how to control VSTHost with a midi controller?

[badgrplayer]

Hello,

I used VSThost to play some effects with my guitar but I also started to have fun with keyboards plugins and figured, what the hell?, why not using a real keyboard instead of my mouse?

So I've bought a cheap keyboard (miditech MT-49) and I try to understand how it works (the manual is not always very clear, some pages are missing actually).

I plug the keyboard from the midi out to the USB port of my computer.
I use ASIO4All as the wave device.
I select USB audio midi (or something) in "Midi Input" and that's pretty much it. My miditech keyboard is recognized. I can play music.

Now, I'd like to have more control and this is where it's getting problematic.

For instance, I have two plugin (synth1 and noisemo). How can I make the miditech to use synth1 only, or noisemo only or both at the same time?

I've set vsthost to filter any channel but the 1 and the 2.
I've set synth1 to filter out any channel but channel 1 and noisemo to filter out any channel but channel 2.

What I expected was that miditech would select synth01 on channel 1 and play noisemo on channel 2 and no sound at all when I select any other channel.

Indeed, only synth01 is played on channel 01 but when I select channel 02, it plays both plugins. And when I select any other channel, it still works even if it's not supposed to.

And sometimes some note keep ringing even if I don't press them. Sometimes it's in one plugin, sometimes both. It's not regular.

What I'm supposed to do?

Also, I've started to look into the CC. I want to put the volume up and down. So I selected CC 07 and move the modulation wheel and indeed the volume knob move in the plugins but not like the wheel. When it's on the max it goes to the min and sometimes it's on the middle and also I have a feeling that moving the wheel doesn't affet only the volume but all the sound as well...

I don't know where to start. So far I can only play note and change programs.

By the way, how can I be sure that the Keyboard only the presets of the plugins and not his own presets ?
I've seen that I could select "local on/off" on CC 0 and 32 but... according to the manual there's only CC 1-31, then 33-95.
There's 119 CC in total.

It's my first keyboard, I'm lost.

[tapper mike]

You never mentioned what host you are using...

Regarding CC values. Very few if anyone assigns cc values to internal keyboard sounds. On computers there is a thing called.... Midi Learn. Right click on a parameter (such as volume) in you plugin and select midi learn. Then move a knob or fader around. It will catch and learn what knob you want to do what with.

[badgrplayer]

I'm using Herman Seib's vsthost.

There's a midi config for VSTHost + for each plugins.

On the first tab there's a "filter settings" for the input midi device and on the last tab a "remote control port" where there's what your talking about.
If I understand well, the remote control port" .

There's several settings that look more or less the same to me and I don't know if I should configure everything or just one of them.

For instance. There's the menu in MIDI Parameters (with "midi input devices", "filter settings" "remote control port", "midi clock output"...) that's global for the whole VSThosts.

Then, on each plugin you can click on the "Midi" button and it opens a menu with "midi input devices" (with "filters" and "transformation" settings) "midi output devices" "remote control port")

But also, in the "plugins" menu there"s "midi settings" (the same) and "MIDI - > Parameters" which looks a lot like "Remote control port" but apparently isn't, and "Parameters -> MIDI" which, again, look similar but is not.

When he says "In addition to passing MIDI messages to the loaded PlugIns, VSTHost can be remotely controlled by MIDI messages, too." I don't know what the difference between "passing midi messages" and "being remotely controlled by MIDI messages".

[jancivil]

"MIDI input devices" = add your controller(s), in either case. "Filter..." is in all likelihood global setting for filters in synths or like that. I don't know what that is per global vs specifically per whatever is hosted by VST Host, which I do not have. But "passing MIDI messages" would appear to mean passing it from something in a plugin or external instrument (where the MIDI originates), vs the data (message) originating from a ("remote", ie., external) controller.

[badgrplayer]

"MIDI input devices" = add your controller(s), in either case.

Yep, that's what I did. USB2.0-midi (and not "usb audio midi" as I previously and wrongly said) is my device. It's using the microsoft drivers because there's no Windows 7 drivers from Miditech. It's an old keyboard.
And I use ASIO4All as well.

I didn't change the "midi output" "midi clock" and "midi thru" menu and I don't know if I should. At some point I installed the "LoopBe1 internal midi port" in "midi thru" but it didn't seem to make a difference so I stopped.

But "passing MIDI messages" would appear to mean passing it from something in a plugin or external instrument (where the MIDI originates), vs the data (message) originating from a ("remote", ie., external) controller.

Oh yes, that makes sense. There's a virtual keyboard in VSThost as well. I should have think of it.

Thanks for helping.

[jancivil]

If you're getting MIDI coming through to instruments chained subsequently from VSTHost, you need to ensure MIDI Thru. Other than that, I'd have to see it. Don't fix what ain't broke, though.

If you don't have any purpose to alter MIDI Clock don't fug with it. I mean to use MIDI clock at all; if you don't, by default it would tend to not put it into action.

