2CAudio Precedence | 1.5 | Move Out Of Flatland. Take Precedence.

[sqigls]

Got some great results today using Precedence on a piccolo trumpet recorded in mono, now it sounds wide and open, before it sounded thin and tinny.

you could get great results with an empty tin can and a spoon

[Andrew Souter]

Simon does not need a spoon!

[experimental.crow]

Simon does not need a spoon!

there is no spoon ...

[Sampleconstruct]

I dig forks though.

[SJ_Digriz]

I've been told that I am an impressive knife and fork man. But, it was not in the context of music.

[Caine123]

i love the reverbs but how is PREDECENSE compared to PANAGEMENT from auburn? it seems to cover it too? + the modulation seems smooth(er) in PANAGEMENT

https://www.auburnsounds.com/products/Panagement.html

[XComposer]

i love the reverbs but how is PREDECENSE compared to PANAGEMENT from auburn? it seems to cover it too? + the modulation seems smooth(er) in PANAGEMENT

https://www.auburnsounds.com/products/Panagement.html

I was speaking about that on page 9 of this thread.

[Caine123]

2caudio i would buy predecense asap over the others but can you make modulation smooth or not? I got the big bundle and it would be great.

i love the reverbs but how is PREDECENSE compared to PANAGEMENT from auburn? it seems to cover it too? + the modulation seems smooth(er) in PANAGEMENT

https://www.auburnsounds.com/products/Panagement.html

I was speaking about that on page 9 of this thread.

Thx a lot. I have to check myself the stereo timbres and modulations if it is in panagement smooth or not.

[Cinebient]

It really like it more and more and is so fast and easy to set-up.
Another example of 6 arps layered each with it´s own Precedence and Breeze 2 insert.
First just 3 arps, then i add another 3 on top. Then i start with one and repeat the midi pattern and just add one more each time until i got 6 layers again.
Good headphones or speakers recommended:
https://soundcloud.com/user-790535032/6 ... talization

[Andrew Souter]

2caudio i would buy predecense asap over the others but can you make modulation smooth or not? I got the big bundle and it would be great.

Thx a lot. I have to check myself the stereo timbres and modulations if it is in panagement smooth or not.

By modulation do you actually mean modulation (as is internal modulation form internal LFOs and various time varying behavior), or do you mean automation (as in the response to parameter changes from the host parameter control system)?

If you mean modulation, it is indeed already "smoother"/"cleaner" than all modulation I know of on the market. It is 64bit dsp, and modulation does not production any artifacts whatsoever down to ridiculously low noise floors approaching -300dB. it is so low you can not even measure it with standard tools -- it is far below the resolution of 32-bit floating point precision. Feed it a sine wave, crank modulation, look at the spectrum. Find any spectral pollution (i.e. noise)? Nope. Only a gentle widening of the freq band around whatever freq you send it. Try this with other spatial tools that offer modulation including verbs. You will be surprised by what you find both with you eyes in an analyzer and even with your ears. Our modulation in Precedence and Breeze 2 is ridiculously clean/"smooth", and it is close the limits of single precision in Aether and B2 as well, which is already extreme.

If you actually mean its response to "automation", then unfortunately the answer is generally smooth automation is not currently supported, and we do not intend to support it in the immediate future. Here is more info on that from the upcoming manual:

Position Display/Control

The Position Display is the primary functional GUI object in Precedence. It serves to wrap two parameters, Distance and Angle, into a single control whose values are mapped to Rho and Theta polar coordinates respectively. If that sounds excessively mathematical, don’t worry; it is actually extremely intuitive. The Position Display contains the Position Node circle, which can be dragged to different locations within the Position Display, simultaneously changing the Distance and Angle parameter values:

• Moving the Position Node farther from the center increases the Distance parameter value
• Moving the Position Node closer to the center decreases the Distance parameter value
• Moving the Position Node clockwise in an arc (to the right) increases the Angle parameter value
• Moving the Position Node counter-clockwise in an arc (to the left) decreases the Angle parameter value

As you can see, simply by moving the Position node you can easily control both lateral left-to-right “azimuth” of the source sound, as well as its apparent distance to the listener.
The Position Node can be changed in several ways:

• Dragging it manually without key-combination provides the standard mouse tracking
• Dragging it manually while holding down the shift key provides a fine tuning mode
• The keyboard up & down arrows will increase/decrease the Distance value in 5% increments
• The keyboard left & right arrows will increase/decrease the Angle value in 5% increments
• Combining the shift-key modifier with the above keyboard commands allows 0.5% increments to Distance and Angle
• A mouse-click anywhere within the Position Display will move the Position Node to the mouse location

NOTE: Precedence is designed as a positioning tool not a motion FX tool. We may attempt to make a fully automatable motion FX tool at some point but it will likely require a lot more CPU resources, and significant design changes. Precedence is primarily for virtual stage positioning where we expect many light-weight instances to be used in parallel as a replacement for traditional track panners. Smooth modulation and motion are limited to the internal modulation process.

