Why the iLok hate?

[himalaya]

Well.. at the same time you suggest that noone professional uses dongles, because you know 2 or 3 professionals who don't. Eventide or Exponential Audio are very popular brands, and both use iLok. There'll be loads of professionals using iLok protected stuff.

No. I don't suggest anything of the sort. Please read my post. I provide a real life evidence that some pros stay away from dongles. Then I state that others do use dongles. That is all. My posts serves to bring balance to an erroneous opinion, so please do not misrepresent my post.

However, since you bring up specific company names, I can tell you that these guys use Valhalla reverbs, no Exponential stuff in sight.

[chk071]

Well.. at the same time you suggest that noone professional uses dongles, because you know 2 or 3 professionals who don't. Eventide or Exponential Audio are very popular brands, and both use iLok. There'll be loads of professionals using iLok protected stuff.

No. I don't suggest anything of the sort. Please read my post. I provide a real life evidence that some pros stay away from dongles. Then I state that others do use dongles. That is all. My posts serves to bring balance to an erroneous opinion, so please do not misrepresent my post.

Ok, fair enough, i apologize. This sounded a tad like you were suggesting that this was a standard among pros:

What you will find lately, is that world class producers have their own laptops, and that is what they carry around with them, and not a single dongle that they then need to use on somebody else's computer. People like this choose the path of least resistance, so no dongles, as they have all the pitfalls which I have outlined in my first post in this thread.

[JunSev]

There's plenty of companies who thrive despite having minimal protection. Image-Line is prime example. Fruityloops is probably the most pirated piece of music software and yet they have been in business for decades.

Which doesn't prove that it would work for everyone. There are enough examples of companies which headed to more restrictive copy protections, Adobe for example.

I also wonder how many legit users Image-Line/FL Studio really has. And how much the company grew over the years. Doesn't look like much, TBH.

Definitely Image line has grown a lot, and instead to be concerned to put a worse CP scheme to their users, they fight the bad guys in a different way, they absolutely go and seek those that are doing illegal activities and their websites, is not intrusive and perhaps not the most "secure CP scheme" in your eyes but it works for them and many many others.

You don't see that because you will turn any evidence or facts that is against the Copy protection you are in favor and sadly love so much

[simmo75]

Well.. at the same time you suggest that noone professional uses dongles, because you know 2 or 3 professionals who don't. Eventide or Exponential Audio are very popular brands, and both use iLok. There'll be loads of professionals using iLok protected stuff.

No. I don't suggest anything of the sort. Please read my post. I provide a real life evidence that some pros stay away from dongles. Then I state that others do use dongles. That is all. My posts serves to bring balance to an erroneous opinion, so please do not misrepresent my post.

However, since you bring up specific company names, I can tell you that these guys use Valhalla reverbs, no Exponential stuff in sight.

My opinion wasn’t supposed to upset you mate.
I should of added ‘in my opinion’ and I find it very useful. Sorry if I offended any hobbiests, I was trying to outline a positive use for a dongle. Sheesh...

[himalaya]

hehe, you did not upset me. How did you glean that from my post?
You provided an opinion, I replied with some real life facts, as experienced by me.

[sfd]

One lad said he dislikes iLok because of practical reasons. It doesn't fit his likes / needs / habits. That's legit - check.

Another bloke said he'd some technical issues (the server was down). That happens - legit - check.

A few others mentioned various combinations of the above. Legit - check.

It's like most things in life. Some likes blondes, others prefer brunettes.

Or, if you like, some likes Heavy Metal , others like Hip Hop - and a few with extraordinary good taste prefer my music


Then we come to the topic of this thread. - why the iLok....hate ?

Here we have this Messiah who's on a religious / political mission.

And as usual - if we refuse to see the light we'll burn in hell. However he'll respectfully pray for us.

And so, as somebody already said in an earlier comment - there's not much to add to it.

(If you'd like to discuss CP in general or do some brainstorming in search of alternative solutions . open a thread for that)


iLok is there. Like it or not. Take it or leave it.

In case anyone would opt for a revolution. Fine, do that. Put your yellow west on and go and protest outside iLok / Pace's headquarter or whatever.

( Btw, iLok is used by far more companies then plug-in developers. )

Now, it's NOT that I want to kill a discussion. But when you come to a point where anyone with a common sense clearly understands that the opponent is - that - i.e somebody who won't agree with you even if you hit him in his head with your arguments for two thousand years - and you still continue. Then you're just f*****g annoying.

Anyone doing that is either extremely religious, disrespectful or have an extraordinary weak self confidence so that he won't be able to sleep unless you see the light - his light.

Besides - that sort of behavior won't bring the discussion forward.

It also contributes to give KVR a certain reputation...

I'm just sayin' ....

[Aloysius]

In a recent study a specialist team discovered that 99% of users love iLok, 1/2% don't know and 1/2% hate it. The facts are on our side (according to an anonymous source).

[audiojunkie]

Fact: Windows, Mac, and Linux each has its strengths and weaknesses. What a person chooses is a personal decision based on needs, wants, etc. Which is better is directly related to the person’s own needs.

