First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

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dblock
KVRAF
2070 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:41 am

Hey guys. Got this problem in Cubase 9. When I record a simple 4/4 kick beat for example,the very first hit is recorded but in the midi editor you can see the midi note begins just barely before the measure line so on playback that first midi note is visible but it doesn't actually sound because it's not exactly on the beat. I have to manually pull the first hit midi note to the right to lock in on the beat before you can hear it. The rest of the midi notes seem to be in lock step. It's that first note that's driving me nuts.
All my time stamps are checked and I'm Quantized @ 1/16.
I would definitely appreciate some help here.
tia!

lfm
KVRAF
4618 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:21 am

I usually begin a project 5- or 10 bars in - never at first bar.
The first bars I sometimes use to send sysex and similar to midi gear to initialize stuff, but usually play back that part only once a session.

If that would cure your headache?

There are settings in Cubase for project that also tells which bar etc project start on etc.
Never used it myself, but if you want bar 1 to start your project, but into timeline - that might work.

Hope you get some ideas...

dblock
KVRAF
2070 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 2:08 pm

lfm wrote:I usually begin a project 5- or 10 bars in - never at first bar.
The first bars I sometimes use to send sysex and similar to midi gear to initialize stuff, but usually play back that part only once a session.

If that would cure your headache?

There are settings in Cubase for project that also tells which bar etc project start on etc.
Never used it myself, but if you want bar 1 to start your project, but into timeline - that might work.

Hope you get some ideas...
Much appreciate your input Fm but this seems like there should be a simple explanation and fix for this. Starting a drum hit right on the beat shouldn't need a special fix or workaround. I haven't always had this problem so that tells me some got changed and shouldn't have or didn't get changed and should have.I'm confident somebody will have the answer at some point.

dblock
KVRAF
2070 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:20 pm

dblock wrote:
lfm wrote:I usually begin a project 5- or 10 bars in - never at first bar.
The first bars I sometimes use to send sysex and similar to midi gear to initialize stuff, but usually play back that part only once a session.

If that would cure your headache?

There are settings in Cubase for project that also tells which bar etc project start on etc.
Never used it myself, but if you want bar 1 to start your project, but into timeline - that might work.

Hope you get some ideas...
Much appreciate your input Fm but it seems to me like there should be a simple explanation and fix for this. Starting a drum hit right on the beat shouldn't need a special fix or workaround and I haven't always had this problem which tells me something either got changed that shouldn't have or didn't get changed and should have.I'm pretty confident somebody will have the answer at some point.

User avatar
jancivil
KVRAF
15750 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:30 pm

I've never recorded with quantize or snap on so this is not from experience; but maybe look at a couple of things.

Preferences:
Screen Shot 2018-07-12 at 8.17.24 PM.png
I don't know what happens with latency compensation hard quantized, in other words.
It seems like latency is latency however, but if everything else lands exactly where you want it, I don't know.

when latency is compensated it may land ahead of time.
Screen Shot 2018-07-12 at 8.19.01 PM.png
This was just my settings at the moment, you'd want + something, not minus.
(Device or Studio Setup, devices menu)

I'm baffled though by the report of it just being the first note-on.
Are you saying it ends up in negative numbers, essentially?

Sometimes I do start at 0, but more typically I have a small bar at 0 for an anacrusis type of thing.
But I have never had a note occur to the left of 0 while recording. Again, I don't force timing by quantize or snap parts, I wonder if it's a kind of bug or glitch, out of everything else is no problem; I do suggest you test this by giving it a bar before the action so bar 2 is your first active bar.
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dblock
KVRAF
2070 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:53 pm

jancivil wrote:I've never recorded with quantize or snap on so this is not from experience; but maybe look at a couple of things.

Preferences:
Screen Shot 2018-07-12 at 8.17.24 PM.png
I don't know what happens with latency compensation hard quantized, in other words.
It seems like latency is latency however, but if everything else lands exactly where you want it, I don't know.

when latency is compensated it may land ahead of time.
Screen Shot 2018-07-12 at 8.19.01 PM.png
This was just my settings at the moment, you'd want + something, not minus.
(Device or Studio Setup, devices menu)

I'm baffled though by the report of it just being the first note-on.
Are you saying it ends up in negative numbers, essentially?

Sometimes I do start at 0, but more typically I have a small bar at 0 for an anacrusis type of thing.
But I have never had a note occur to the left of 0 while recording. Again, I don't force timing by quantize or snap parts, I wonder if it's a kind of bug or glitch, out of everything else is no problem; I do suggest you test this by giving it a bar before the action so bar 2 is your first active bar.
Hey jancivil. Very cool of you to take the time to do that but unfortunately no go. Nothing made a difference.I'll screw around with it a bit more tomorrow. It's not something I can't live with of course, but eventually I'll get it straightened out.
Thanks :tu: :tu:

lfm
KVRAF
4618 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:21 pm

dblock wrote: Much appreciate your input Fm but this seems like there should be a simple explanation and fix for this. Starting a drum hit right on the beat shouldn't need a special fix or workaround. I haven't always had this problem so that tells me some got changed and shouldn't have or didn't get changed and should have.I'm confident somebody will have the answer at some point.
Theory is one thing - reality another.

Did you ever talk to a support agent:
You:
- I have this problem with ....
Support:
- it should work
:D


To narrow down such problems - experiment a bit. Just to figure out what happends.

Let's say quantize does not capture events before time zero - and that means your problem arise if that first note is not on the first bar or later, to start with. So left untouched.

So just drag the clip in a bar on timeline, and do quantize again - or similar.

Then you could think of which workaround work better for you.

I have though some years ago, on Cockos Reaper forum, was one guy that had a problem with first note not playing back on the BFD drumsampler.

To capture what is actually played back - there is a midi plugin Midi Monitor you can use. If using Artist or Pro you can do that.

Good luck.

dblock
KVRAF
2070 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Re: First recorded midi note not sounding til I pull it back in Cubase??

Post Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:08 am

lfm wrote:
dblock wrote: Much appreciate your input Fm but this seems like there should be a simple explanation and fix for this. Starting a drum hit right on the beat shouldn't need a special fix or workaround. I haven't always had this problem so that tells me some got changed and shouldn't have or didn't get changed and should have.I'm confident somebody will have the answer at some point.
Theory is one thing - reality another.

Did you ever talk to a support agent:
You:
- I have this problem with ....
Support:
- it should work
:D


To narrow down such problems - experiment a bit. Just to figure out what happends.

Let's say quantize does not capture events before time zero - and that means your problem arise if that first note is not on the first bar or later, to start with. So left untouched.

So just drag the clip in a bar on timeline, and do quantize again - or similar.

Then you could think of which workaround work better for you.

I have though some years ago, on Cockos Reaper forum, was one guy that had a problem with first note not playing back on the BFD drumsampler.

To capture what is actually played back - there is a midi plugin Midi Monitor you can use. If using Artist or Pro you can do that.

Good luck.
Thanks fm for your input and advice. Contacting support is my next step. I have found that posting my issue on KVR more often than not gets me the answers I'm looking for and often much quicker than waiting for a reply from Steinberg. Failing that,I end up contacting support.

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