Most parameters in Precedence are non-continuous in nature and simply cannot automate smoothly from user and host input because they change in discrete manners. This is true of the Distance and Angle parameters, and therefore when the Position Node is updated in Precedence by manually dragging it to a new location, simultaneously updating the Distance and Angle parameter values, a series of discrete updates will occur. Precedence will perform these updates as quickly as your CPU allows, creating many such updates per second. Each update will result in a small click as various algorithm internals are updated and memory objects are cleared. On fast computers, the update rate may be so fast that the resulting rapid generation of small update clicks may sound like “stuttering” or "buffer noise".

Tip: There is an alternative to avoid the potential aforementioned "noisy updates": in the Position Display you can click anywhere and the Position Node will instantly jump to this new location with only one update and only one very minor click. To reiterate: if you drag circle manually Precedence will attempt to make as many updates as possible as quickly as your CPU allows, and each update generates one small click. Therefore if you perform many updates by dragging the circle it will generate many clicks, sounding something like stuttering as explained above. If you find this update noise objectionable, try the single-click method to jump to new positions. It is generally free of unwanted update noise. The keyboard commands are also a good option to try.

Basically smooth automation of position would require about 4 times as much CPU usage as a rough guesstimate, and makes it very hard to do some of the cool secret sauce stuff we have going on in the alg. It would be better for us to make a separate product that focuses specifically on the goal of "I want to have things fly around in space as freakily as my heart desires", complete with doppler etc. You probably don't want to run 100 of these in parallel, as you might with Precedence, so high CPU could be acceptable in such cases since it is a limited usage case mostly for special FX.

[sqigls]

niiIIIIIIIICE

MY heart desires

[Caine123]

2caudio i would buy predecense asap over the others but can you make modulation smooth or not? I got the big bundle and it would be great.

Thx a lot. I have to check myself the stereo timbres and modulations if it is in panagement smooth or not.

By modulation do you actually mean modulation (as is internal modulation form internal LFOs and various time varying behavior), or do you mean automation (as in the response to parameter changes from the host parameter control system)?

If you mean modulation, it is indeed already "smoother"/"cleaner" than all modulation I know of on the market. It is 64bit dsp, and modulation does not production any artifacts whatsoever down to ridiculously low noise floors approaching -300dB. it is so low you can not even measure it with standard tools -- it is far below the resolution of 32-bit floating point precision. Feed it a sine wave, crank modulation, look at the spectrum. Find any spectral pollution (i.e. noise)? Nope. Only a gentle widening of the freq band around whatever freq you send it. Try this with other spatial tools that offer modulation including verbs. You will be surprised by what you find both with you eyes in an analyzer and even with your ears. Our modulation in Precedence and Breeze 2 is ridiculously clean/"smooth", and it is close the limits of single precision in Aether and B2 as well, which is already extreme.

If you actually mean its response to "automation", then unfortunately the answer is generally smooth automation is not currently supported, and we do not intend to support it in the immediate future. Here is more info on that from the upcoming manual:

Position Display/Control

The Position Display is the primary functional GUI object in Precedence. It serves to wrap two parameters, Distance and Angle, into a single control whose values are mapped to Rho and Theta polar coordinates respectively. If that sounds excessively mathematical, don’t worry; it is actually extremely intuitive. The Position Display contains the Position Node circle, which can be dragged to different locations within the Position Display, simultaneously changing the Distance and Angle parameter values:

• Moving the Position Node farther from the center increases the Distance parameter value
• Moving the Position Node closer to the center decreases the Distance parameter value
• Moving the Position Node clockwise in an arc (to the right) increases the Angle parameter value
• Moving the Position Node counter-clockwise in an arc (to the left) decreases the Angle parameter value

As you can see, simply by moving the Position node you can easily control both lateral left-to-right “azimuth” of the source sound, as well as its apparent distance to the listener.
The Position Node can be changed in several ways:

