Please help me here.. I picked up the ST group buy and am just getting to the 3 Sonic Synth Disks. I was interested in installing the SS Basses so I copied the bass folder from disk one but could not load any of the patches(no .stw files). I checked disk two and three and the files were on disk three.
I seems that all three disks have the same bass patches and disk three has the actual wave files?
Could someone explain how that works or why it's been done this way?
As much as I like the overall package I find this as confusing as why call it sonic synth if you need a different synth to hear it.
In search of understanding,Thanks
MRT
3 Sonic Synth Disks?
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- KVRian
- 1372 posts since 3 Dec, 2002
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- KVRAF
- 4692 posts since 28 Jan, 2003 from In these very interwebs
You can either run the installer program, or just copy the files from ALL the CDs. The .stw files contain the actual samples (waveform data), which is why the collection has to be split across three CDs.
You don't need three synths to use it. You use one version of the SampleTank software (which is the instrument that plays the samples), and use that to access all the sampled instruments.
I don't know why the Sonic Synth CDs have incomplete instrument definitions on them. It might be so that whatever CD you install from, you have a list of all the Sonic Synth instruments in SampleTank (even though they're not completely installed yet)... Maybe Squids can clear this up?
Forever,
Kim.
You don't need three synths to use it. You use one version of the SampleTank software (which is the instrument that plays the samples), and use that to access all the sampled instruments.
I don't know why the Sonic Synth CDs have incomplete instrument definitions on them. It might be so that whatever CD you install from, you have a list of all the Sonic Synth instruments in SampleTank (even though they're not completely installed yet)... Maybe Squids can clear this up?
Forever,
Kim.
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- Skunk Mod
- 21249 posts since 10 Jun, 2004 from Pony Pasture
Ha! Been wondering about this bizarre arrangement, and that makes sense. Seems to me ST1 Free used to show all the STXL library instruments in its browser, the better to tempt potential buyers.Jeez wrote:It might be so that whatever CD you install from, you have a list of all the Sonic Synth instruments in SampleTank
I believe you have smitten the nail squarely.
Meffy
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- KVRAF
- 4692 posts since 28 Jan, 2003 from In these very interwebs
Hmm. I don't know about that. I agree that the ST1FREE+ST1XL library thing is pretty easy. However, I don't think that same argument applies to the three Sonic Synth CDs - the user has all three CDs anyway, so I can't see the point of doing it for advertising.Meffy wrote:Ha! Been wondering about this bizarre arrangement, and that makes sense. Seems to me ST1 Free used to show all the STXL library instruments in its browser, the better to tempt potential buyers.Jeez wrote:It might be so that whatever CD you install from, you have a list of all the Sonic Synth instruments in SampleTank
I believe you have smitten the nail squarely.
Meffy
Forever,
Kim.
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- Sonic Reality Head Chef
- 8566 posts since 11 Mar, 2002 from Florida
The repeat of the STI and STH files had something to do with the way the installer would add all of the files. I agree that is confusing too and it isn't done that way anymore (SS1 is several years old).
The reason Sonic Synth 1 was a "synth" but needed a separate software for its engine dates back to 2000-2001 time when it was first going to be its own synth using a different engine. It had its own GUI (silver brush metal in fact) and if you look it up on harmony-central you can see the first announcement. In fact, this was the first sound module plug-in announced by a sound developer I believe. But, when we saw SampleTank and its effects I wanted THAT to be our engine for Sonic Synth. So, I had to sacrifice Sonic Synth having its own interface to do this, but the most important thing to me was the sound. ST engine had the best included effects in a sample player so we went with that. Of course, the success of that and other products has caused SR to work in close alliance with IK to create new products based on the next level of ST and thankfully products like Sonik Synth 2 are modules with their own personality and interface. They are also a platform for future development relating specifically to synths... can't go into detail about that yet but you can imagine what kinds of things we would add to a synth module workstation over time.
Anyway, the best way to install the three discs is to run the installer and install everything. Then if you want to take stuff out then delete it. This way you won't miss anything.
The reason Sonic Synth 1 was a "synth" but needed a separate software for its engine dates back to 2000-2001 time when it was first going to be its own synth using a different engine. It had its own GUI (silver brush metal in fact) and if you look it up on harmony-central you can see the first announcement. In fact, this was the first sound module plug-in announced by a sound developer I believe. But, when we saw SampleTank and its effects I wanted THAT to be our engine for Sonic Synth. So, I had to sacrifice Sonic Synth having its own interface to do this, but the most important thing to me was the sound. ST engine had the best included effects in a sample player so we went with that. Of course, the success of that and other products has caused SR to work in close alliance with IK to create new products based on the next level of ST and thankfully products like Sonik Synth 2 are modules with their own personality and interface. They are also a platform for future development relating specifically to synths... can't go into detail about that yet but you can imagine what kinds of things we would add to a synth module workstation over time.
