How to use sample packs

[jonel]

Hi all,
I feel a bit embarrassed by actually posing this question. I have been using Ableton for quite a long time now but I mainly work in midi, either programming in Ableton or through a midi controller. I am also happy with construction of instruments using one shots and also the occasional use of loops that I have gathered over the years. I would dearly love to be able to use these loops but don't feel that I understand how to proceed effectively other than just dabbling.

I gather that a sample pack is a collection of loops and one shots aimed at a particular genre of music and I should be able use a single pack for the generation of a complete song for the purpose on which the pack was constructed. I have tried looking at the various tutorial videos available and while these can be quite
helpful when they specify that a song is being built from scratch, just as it gets interesting the tutor will announce that the critical track was 'completed earlier'.

I have just been looking at a copy of Computer Music magazine (CM 224) which provided me with a sample pack called Arabian Nights. This pack is documented as containing 4 hand drum kits, 5 tambourine kits, 24 instrument loops, 117 musical loops etc. The folders of the pack are arranged accordingly and contain loops at various BPMs and one shots.
Does anyone know of a tutorial or on line resource that will give me a good foundation on how to use such a pack in the way it was intended to be used.

Thanks

Jonel

[AngelCityOutlaw]

Hi all,
I feel a bit embarrassed by actually posing this question. I have been using Ableton for quite a long time now but I mainly work in midi, either programming in Ableton or through a midi controller. I am also happy with construction of instruments using one shots and also the occasional use of loops that I have gathered over the years. I would dearly love to be able to use these loops but don't feel that I understand how to proceed effectively other than just dabbling.

I gather that a sample pack is a collection of loops and one shots aimed at a particular genre of music and I should be able use a single pack for the generation of a complete song for the purpose on which the pack was constructed. I have tried looking at the various tutorial videos available and while these can be quite
helpful when they specify that a song is being built from scratch, just as it gets interesting the tutor will announce that the critical track was 'completed earlier'.

I have just been looking at a copy of Computer Music magazine (CM 224) which provided me with a sample pack called Arabian Nights. This pack is documented as containing 4 hand drum kits, 5 tambourine kits, 24 instrument loops, 117 musical loops etc. The folders of the pack are arranged accordingly and contain loops at various BPMs and one shots.
Does anyone know of a tutorial or on line resource that will give me a good foundation on how to use such a pack in the way it was intended to be used.

Thanks

Jonel

That is going to be exceedingly difficult. All you could do, is stitch together various loops and phrases that are in the same key and tempo (or pitch shift and timestretch so that they are) and kinda hope for the best. This is how a lot of dance music in years past (like ultra-repetitive, 90s big beat) was made, but it fell out of favor when sample libraries and computing power got to the point that virtual instruments allowed for real control and play-ability over the samples. That's the issue with a pack of phrases and one shots or loops; you have no real control.

What most people use those for, if they use them at all, is either to quickly construct drum beats or use phrases of things that are difficult or impossible to replicate with a multi-sample virtual instrument. Like choir vocals fx and whispers, or sampled string runs, etc.

[thecontrolcentre]

Not all sample packs are of the construction kit variety. My packs for Ableton Live, for example, are mainly multi-sampled playable instruments (synths, guitars, pianos, melodica, vocals) or playable multi-sampled drum kits and percussion. The only loops I sell are acoustic drum kits and percussion, played by a proper drummer/ percussionist.

[jonel]

Thank you all for the very helpful replies. I have created instruments both in Ableton and Native Instruments using random samples but had never properly understood the sample pack as containing sample/beats/effects that were sort of inter-related which I felt would be helpful for me when working with genres that I know only a little of. I know this is the case with the packs that come with Ableton.

Thanks again

Jonel

[yellowmix]

Like others said, there are several categories of "sample pack", from construction kits to single hits.

Construction kits are basically stems for a complete song. It's like a jigsaw puzzle where the picture is already there, you just put it together to form it. You can study the picture for how it's drawn or painted or whatever, like you can study the completed song for how it's arranged and put together, and practice mixing and mastering. That's the most straightforward use. The more complete construction kits will include MIDI of the stems and synthesizer patches for the MIDI so you can learn sound design too. If you learn by example this can be a way to do so.

