many things for you, has a passible, if old, intro orchestra and as mentioned some nice freebies.