Anyway, the best way to install the three discs is to run the installer and install everything. Then if you want to take stuff out then delete it. This way you won't miss anything.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1372 posts since 3 Dec, 2002
Thanks for the feedback,
Squids maybe you could help me with this one,I'm undecided at this point if I want to upgrade from the group buy Sampletank version. Is there a "single web page" that clearly defines the differences between the versions of Sampletank? I'd also be interested in a comparison to your upcoming Sonik Synth 2?
Maybe it's just me but I find the whole ST,SR marketing experience more confusing than I think it should be. I'm happy that the software is not as difficult to use as it was to figure out what I was actually buying. I don't think I would have participated in the group buy if you hadn't been here to help clear things up for me.
Thanks
MRT
Squids maybe you could help me with this one,I'm undecided at this point if I want to upgrade from the group buy Sampletank version. Is there a "single web page" that clearly defines the differences between the versions of Sampletank? I'd also be interested in a comparison to your upcoming Sonik Synth 2?
Maybe it's just me but I find the whole ST,SR marketing experience more confusing than I think it should be. I'm happy that the software is not as difficult to use as it was to figure out what I was actually buying. I don't think I would have participated in the group buy if you hadn't been here to help clear things up for me.
Thanks
MRT
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- KVRAF
- 4692 posts since 28 Jan, 2003 from In these very interwebs
Ok, here's the lowdown.
Definitions:
ST2 = SampleTank2, and family of sample-playback synth engines.
SR = Sonic Reality, a company that produces sampled instruments.
IK = IK Multimedia, a company that develops ST2 and sampled instruments.
ST2FREE:
No-cost promotional instrument based on the ST2 engine. Comes with thirteen free sounds (at time of writing), with plans to release more every month. Provides full editing, but doesn't allow saving of presets (?) or multiple instances. It also loads ONLY sounds specifically authored for ST2FREE. Otherwise, it's just like the big ST2 engine. It requires authorisation with IK multimedia, but there is no timeout or periodic noise or any other annoying "demo" limitations. This is a fully-usable instrument.
ST2LE:
Limited version of ST2 that comes with any ST2 sound library. It only has the most useful synth editing parameters, only the first three effects slots are editable, it cannot import non-ST2/ST1 instruments, and only one instance is allowed at any time. The underlying engine is not crippled or limited in any way, so it plays all ST2 sounds as they were designed. It can load any ST2 or ST1 instrument.
ST2L:
Full version of the ST2 engine with full synth editing, multiple instances, preset saving, sample importing, and everything else. ST2L comes with four discs of sounds authored by IK (with help from SR).
ST2XL:
Full version of the ST2 engine (same as ST2L). ST2XL comes with eight discs of sounds authored by IK (with help from SR).
Sonik Synth 2:
Self-contained sample-playback instrument based on the ST2 engine. It can only load its own sounds (it cannot load ANY other sounds - not even ST2 instruments). It has a new interface, all brushed-metal and blue (nice!). It allows similar sound editing to the full ST2 engine. It comes with about five gigs of SR sounds, mostly focussed on vintage synths and keyboard workstation-type sounds.
Studio Phonik:
Similar concept to Sonik Synth 2. Different interface (wooden?). Sounds focussed on realistic "band" instruments - guitars, drums, bass, pianos, etc.
Sonic Capsules:
Series of instruments created by SR. Each capsule contains a few hundred megabytes focussed on one instrument type (drumkit, electric guitar, piano, etc). The capsules are usable in almost all software samplers, including ST2 (except ST2FREE). For US$10 extra, you can have ST2LE included with any Sonic Capsule.
Expansion Tank:
Series of instruments for ST2. These are mainly older ST1 libraries (formally known as eRoms) that have been re-programmed to take advantage of new ST2 features.
That's it.
Hey Squids - maybe this should go in the FAQ?
What does lowdown mean?
Forever,
Kim.
Definitions:
ST2 = SampleTank2, and family of sample-playback synth engines.
SR = Sonic Reality, a company that produces sampled instruments.
IK = IK Multimedia, a company that develops ST2 and sampled instruments.