Loops don't necessarily form a song but they are often grouped with a theme so they are more likely to work with each other since some genres (especially electronic dance music) have stereotypical trappings (e.g., "future house clap"). Acoustic drum loops will often use a specific kit and styles of drumming and/or the same drummer. The stems and loops you get from a construction kit can be used this way. Check out this video from Loop Loft that shows a workflow for working with loops. It's their loops but it applies to any: https://www.thelooploft.com/blogs/ryans ... from-loops

The next level involves chopping up those loops into individual hits or phrases and liberating them from the rest of the loop and processing them and integrating it with the rest of your composition. This isn't much different from individual hits. Now you can put your own beats and melodies together with interesting sounds you otherwise could not easily obtain.

With melodies it can be a little difficult if you're trying to stay in key and you want to use hits from another key. But like the Loop Loft video shows, you can pitch it up or down. Honestly, I find little use of synthesized loops given today's synths but sometimes it's faster and easier to use a part of loop rather than recreating it in a synth. Depends how much flexibility you want. But many acoustic instruments still can't be realistically synthesized and I'm dependent on performers to provide that.

Then there are multisamples of instruments. These are intended to go into a sampler to form a single instrument or set of instruments (such as a flute or a rock drum kit), and they'll often come with sampler instrument files. You can plop the raw samples directly onto your DAW timeline if that works for you.

Another use of (human played) drum loops is extracting the groove (timing and sometimes velocity) of the hits. Then you can use that groove on your own beats. Your DAW may have tools to extract this, and if not, there is third-party software (sometimes classified as "drum replacement"). Or you can do it manually.

These are all ideas and workflows that are known to work for some people, but don't limit yourself to the "intended" purpose. Samples are the raw materials for whatever your imagination wants. Chop them up, process them, mangle them, recontextualize them, subvert them, it's all up to you.

[jonel]

What a fantastic reply and so much effort on your behalf. You have completed all the bits that have now led me to a much greater understanding this whole area. I have tended to avoid it as I was involved in creating songs in the traditional sense using various scales and harmonisation from music theory, all based on midi. But, I had this fairly large library of samples that I felt that I should be able to make some use of. I think I can press them into service in decorating the tracks that I have already created as well as providing some backing. Your information gives me a lot more confidence in choosing samples to use for this purpose.

Thank you very much

Jonel

[SoundPorn]

I use samples for inspiration because the work it takes finding the key and bpm and trying to fit them into a song is more work usually then just creating my own loop.
However with Ableton you can basically look at One shots like instruments so long as they have the key just put them in Simpler or Sampler and stretch them across the keyboard to play.

[Winstontaneous]

Don't be afraid to experiment...I have made entire pieces from a single sample stretched and played backwards/forwards, different speeds, pitches, etc., you can do this opening a sample in the Clip view. If you have Live Suite try loading samples into Granulator or other Max for Live sample manglers. Play at making Drum Racks with samples that don't "belong" together. Mess around with 1-shot vs. Loop and Slice modes in Simpler. Set an Audio track's input to Resampling to record whatever you're doing as audio, then use the recorded Clip as a sample, rinse and repeat with any of the techniques above. "The Beat" video linked in my sig uses extensive use of this latter Resampling approach.

[clarkio]

Being primarily a guitar player I've always had a bit of an issue with melody or harmony based loops in that it somehow seems like cheating. Consequently I don't really buy many sample packs and the ones I do, tend to be more beat or vocal focused. Typically I'll make drum one shots into a selector drum rack and use the top end of loops or the extracted groove as a little bit of ear candy on top of a vst instrument based arrangement.

I'm not opposed to people using melody based loops, if it sounds good fine, just they've never quite sat right with me. Construction kits in particular leave me a bit cold. But the main thing is just enjoy however it is you like to work.

[Obsolete462444]

If you are an Ableton user, Simpler is a great tool to mangle loops and samples. You can use it in conjunction with Ableton's tuner plugin to get samples from various sources to play in tune. Or use the slice function to immediately access the individual sounds within a loop.

You could also use something like Serato Sample - it will automatically detect the scale of the sample and allow you to transpose to any scale without additional hassle. But in actuality Simpler will already give you 90% of what Serato Sample does, you just have to take the extra step of tuning to scale "manually", rather than automatically.