KVR Audio

jones-y · Post by **jones-y** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:11 pm

Just ran across this one:

http://www.apulsoft.ch/wormhole/index.php

Appears to be cross platform, VST/AU compatible and its only $25!

I can't wait to get home!!!!!!

Finally I can run all those VST plugs I've been lusting after, on my fiancee's PC upstairs, and stream them to my Mac studio in the basement!!!!!

With this and MIDIOverLanCP, and VNC/Remote Desktop, we now have the complete cross-platform solution!!!!!!!!

Two questions come to mind:
1. Why isn't Wormhole already in KVR's database? FX Teleport is.
2. Why is it so cheap compared to MIDIOverLAN? Seems it should be the other way around.

jones-y · Post by **jones-y** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:10 am

Wow, nobody's interested?

Z3R0T0N1N · Post by **Z3R0T0N1N** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:22 am

actually, that really does rock!! thanx for pointing that out. I have been wondering what to do for school, since we use logic there on mac. I didn't want to be without certain plugs, and now it looks like I will be able to use a couple of them. NICE.

and your right about the price... why so low?
Not that I am complaining!

jones-y · Post by **jones-y** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:26 am

I don't know why in their right mind apulSoft would offer it so cheap but....

I'm happy to report a success!!!!!

Details:

My studio:
Quicksilver g4 933, 1GB/180GB
10.3.5
Logic Pro 6
RME 9632
Emagic AMT-8

B&W G3 300 512MB/40GB
9.2.2
Korg OASYS PCI
Opcode Studio 64x

My fiancee's PC:
Emachines Emonster 600 (E-dinosaur...) 256MB/15GB
Windows XP SP2 (firewall disabled for this test)
ASIO4ALL driver on built in audio hardware
Xlutop Chainer Demo
Luxonix Ravity Demo
DiscoDSP Discovery Demo

All are networked up on a Linksys 100mBit router. Physically, my two macs are in the basement. Her computer is in the spare bedroom, two flights up. She has a 75 foot Cat5 running downstairs to the router, located near me.

My first step was to make sure I could view the PCs desktop from my mac. That was easy. I downloaded Remote Desktop Connection from Microsoft Mactopia, and enabled "Allow users to connect remotely from this computer" under the Remote tab in the My Computer Properties box. Next I assigned my Windows user account a password. Simple as pie.

Next, I installed and configured both the WormHole Demo and the MIDIoverLAN CP Demo, on her PC and my Quicksilver. There are plenty of instructions on how to do that, so I won't rehash. I also installed ASIO4ALL on the PC and configured it to 44100 Sample rate, 176 Samples of delay, KS Buffers at 3 (whatever that means), Disable Input and Diable Direct DMA Buffer I/O.

Third, I opened Logic and created a Multi-Instrument and activated Channel 1. I assigned MIDIoverLAN's NetPort 1 to that instrument.

Next, I opened Chainer on the PC (through RDC, no I didn't run upstairs...) and instantiated Ravity(S) first and WormHole right after it. I configured that instance of WormHole to not pass audio thru, and to send it to the one Demo channel available.

Back in Logic, I inserted the apulSoft DummyInstrument into Audio Instrument 1. I then instantiated a Wormhole as the first effect. Configured it to receive from the one demo channel being sent from the PC upstairs.

So I played the keyboard, and I saw MIDI happening in Logic, and I also saw it being sent upstairs, and generating audio, but I couldn't hear anything. So then I noticed the not running light blinking in the WormHole interface (the one instantiated in Logic's Audio instrument, not the instance in Chainer). So i figured what the hell, let me hit play and see what happens.... And Bam! there it was. How long have I waited for this day.... DiscoDSP Discovery, rec:audio z3ta+, and a whole list of other VSTi's wich may never be available in AU, have now been bumped up on my wishlist.

I still gotta get a faster PC though, her 600 was stuttering with 4 notes of polyphony on Discovery. I'm also hoping that the ASIO4ALL driver doesn't slow down performance too much on a faster machine, forcing me to have to buy another audio interface anyway. The latency was pretty high with Logic set to 256 samples, but it did get a little better with Logic set to 64. I do suspect that users with better spec'd PCs will fare better. But I am a little worried about the ASIO driver issue.

Anyway that's my experience, YMMV...

The holy grail has officialy been sipped!

Muzik 4 Machines · Post by **Muzik 4 Machines** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 4:06 am

mmmmmm
ill bring my hub to reharsal to test it out with my pc that is yhere(im on my laptop mac now)
youhou
!!