ST2FREE:
No-cost promotional instrument based on the ST2 engine. Comes with thirteen free sounds (at time of writing), with plans to release more every month. Provides full editing, but doesn't allow saving of presets (?) or multiple instances. It also loads ONLY sounds specifically authored for ST2FREE. Otherwise, it's just like the big ST2 engine. It requires authorisation with IK multimedia, but there is no timeout or periodic noise or any other annoying "demo" limitations. This is a fully-usable instrument.
ST2LE:
Limited version of ST2 that comes with any ST2 sound library. It only has the most useful synth editing parameters, only the first three effects slots are editable, it cannot import non-ST2/ST1 instruments, and only one instance is allowed at any time. The underlying engine is not crippled or limited in any way, so it plays all ST2 sounds as they were designed. It can load any ST2 or ST1 instrument.
ST2L:
Full version of the ST2 engine with full synth editing, multiple instances, preset saving, sample importing, and everything else. ST2L comes with four discs of sounds authored by IK (with help from SR).
ST2XL:
Full version of the ST2 engine (same as ST2L). ST2XL comes with eight discs of sounds authored by IK (with help from SR).
Sonik Synth 2:
Self-contained sample-playback instrument based on the ST2 engine. It can only load its own sounds (it cannot load ANY other sounds - not even ST2 instruments). It has a new interface, all brushed-metal and blue (nice!). It allows similar sound editing to the full ST2 engine. It comes with about five gigs of SR sounds, mostly focussed on vintage synths and keyboard workstation-type sounds.
Studio Phonik:
Similar concept to Sonik Synth 2. Different interface (wooden?). Sounds focussed on realistic "band" instruments - guitars, drums, bass, pianos, etc.
Sonic Capsules:
Series of instruments created by SR. Each capsule contains a few hundred megabytes focussed on one instrument type (drumkit, electric guitar, piano, etc). The capsules are usable in almost all software samplers, including ST2 (except ST2FREE). For US$10 extra, you can have ST2LE included with any Sonic Capsule.
Expansion Tank:
Series of instruments for ST2. These are mainly older ST1 libraries (formally known as eRoms) that have been re-programmed to take advantage of new ST2 features.
That's it.
Hey Squids - maybe this should go in the FAQ?
What does lowdown mean?
Forever,
Kim.
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- Sonic Reality Head Chef
- 8566 posts since 11 Mar, 2002 from Florida
Good call. We'll do a comparison page on www.esoundz.com and I will also see if there is one or suggest there is one for www.sampletank.com
But, since I am here, let me explain it. (I did this at the same time as Jeez it seems- good one Jeez! The only thing I noticed was that you said Sonik Capsules are a few hundred megs but they are 500+ megs on average, also Expansion Tanks include new titles as well from AMG).
Okay, here's a good way to look at this too. The flagship is SampleTank 2 full version. This version is sold in 2 flavors: L or XL. The only difference between the two is that L comes with 4 discs of sounds and XL comes with 8 discs of sounds. The software is exactly the same.
But, there's SampleTank 2 LE (I know, confusing because there is an L and an LE... maybe that will change in the future, so guys if you want the "L" version get it while you can ). So, LE is a light version of the flagship ST2 and so it has limited features. I will compare in a moment. The ST2 LE is designed not to be sold on its own but coupled with sounds to make them great budget priced yet high quality sound modules.
Then there are higher priced sound modules with more features, their own interface and rather large collection of sounds, instrument design and philosophy etc. Sonik Synth 2 and Studiophonik would be examples of this. They are powered by the SampleTank 2 engine but have many of the features of the full version plus some specialized features to suit its genre.
In all cases the product that can read the sounds of all and has the most features is the full version of SampleTank 2 in the form of L or XL.
Here is a breakdown of features:
Channels/Outs/Instances:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 16/16/multiple instances
SampleTank 2 LE 16/16/single instance
Sonik Synth 2 16/16/multiple instances
Can read other SampleTank format sounds besides the ones that come with it:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE Yes
Sonik Synth 2 No
Can import Akai, Wave, Aiff and other:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE no
Sonik Synth 2 no
Regarding effects per part:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 5 editable fx per part
SampleTank 2 LE 2 editable, 3 playback fx per part
Sonik Synth 2 5 editable fx per part
Synth parameter editability:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 50 synth edit parameters
SampleTank 2 LE Up to 16 synth edit parameters
Sonik Synth 2 50 synth edit parameters
Access to Stretch and PS/TS:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Full access to all parameters
SampleTank 2 LE Playback only of sounds made that way by the sound developer
Sonik Synth 2 Close to full access to these parameters (somewhere in between- mostly designed still for tweaking sounds already made for those engines by SR... since you don't have IMPORT of your own waves in SS2 it is not useful in the same way stretch is on ST2 where you can play chords with your own single line phrases etc.)
