Why a C6 is not an Am7?

[Stamped Records]

Lately I've been putting a lot of effort into naming chords and into being aware of what scale degree my current chord is.

I'm not 100% sure what prevents a C6 from being an Am7 in first inversion.

Does it depend on the chord that follows it?

I'm composing here by the way, not trying to figure out chords of other music.

Thanks.

[excuse me please]

To make a long story short: depends on the root note.
E-G-A-C could be perceived as an Em sus4 #5 chord. As G-A-C-E could be perceived as a G 6/9 sus 4 chord. Especially when the root note is about an octave lower.

[Stamped Records]

Are you referring to the root of the chord, or the lowest note?

[excuse me please]

The lowest note. Sorry, my bad.

[jancivil]

To make a long story short: depends on the root note.
E-G-A-C could be perceived as an Em sus4 #5 chord. As G-A-C-E could be perceived as a G 6/9 sus 4 chord.

Yeah, no. Occam's Razor, fewest assumptions makes best sense, and both of those are tortured.
For an E harmony, you have a 'sus4' and a 3rd, and there is no reason for that name when there is a simple (and coherent) answer.
#5, augmented 5th, this just isn't. E G B# as your basic triad is going to be "perceived" as a C major triad in first inversion, in pretty much every case which can even occur.
Augmented fifth derives from augmented triad which assumes a major third. E G# B# or C E G#, or G# B# Dx.
E to C, any E to any C is a SIXTH. 1 2 3 4 5 6. E, any E, to any B is a FIFTH. 1 2 3 4 5, count 'em. But functionally, in any sense, making a clear simple triad into these kinds of fancy-looking deals is wrong-headed, there is no call and_no_use_case for it.

G A C E; where is the 9th? The only part of this which measures out to '9th', or 2nd is G A. This is not a G triad to begin with, in any stretch of the imagination.

Also the statement "depends on the root note" doesn't sort the question at all, as the question essentially _is_ what is the root note.

You've managed to make the waters less clear than they were. Frankly, I recommend strongly to stop trying to show off because this is not coherent. I'm unable to soft-soap this at the moment. You're leading the OP and anyone that reads who may have the same questions into a blind alley to no good purpose.



The difference between the two actual possibilities here is function and/or expectation stylistically. In C major, C major chord add 6 is tonic, functionally. In jazz an add6 is not exotic. In pop music, not uncommon.
In common practice period harmony, it's probably not the tonic chord. In G, Am7 is the ii chord; subdominant function. In CPP, typically ii in first inversion. Pop music and the jazz derived from popular song has seen ii-V- with great frequency. In any case first inversion ii provides a clear subdominant for the move to dominant function. i7, tonic chord with 7th adds this extra color to the tonic chord. It may mean a new ii7 in circular jazz function.

While you say it's not for analyzing other music, it's impossible to make the distinction for you in your music which I have no examples of. I can't be sure why it matters, in other words. When you have to convey to another musician, it may, or may not matter and then it matters basically to them. If you want to know why they would be different, it matters in extant music for reasons, which I touch on there.

In C, Am7 is the vi chord, also known as tonic function only not the basic one (kind of a secondary tonic, which is down to use case again). Does it feel like an A harmony? Does it feel like a C harmony. Kind of just up to you, with these small caveats.

[IncarnateX]

Yes to C major add 6 is percieved as tonic in C major (with a little tension that may need dissolvement or not according to style). The well tempered scale has brought what appears as relativism to our notation system but it is an illusion as the most appropriate notation depends on tonal context: no need to suggest that an inverted c major six chord should be notated as anything but exactly that if we are in bloody c major. It is not percieved as a minor chord in that context and as Jan pinpointed, you missed the simple fact that a sus chord can be neither minor nor major, because it has no friggin third.

[Stamped Records]

The presence of the minor 3rd did confuse me for the Esus4 example I have to say.

So, basically what you're saying is that the function of the chord is my choice and that whatever function I choose is what gives it it's name.

So, if I went to an F chord immediately following this, would that suggest a V6 chord to you? Or maybe an I6 move to IV?

I'm not really content with guessing but I suppose as long as I experiment with voicing and the selected notes are correct, the name doesn't matter, right? But wouldn't that affect my ability to stay in line with tonal harmony?

[IncarnateX]

So, basically what you're saying is that the function of the chord is my choice and that whatever function I choose is what gives it it's name.

Not exactly, the function will - as Jan points out- depend on what key you are in in the first place, e.g. C major or E minor?

Or maybe an I6 move to IV?

Yes, it would but it is not a question of what immediately preceeds or follows but the tonal context as a whole, e.g. in C major, F major will be percieved as the subdominant chord while it certainly will not in Em, where it will turn the mode into phrygian E minor.

[excuse me please]

I stand corrected; it's not my problem people can't read.

[LoveEnigma18]

I think this recent video by MangoldProject was made for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbxNIDhGMoU

[excuse me please]

Listen, I wish you guys good luck with your compositions. In the year 2929....

[IncarnateX]

Listen, I wish you guys good luck with your compositions. In the year 2929....

Meaning what? Don’t be a bad sport now. You messed up, was corrected and if you have anything to add, it should be an excuse, so you can be excused like your name suggests, and not make chords that hard to read for you or anyone else in the future.

[jancivil]

I stand corrected; it's not my problem people can't read.

Your two chord names I addressed are basically just incompetence on parade. Get lost.

[jancivil]

The presence of the minor 3rd did confuse me for the Esus4 example I have to say.

So, basically what you're saying is that the function of the chord is my choice and that whatever function I choose is what gives it it's name.

Basically yes, the name here follows function.

So, if I went to an F chord immediately following this, would that suggest a V6 chord to you? Or maybe an I6 move to IV?

I'm not really content with guessing but I suppose as long as I experiment with voicing and the selected notes are correct, the name doesn't matter, right? But wouldn't that affect my ability to stay in line with tonal harmony?

Ok for a more CPP example: you have an E7 chord with the 7th in the bass (this is called a 2 chord, as the bass is a '2' from the root; 4/2 is the figured bass sign) and the D moves down to C in your C G A E; that's an A minor harmony, add 7.

In G major, if it's going to D major, it could be either Am7 (figured bass 6/5) or C add6 (I tend to do 'add6' to avoid confusion with a '6 chord' which is a first inversion triad.) because it's subdominant function either way.
I'm providing figured bass just in case, as it's important in voice-leading considerations ultimately. You can probably work out from my explanation of '2 chord' how the others work.

[jancivil]

It would only suggest to me a V of F if we're in F (though probably not); ie., for it to be V of IV I would expect a V7 because we need more tension for the implication to hold, really. So I-IV is preferable in my assessment, but just from this I don't know why it can't be vi6/5; in F, iii6/5.

For me, and again re the 'add6' designation, a 6th added to a major triad is less compelling than the simpler explanation unless its context is that add6 is stylistic.

At this point you may note that in both 'classical' (CPP) usage and in pop/jazz both are called '6th chords'.
A lot of the time the difference is going to be pedantic.