• Dragging it manually without key-combination provides the standard mouse tracking
• Dragging it manually while holding down the shift key provides a fine tuning mode
• The keyboard up & down arrows will increase/decrease the Distance value in 5% increments
• The keyboard left & right arrows will increase/decrease the Angle value in 5% increments
• Combining the shift-key modifier with the above keyboard commands allows 0.5% increments to Distance and Angle
• A mouse-click anywhere within the Position Display will move the Position Node to the mouse location

NOTE: Precedence is designed as a positioning tool not a motion FX tool. We may attempt to make a fully automatable motion FX tool at some point but it will likely require a lot more CPU resources, and significant design changes. Precedence is primarily for virtual stage positioning where we expect many light-weight instances to be used in parallel as a replacement for traditional track panners. Smooth modulation and motion are limited to the internal modulation process.

Most parameters in Precedence are non-continuous in nature and simply cannot automate smoothly from user and host input because they change in discrete manners. This is true of the Distance and Angle parameters, and therefore when the Position Node is updated in Precedence by manually dragging it to a new location, simultaneously updating the Distance and Angle parameter values, a series of discrete updates will occur. Precedence will perform these updates as quickly as your CPU allows, creating many such updates per second. Each update will result in a small click as various algorithm internals are updated and memory objects are cleared. On fast computers, the update rate may be so fast that the resulting rapid generation of small update clicks may sound like “stuttering” or "buffer noise".

Tip: There is an alternative to avoid the potential aforementioned "noisy updates": in the Position Display you can click anywhere and the Position Node will instantly jump to this new location with only one update and only one very minor click. To reiterate: if you drag circle manually Precedence will attempt to make as many updates as possible as quickly as your CPU allows, and each update generates one small click. Therefore if you perform many updates by dragging the circle it will generate many clicks, sounding something like stuttering as explained above. If you find this update noise objectionable, try the single-click method to jump to new positions. It is generally free of unwanted update noise. The keyboard commands are also a good option to try.

Basically smooth automation of position would require about 4 times as much CPU usage as a rough guesstimate, and makes it very hard to do some of the cool secret sauce stuff we have going on in the alg. It would be better for us to make a separate product that focuses specifically on the goal of "I want to have things fly around in space as freakily as my heart desires", complete with doppler etc. You probably don't want to run 100 of these in parallel, as you might with Precedence, so high CPU could be acceptable in such cases since it is a limited usage case mostly for special FX.

many many thanks andrew!
i think i kinda mixd things up, i just demo it and i dunno if i need it ;D, but it seems very cool, though i playd through the presets and a lot of them make the samples (a drumloop) not monocompatible. this is something i need to learn because i dont understand why use settings which destroy the monocompatibility

[jens]

Everyone needs it!

[TheSteven]

Basically smooth automation of position would require about 4 times as much CPU usage as a rough guesstimate, and makes it very hard to do some of the cool secret sauce stuff we have going on in the alg. It would be better for us to make a separate product that focuses specifically on the goal of "I want to have things fly around in space as freakily as my heart desires", complete with doppler etc. You probably don't want to run 100 of these in parallel, as you might with Precedence, so high CPU could be acceptable in such cases since it is a limited usage case mostly for special FX.

Nice but more practical would be having Precedence / Breeze be able to dynamically (and smoothly) move something near to far or vice versa. It's an effect that I've manually had to create multiple times, either on a track or whole mix of fading into or out of the distance.
This ability should be part the Precedence / Breeze connection ability - if it requires a lot of CPU usage then maybe create an alternative VST dll version or require a higher sampling mode for 'smoothness'.

In regards to doppler - I too see it mostly being used as a special effect in film work or rave concerts but not a lot in music production; like synths that make vowel sounds - the first time you hear a song with it you'll go WOW and then on every other song it becomes trite.
On the other hand tying the doppler's pitch effect to automation so you could use it to control a filter's cutoff or resonance while being able to turn of it's audio properties might be really cool.

[noou]

Nice but more practical would be having Precedence / Breeze be able to dynamically (and smoothly) move something near to far or vice versa. It's an effect that I've manually had to create multiple times, either on a track or whole mix of fading into or out of the distance.
This ability should be part the Precedence / Breeze connection ability - if it requires a lot of CPU usage then maybe create an alternative VST dll version or require a higher sampling mode for 'smoothness'.

amen!