Patch options:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Can play and save single and combi
SampleTank 2 LE Can save only combi, play both
Sonik Synth 2 Can play and save single and combi
Screen color options:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Red by default, Full spectrum of colors with control of saturation and luminosity.
SampleTank 2 LE Red by default, that's it.
Sonik Synth 2 Blue/glass by default, that's it.
Expandability:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE Yes
Sonik Synth 2 Yes (aha! click on the "i" on SS2 free... but this doesn't mean it will read any ST sounds. But it will be expandable in some ways, stay tuned!)
Upgrade crossgrade discount possibilities:
SampleTank 2 L/XL You can upgrade or crossgrade from ST LE -OR- from Sonik Synth (ver 1 or 2) to get to SampleTank 2 XL. If you have ST2 XL you can cross-grade to add Sonik Synth 2 to your set up for a nice discounted price in the introduciton period of the product.
SampleTank 2 LE There is no official upgrade to ST2 LE, the price of any ST2 sound collection that comes with it is how one can get it. Having ST2 LE qualifies for upgrading to ST2 XL. If anyone has Sonic Synth 1 in particular then they can also qualify for an upgrade discount to Sonik Synth 2. (but that upgrade is only available directly through SR and for a limited time)
Sonik Synth 2 You can upgrade to it from Sonic Synth 1 and you can crossgrade to it from SampleTank 2 XL. So, the cross-grade works either way: to or from ST2 XL. Since the engine features are very similar, one could look at this as a "but I just want the sounds" option... except you end up getting the rest of it too as a bonus.
There are some other feature differences but this should hopefully get you some food for thought.
But, since I am here, let me explain it. (I did this at the same time as Jeez it seems- good one Jeez! The only thing I noticed was that you said Sonik Capsules are a few hundred megs but they are 500+ megs on average, also Expansion Tanks include new titles as well from AMG).
Okay, here's a good way to look at this too. The flagship is SampleTank 2 full version. This version is sold in 2 flavors: L or XL. The only difference between the two is that L comes with 4 discs of sounds and XL comes with 8 discs of sounds. The software is exactly the same.
But, there's SampleTank 2 LE (I know, confusing because there is an L and an LE... maybe that will change in the future, so guys if you want the "L" version get it while you can
). So, LE is a light version of the flagship ST2 and so it has limited features. I will compare in a moment. The ST2 LE is designed not to be sold on its own but coupled with sounds to make them great budget priced yet high quality sound modules. Then there are higher priced sound modules with more features, their own interface and rather large collection of sounds, instrument design and philosophy etc. Sonik Synth 2 and Studiophonik would be examples of this. They are powered by the SampleTank 2 engine but have many of the features of the full version plus some specialized features to suit its genre.
In all cases the product that can read the sounds of all and has the most features is the full version of SampleTank 2 in the form of L or XL.
Here is a breakdown of features:
Channels/Outs/Instances:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 16/16/multiple instances
SampleTank 2 LE 16/16/single instance
Sonik Synth 2 16/16/multiple instances
Can read other SampleTank format sounds besides the ones that come with it:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE Yes
Sonik Synth 2 No
Can import Akai, Wave, Aiff and other:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE no
Sonik Synth 2 no
Regarding effects per part:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 5 editable fx per part
SampleTank 2 LE 2 editable, 3 playback fx per part
Sonik Synth 2 5 editable fx per part
Synth parameter editability:
SampleTank 2 L/XL 50 synth edit parameters
SampleTank 2 LE Up to 16 synth edit parameters
Sonik Synth 2 50 synth edit parameters
Access to Stretch and PS/TS:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Full access to all parameters
SampleTank 2 LE Playback only of sounds made that way by the sound developer
Sonik Synth 2 Close to full access to these parameters (somewhere in between- mostly designed still for tweaking sounds already made for those engines by SR... since you don't have IMPORT of your own waves in SS2 it is not useful in the same way stretch is on ST2 where you can play chords with your own single line phrases etc.)
Patch options:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Can play and save single and combi
SampleTank 2 LE Can save only combi, play both
Sonik Synth 2 Can play and save single and combi
Screen color options:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Red by default, Full spectrum of colors with control of saturation and luminosity.
SampleTank 2 LE Red by default, that's it.