[badgrplayer]

If you're getting MIDI coming through to instruments chained subsequently from VSTHost, you need to ensure MIDI Thru.

I intend to use 4 or 5 different VST Synth together.

Right now I have only two of them. They're not chained together, they're both chained to the output engine.

clav.jpg

I wonder if it's not better to chain them subsequently, as you say, with only the last one chained to the output engine. But there's no midi thru settings for the plug-ins (that's weird), it's only a general settings in vsthost. I guess it's because midi thru is only for real devices, not virtual one.
As you can see I also have Midicurve and Midimonitor but I'm still in the process of understanding how they work. Or, to be more accurate, how I can use all the info they give...

[jancivil]

No, for instance Kontakt has in Options, MIDI to outside world

[jancivil]

This is modularity, you could have a series or subsequence in a chain. I work with a DAW in the usual boring paradigm (where it's parallel, not in series typically) so there is nothing to worry about, sending the same note-ons to several things at once is the simplest of matters. But there you see that the script in the instrument may be sent to the outside, ie., a script generating a sequence of notes, or generating control codes data may trigger and/or control something on the outside along with the incoming control codes or notes.

[badgrplayer]

Thank you. I've read a couple of things about MIDI here and there but I still don't understand everything.
I don't understand why my keyboard send data on channel 1 when it's set on channel 2.

channel.jpg

How can I know if it's a problem of setting or a problem with my keyboard. Is there a test for that?

[jancivil]

It's more likely that it's the controller, but not necessarily. These things default to channel 1. For a simple keyboard controller I don't bother with it as I'm setting input in the DAW and it doesn't matter, all the note on data lands on the track (and I tend to only do more after the fact of the original input; pitch bend is one exception and it's always ended up on the right track). if you're getting note on to channel one when you intend it for ch 2, that's a very basic problem to sort out. I don't know that controller but it would tend to have settings available. You may have to google for it. My keybd controller's control settings involve knowing something, in the operator's manual if not finding it online, it isn't obvious or apparent otherwise.

[jancivil]

TL;DR: if you have not set the controller to channel 2 it's sending it to channel 1. I sort it in the host; it may be that this host is not quite sorting it.

[badgrplayer]

You're very fast at answering, thanks.

Well, I do like they say in my MT-49 manual. I press CHANNEL switch, I enter number "2", led changes to "2".
All midi data from my keyboard to my computer should be sent on channel 2 only, right?
Also, synth01 doesn't select the right bank. In my keyboard I select bank 10, program 8; my vst plugins synth01 selects program 7 (it's annoying that the plugin count from 1 to 128 and my keyboard from 0 to 127, but ok) on bank 99.

Midi Monitor display the correct message though :

B1 00 0A Ch.2 CC #0 (Bank Select), Value: 10
90 20 05 Ch.1 Note On: G#0 (32), Velocity: 5
C1 08 Ch.2 Program Change: 9
C1 07 Ch.2 Program Change: 8

Well almost. I have no idea where this Note On comes from. I didn't touch any key at all, only the buttons. And I don't know why he sents "prog change 9" before "prog change 8". He seems to do it all the time. It makes the changing from one program to another quite slow.

On the other hand, some stuff work like they should. I filtered the pitch bend on my plugins and it works. The pitch bend has no effect. And why I send CC 120, sound is off.

[tapper mike]

All controllers send data on channel one. It's not midi note information though. Channel one handles global data. This is why a number of mpe devices prefer to ignore channel one for midi note information. (artiphon instrument one for example) sends note values on channels 2 thru 7

[jancivil]

All controllers send data on channel one. It's not midi note information though. Channel one handles global data.

Except when you tell it to use another channel. I don't know, maybe there are still crippled controllers being sold, but I have one cheap one called Nektar Impact what can haz any of the usual 16 as global MIDI channel. I'm sure I have set M-Audio Oxygen to other {global} channels than 1 in the past.

Channel Assign: The Channel Assign function assigns a knob, fader, button, wheel, or the sustain pedal to a specific MIDI channel.

When assigned to channel "0", the control (knob, fader, button, wheel, or sustain pedal) will transmit on the Global MIDI Channel.
[...]

Global Channel: The Global Channel function (Global Chan) sets the default MIDI channel for the keyboard and all MIDI controls, except for those that have a specific MIDI channel assigned to them.

Press the Edit button.
2. Press the Global Channel key. The LED display will show the current Global channel. For example, if channel 1is the current Global channel, it will appear as "c.0.1".
3. Enter the new channel number using the number keys.
4. Press the Enter key.

This is why a number of mpe devices prefer to ignore channel one for midi note information. (artiphon instrument one for example) sends note values on channels 2 thru 7

With MPE mode ON in Equator, one channel (usually Ch1) is reserved for Global Controller messages and so doesn't respond to notes.

However if in, eg., ROLI Equator MIDI Settings you were to specify channels 3-16: