Daws with Live style looping pattern mode.

[dellboy]

can create a dedicated "session" playlist view in FL 20 (now it supports multiple playlists) so the workflow with it

That seems very complicated.

It could be as simple in a standard linear daw as....

1. Create a five bar loop.

2.Assign an instrument

3.Play

4. Right click and apply independent looping.

All daws should be able to do this as a basic. As to whether there are technical reasons to it not being possible I do not know.

[Rajah]

can create a dedicated "session" playlist view in FL 20 (now it supports multiple playlists) so the workflow with it

That seems very complicated.

It could be as simple in a standard linear daw as....

1. Create a five bar loop.

2.Assign an instrument

3.Play

4. Right click and apply independent looping.

All daws should be able to do this as a basic. As to whether there are technical reasons to it not being possible I do not know.

Really... I can't see why they can't get it.... Geist did it...

[someone called simon]

Not sure if this is quite what you had in mind. ZenAudio ALK is sequenced looping. Aimed at helping musicians who play instruments and/or sing to perform live. Currently Mac only but PC in the works I believe. I don't think there's anything else quite like it.

[JoseC.]

can create a dedicated "session" playlist view in FL 20 (now it supports multiple playlists) so the workflow with it

That seems very complicated.

It could be as simple in a standard linear daw as....

1. Create a five bar loop.

2.Assign an instrument

3.Play

4. Right click and apply independent looping.

All daws should be able to do this as a basic. As to whether there are technical reasons to it not being possible I do not know.

Yep, that's what I thought. Anyway, a not very known Cakelab feature is that you can save the audio loops that you slice in the Loop Construction view as Acid Loops. If you click Export from that views menu, it saves all the tempo, key and slice markers info with the audio file, in the vey exact format that Acid uses. If you then import them in a sampler that supports that format, like Kontakt or in Battery, they will time and pitch stretch or you can expand the slices and export the midi file depending on the sampler engine you choose.

The only thing is that you must export them first, you cannot drag directly a groove clip from a track into the sampler. You must either bounce the clip and drag it as raw audio and set slice points inside the sampler, or save it to the browser from the Loop Construction View and drag it to the sampler from there with all the loop edits already in place.

[dellboy]

Not sure if this is quite what you had in mind. ZenAudio ALK is sequenced looping. Aimed at helping musicians who play instruments and/or sing to perform live. Currently Mac only but PC in the works I believe. I don't think there's anything else quite like it.

That's pretty amazing.

Not sure how it works, as the video does not go into detail, but the concept is there of mixing repeating loops of varying lengths.

Did he have a foot pedal to control the tracks ?

I will look forward to a PC version.

[dellboy]

Yep, that's what I thought. Anyway, a not very known Cakelab feature is that you can save the audio loops that you slice in the Loop Construction view as Acid Loops. If you click Export from that views menu, it saves all the tempo, key and slice markers info with the audio file, in the vey exact format that Acid uses. If you then import them in a sampler that supports that format, like Kontakt or in Battery, they will time and pitch stretch or you can expand the slices and export the midi file depending on the sampler engine you choose.

The only thing is that you must export them first, you cannot drag directly a groove clip from a track into the sampler. You must either bounce the clip and drag it as raw audio and set slice points inside the sampler, or save it to the browser from the Loop Construction View and drag it to the sampler from there with all the loop edits already in place.

Actually,the more I use Sonar, the more I am beginning to think it has pretty much everything I need. Loop daws, like Live and Bitwig, are great, but they are not built for linear work as such. Sonar has good loop abilities, and also functions as a traditional linear daw, which makes setting out traditional song types easier.

[mtelesha]

This is something that could be flushed out to a better loop sequencer program but there are pretty neat ideas. Not for editing but 100% for live performance

Prime: It is used by church worship leaders who use loops. You basically buy the stems and run it through Prime for live performance.

http://loopcommunity.com/prime

Cons: iOS and MacOS only. Mono-output since you are sending out a click track and audio count ins to one stereo side and the performance loops to the other end of the stereo send. CLOUD based.

Pros: FREE and you can import your own sounds.

Playback: Same as Prime but add multi-outputs with audio interfaces.

https://www.multitracks.com/products/playback/

Cons: iOS only. Cloud Based Monthly subscription model.

Pros: Can use certain audio interfaces with it and have multiple of outs. So click and stereo out.

[Tj Shredder]

...most music is made up of patterns after all - especially dance music.

Sorry, you can‘t expect that this sentence will pass without a strong reaction. In what kind of a tiny musical world do you live?

Music had been made milleniums before Live even existed...
The majority of music is still made without any electricity involved...
Yes patterns do exist in most musical cultures, but its not required to make music...
We would have a more interesting musical world, if we had less of those easy to repeat patterns. Patterns have to make sense. If you question every repetition you allow, then you think in a musical way, if you just let the repetion run without reason, you are more likely just lazy...
In Live its easy to make boring music, that is why we have so much of it... But still you can use Live/Bitwig or any other DAW to make wonderful music as well, just don‘t be lazy and be aware of how the tool influences your decisions...

[SoundPorn]

Waveform9 has a very unique audio auditioning library which allows you to audition multiple tracks that are in tempo and key of your song. And you can play a midi instrument while auditioning them too. It's basically the Live looping concept realized in a linear style DAW.

[zzz00m]

most music is made up of patterns after all - especially dance music.

This is actually quite true. The main difference being with the length of the patterns used to construct the form of a song.

Symphony: "the four movements of a symphony conform to a standardized pattern. The first movement is brisk and lively; the second is slower and more lyrical; the third is an energetic minuet or a boisterous scherzo; and the fourth is a rollicking finale."

Sonata: "an instrumental musical composition typically of three or four movements in contrasting forms and keys".

Popular song structure: "introduction, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge ("middle eight"), verse, chorus and outro".

Twelve-bar blues: "The twelve-bar blues or blues changes is one of the most prominent chord progressions in popular music. The blues progression has a distinctive form in lyrics, phrase, chord structure, and duration. In its basic form, it is predominantly based on the I, IV, and V chords of a key."

IMHO I would add that a boring symphony, boring pop song, or a boring EDM track, is not the fault of using patterns. Rather it is the result of a lack of imagination by the composer.

[mtelesha]

The track loops in Traction Waveform 9 are great, well Waveform 9 is just great. The issue is how do you in a live session repeat the bridge a second time on the fly or go back to verse 1? In Live and Bitwig you press the scene button and jump right there with a 1 bar lead that includes a vocal cue to your in ears.

That's what a Loop Sequencer needs to do when you are playing with other people.

[zzz00m]

The track loops in Traction Waveform 9 are great, well Waveform 9 is just great. The issue is how do you in a live session repeat the bridge a second time on the fly or go back to verse 1? In Live and Bitwig you press the scene button and jump right there with a 1 bar lead that includes a vocal cue to your in ears.

That's what a Loop Sequencer needs to do when you are playing with other people.

I think the best answer is to use Live or Bitwig for that. They have that market pretty well covered. No rule says that you can't have more than one DAW. One for the studio, and one for live performance.

[pdxindy]

The track loops in Traction Waveform 9 are great, well Waveform 9 is just great. The issue is how do you in a live session repeat the bridge a second time on the fly or go back to verse 1? In Live and Bitwig you press the scene button and jump right there with a 1 bar lead that includes a vocal cue to your in ears.

That's what a Loop Sequencer needs to do when you are playing with other people.

I think the best answer is to use Live or Bitwig for that. They have that market pretty well covered. No rule says that you can't have more than one DAW. One for the studio, and one for live performance.

+1

[pottering]

Waveform9 has a very unique audio auditioning library which allows you to audition multiple tracks that are in tempo and key of your song. And you can play a midi instrument while auditioning them too. It's basically the Live looping concept realized in a linear style DAW.

Ableton can save its "Clips" as ADG files, they are saved with the instruments and FX, and can be auditioned in the browser following the tempo (from about 5:47 in the vid below).



In case people don't know, not shown in the vid above, but Ableton Live does have a "linear style" mode (called Arrangement View) where you can drop those ADG Clips and arrange them in a song just like in the Waveform vid.

[Tj Shredder]

most music is made up of patterns after all - especially dance music.

This is actually quite true. The main difference being with the length of the patterns used to construct the form of a song.

Symphony: "the four movements of a symphony conform to a standardized pattern. The first movement is brisk and lively; the second is slower and more lyrical; the third is an energetic minuet or a boisterous scherzo; and the fourth is a rollicking finale."

Sonata: "an instrumental musical composition typically of three or four movements in contrasting forms and keys".

Popular song structure: "introduction, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge ("middle eight"), verse, chorus and outro".

Twelve-bar blues: "The twelve-bar blues or blues changes is one of the most prominent chord progressions in popular music. The blues progression has a distinctive form in lyrics, phrase, chord structure, and duration. In its basic form, it is predominantly based on the I, IV, and V chords of a key."

IMHO I would add that a boring symphony, boring pop song, or a boring EDM track, is not the fault of using patterns. Rather it is the result of a lack of imagination by the composer.

What you describe here is the form of different styles. A pattern within those styles is at best on a meta meta level (except for the blues), but the pattern we are talking about here are on the level of a bar or some of them. A single repeat sign does not make a pattern. Three is minimum but would still be too short to be recognized as such...; - )
Of course you can write brilliant music with patterns. Bolero comes to mind immediately - just magic...