Sonik Synth 2 Blue/glass by default, that's it.
Expandability:
SampleTank 2 L/XL Yes
SampleTank 2 LE Yes
Sonik Synth 2 Yes (aha! click on the "i" on SS2 free... but this doesn't mean it will read any ST sounds. But it will be expandable in some ways, stay tuned!)
Upgrade crossgrade discount possibilities:
SampleTank 2 L/XL You can upgrade or crossgrade from ST LE -OR- from Sonik Synth (ver 1 or 2) to get to SampleTank 2 XL. If you have ST2 XL you can cross-grade to add Sonik Synth 2 to your set up for a nice discounted price in the introduciton period of the product.
SampleTank 2 LE There is no official upgrade to ST2 LE, the price of any ST2 sound collection that comes with it is how one can get it. Having ST2 LE qualifies for upgrading to ST2 XL. If anyone has Sonic Synth 1 in particular then they can also qualify for an upgrade discount to Sonik Synth 2. (but that upgrade is only available directly through SR and for a limited time)
Sonik Synth 2 You can upgrade to it from Sonic Synth 1 and you can crossgrade to it from SampleTank 2 XL. So, the cross-grade works either way: to or from ST2 XL. Since the engine features are very similar, one could look at this as a "but I just want the sounds" option... except you end up getting the rest of it too as a bonus.
There are some other feature differences but this should hopefully get you some food for thought.
Last edited by Squids on Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRAF
- 4692 posts since 28 Jan, 2003 from In these very interwebs
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- Sonic Reality Head Chef
- 8566 posts since 11 Mar, 2002 from Florida
It was a double wammy! More info than one bargained for I think!Jeez wrote:Squids wrote:Lots of stuffDamn, there I was thinking my post was pretty long and detailed...
Forever,
Kim.
Thanks Jeez.That's how great this forum is.
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- KVRAF
- 1541 posts since 21 Aug, 2003 from Omicron Persei 8
OK, here's some more awkward questions for you both. 
As I recall, with the original SampleTank the sounds were tied to the version you bought. So SampleTank LE would not load the SampleTank L and XL sounds, and SampleTank L would not load the XL sounds (although the SR sounds could be loaded into all versions). Is this still the case with SampleTank 2? Or am I just confused...?
Also...if I have two copies of SampleTank 2, one of which was supplied with sounds and the other without, and I install them on different machines, am I breaking the licence agreement by installing the sounds on both machines?
As I recall, with the original SampleTank the sounds were tied to the version you bought. So SampleTank LE would not load the SampleTank L and XL sounds, and SampleTank L would not load the XL sounds (although the SR sounds could be loaded into all versions). Is this still the case with SampleTank 2? Or am I just confused...?
Also...if I have two copies of SampleTank 2, one of which was supplied with sounds and the other without, and I install them on different machines, am I breaking the licence agreement by installing the sounds on both machines?
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- Sonic Reality Head Chef
- 8566 posts since 11 Mar, 2002 from Florida
The first part is pure confusion.Blank_Frank wrote:OK, here's some more awkward questions for you both.
As I recall, with the original SampleTank the sounds were tied to the version you bought. So SampleTank LE would not load the SampleTank L and XL sounds, and SampleTank L would not load the XL sounds (although the SR sounds could be loaded into all versions). Is this still the case with SampleTank 2? Or am I just confused...?
Also...if I have two copies of SampleTank 2, one of which was supplied with sounds and the other without, and I install them on different machines, am I breaking the licence agreement by installing the sounds on both machines?
If you go by my post above you'll have it right. As far as reading sounds, the LE, L and XL versions can ALL read each other's sounds. As to the second, you are not breaking the license agreement as long as they are YOUR computers. You are the one who is licensed to use them in your music. You can put it on all your computers. Anyone else using it in their music has to have their own license though (therefore, just purchase it for themselves).
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- KVRAF
- 1541 posts since 21 Aug, 2003 from Omicron Persei 8
Excellent...thanks for the clarification, Squids. I'm now off to invest in your Tron collection as I have no willpower left...
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- Sonic Reality Head Chef
- 8566 posts since 11 Mar, 2002 from Florida
Blank_Frank wrote:Excellent...thanks for the clarification, Squids. I'm now off to invest in your Tron collection as I have no willpower left...
Sorry. I'd apologize for selling it so hard but then the trade off is that once you have it the benefits come in and there's no longer hopefully no need for me to apologize anymore.
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- KVRAF
- 1651 posts since 14 May, 2002 from Earth