Fact: Analog and digital are different variations to the vast sound palette. There is no superior—only difference. What is used depends on the person’s goals, desires, needs, etc. It is entirely subjective.

Fact: People will always have their own personal preferences (and their own personal reasons for those preferences) when it comes to copy protection. I’ve liked the posts where people gave their personal reasons for why they prefer the copy protection they prefer. The personal reasons have been enlightening. However, if everyone leaves ego, arrogance and superiority behind, the thread can be more pleasant and useful.

The OP asked “Why the iLok hate?” but didn’t ask for evangelical fundamentalistic arguing and hate. Let’s just get along.

P.S. I’m still several pages from catching up on the reading of this thread, so if the war has already ended and peace has once again come to the land, then please disregard this post and move along peacefully as if I said nothing.

[Ttsnate]

What a terrible thing to put paying customers through. I've had licences not recognised, licenses not transfer to upgraded computers, projects crashing when ilok is down and a plugin won't open, having to use more resources just to use a plugin, having to spend money on extra usb connectivity.

Its just awful that companies put their clients through all that and basically make the customer responsible for guarding IP. Ironically, I know a lot of producers that would pay for a product but pirate it instead to avoid the ilok plague. Lmfao!

I've saved a lot of money and headache avoiding iLok using vst companies and have helped so many others do the same.
Thank god Soundtoys got wise and ditched it. I bought the whole 5 bundle straight away!

[digitalboytn]

I don't hate iLok...

I just dislike it so intensely that I no longer use any plugins that rely on that "protection" system...

The good news is that there are many great plugins out there that don't use iLok,so I live in an iLok free zone and my world is still spinning around just fine

[kritikon]

I'm pretty ambivalent about the actual iLok system - at least the dongle one. I've always used a dongle since 1989 so it's just part of the scenery for me. As for the company itself - I avoid anything that uses iLok purely because historically they come from PACE - which was an ugly protection system used by an ugly company who had a pretty hostile customer ideology. I use eLicenser, would consider any other dongles, but long ago made the decision that I wouldn't touch anything by PACE. Generally I don't hold grudges against any particular companies and they have to be pretty nasty to go on my avoid list. Sony are the same - got badly bitten by their hostile attitude towards their basically faulty DAT machines in the past - they charged hefty prices then refused outright to fix them because they said any musician using them was "pro", and they wouldn't back their "consumer" machines. Even though many of us were never pro and seriously looked after our kit better than a standard consumer would (and used them less too).

ILok are in the same bunch. Filth who parade as legit businesses. Hostile to customers. I suspect iLok are entirely different nowadays and have cleaned up their act and their product and the sociopaths who used to run it have moved on, but once filth always filth, so I won't ever buy iLok just because of who they were. It's historical and I hold a grudge admittedly. Fine by me. I might miss out on some potential product - too bad. I'm not going to support a company that burned me though even if I might be being childish.

The dongle is fine. The problem is/was PACE.

[BONES]

Yet you'll happily support Behringer while they rip off Korg and other companies. Interesting.

What a terrible thing to put paying customers through. I've had licences not recognised, licenses not transfer to upgraded computers, projects crashing when ilok is down and a plugin won't open, having to use more resources just to use a plugin, having to spend money on extra usb connectivity.

I've only ever had one minor problem, with iLok not recognising my Vacuum Pro license, which iLok fixed for me in a few hours. Beyond that one issue, I find it saves me so much time and hassle when I'm setting up a new computer. I used to think it was a bad idea but I am a total convert, at least as far as software iLok is concerned. I don't have anything that requires the dongle and I would probably draw the line at that but I mostly see iLok as an advantage these days.

[escalona]

I have absolutely no problem iLok and I'm probably among the ??% who never had a problem with it.

[kritikon]

Yet you'll happily support Behringer while they rip off Korg and other companies. Interesting.

2 quite distinct replies to that:

1. Behringer aren't ripping them off - if they were why haven't Korg, Roland etc done anything about it? Roland have already beaten Behringer in court once and they have the wherewithal to take a heavy fight to Behringer if they wanted to,..in fact they'd wipe the floor with them if they had a legal case. Same with Korg - they're not a small helpless company. But they don't. I can only infer they aren't aggrieved or simply don't have a legal case . Roland have been aggrieved by lots of other companies in the past and are not in the slightest afraid of making it known.
Your moral argument is a circular pointless one - your morals are not my morals and vice versa and no matter how much you think you're right, I think I'm right in exactly the same way. Banging one's head against a brick wall persistently can be seen as self harm y'know? We won't agree.

2. I have issues against the odd company or 2, but that is because of their behaviour towards me the customer, not what they sell or how they sell it or how much it costs. Have you ever seriously heard of abusive behaviour towards customers from Behringer? In the same league as PACE or Sony? From what I've heard and experienced they actually have quite good customer service. They've sold me reliable well-built gear that does what I want it to do and mostly sounds great.

[DJErmac]

I have absolutely no problem iLok and I'm probably among the ??% who never had a problem with it.

Same here. Zero problem so far. 149 products. Very happy not to have to enter a f¤*#!ùg serial number everytime I install a plugin.