:happy:

Z3R0T0N1N · Post by **Z3R0T0N1N** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 8:49 am

Thanx for the rundown, mj
sounds like this thing is really the bats nads!

three computers hooked up... actually, i've got an old cerleron 700 mhz kikking around, and i could use a bit more power. I used to get quite a bit going on that thing, running win ME and kx w/ my sblive

a really really surprising amound, actually. so that could be another four synths or samplers with no problem. Long as I don't use too many notes on each at the same time.
neato stuff.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 8:52 am

[DELETED]

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 10:24 am

No ttoz, it looks like its a cross-platform version of FXTeleport!

The holy fuckin grail....

griels · Post by **griels** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 11:23 am

Whoa, they kept the PC version quiet. Now all the Logic whiners can buy an ancient G3 to run their beloved app on, whilst keeping all the superior Windows plugins

FXMAX will have to get their finger out and release FXTeleport MAC now

rsmus7 · Post by **rsmus7** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 11:31 am

Some questions:

does it also connect two WinXP pc´s?
or only mac2pc?

what is the advantage over a plein midi connection between the two pc´s, and sound over a mixer? (e.g. using the second pc like a hardware synth loading a vsti in minihost or energyXT)

griels · Post by **griels** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 11:42 am

rsmus7 wrote:Some questions:

does it also connect two WinXP pc´s?
or only mac2pc?

what is the advantage over a plein midi connection between the two pc´s, and sound over a mixer? (e.g. using the second pc like a hardware synth loading a vsti in minihost or energyXT)

Firstly, you can route audio back and forth between PCs an undefinite number of times, with the number of connections only limited by your network speed, to create complex routings. With sufficient bandwidth this could mean dozens of tracks. Secondly, I don't know how this plugin handles offline rendering, but if it's anything like FXteleport, it will allow you to render your networked audio offline, just as you would with any other plug. Does anyone know if this is the case?

rsmus7 · Post by **rsmus7** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:00 pm

griels wrote:
Firstly, you can route audio back and forth between PCs an undefinite number of times, with the number of connections only limited by your network speed, to create complex routings. With sufficient bandwidth this could mean dozens of tracks.

What for should I need it? I don´t understand what sense is in routing audio back and forth? Could you give an example?

vipera · Post by **vipera** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:32 pm

Interesting stuff.
I already tested FxTeleport with great success and this appears to be a valid competitor.
I am not able to test now, I'll play in the weekend with it.
In the meanwhile can you clarify me:

- does it require sound hardware on all the computers? I tend to suppose not (as with FxTeleport). But can't argue that for sure from manual: in more places references to the latency due to asio drivers. This let me unsure

- it's not at all an host itself (unlike fxteleport). That is each machine must have also an host. (BTW not a fault to me: even with the very good working fxteleport i prefer to load vsti inside chainer and load chainer in fxteleport due to the more solid vst hosting of chainer)

- each machine knows nothing about the other, they just see each other streams? (unlike fxteleport which lets now the client the vsti installed on the server: thus inside Cubase I load a vsti as if it's local while indeed is remote on a different cpu).

Thank u. Bye

griels · Post by **griels** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:36 pm

rsmus7 wrote:
griels wrote:
Firstly, you can route audio back and forth between PCs an undefinite number of times, with the number of connections only limited by your network speed, to create complex routings. With sufficient bandwidth this could mean dozens of tracks.
What for should I need it? I don´t understand what sense is in routing audio back and forth? Could you give an example?

It's just a possibility - I'm sure some of the IDM folks would enjoy this. Anyway, the availability of a huge number of tracks (at least over Gigabit) should be a draw for those with even the largest mixers.

elfan · Post by **elfan** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:51 pm

This is GREAT! Exactly what I've been looking for. I want to integrate Logic on a PC (or on a Mac if I have to) with Cubase. Meaning that I want to use the Logic effects and synths from Cubase. Now, this thing will stream the audio _and_ midi to Logic and back to Cubase? And the thing loads as a VSTi?

Now, what is the latency of this? Is it limited by the network? If I set up a gigaethernet, will it utilize the maximum bandwidth and minimize latency, or are there other bottlenecks?
I mean, I've tried Freewire which sends audio between Cubase and Logic (on the same PC) through VST, and there I got like 500ms of latency. How well does this thing perform?

Sounds exciting at any rate

!

//Tomas

apulSoft WormHole - Cross platform Network Audio Streaming!