Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - 1.8.5 the main thread

[msvs]

Hanz, you have absolutely no idea about the code or whatever is going on internally. Giving tipps to Rene is ok, but thinking you know anything about that topic better than him is a bit over the top. And yes he might ignoring this, because he knows certain things better and he is too busy explaining several pages of text to you. Rene told me the amount of RAM is necessary and its impossible to have less because of the things which are going on simultaneously (has absolutely nothing to do with the copyprotection) - so I can only repeat the same here: Avenger takes this certain amount of RAM per instance. If you have around 32GB you surely dont care. If you have 8 GB you will care because its not enough to run several instances paralell without freezing the tracks... well its is up to you. The minimum specs are no secret before buying, there is a demoversion to try out, you can even sell it - you have all options to chose from. However, I (and the vast majority of the user base) have absolutely no problems, using 15 or more instances of Avenger without problems.

[Tilly]

Read the requirements, installed the demo, plugin opens vastly with black screen and a big cpu spike, read about the problems in here, uninstalled it.

It may be a nice synth once it works. But for now the requirements to run it smoothly is too narrow and random to me I'd rather like to see the other plugins updated.

[tapekiller]

Avenger deserves more exposure and praise because on paper it's a good synth and you can tell Rene has done quite a good job on the programming part, but it's not going to happen if you keep invalidating any feedback that doesn't resonate in your own echo chamber.

Refer to our minimum Specs or the demoversion if you want to see if you are able to use it.

You mean these? Maybe you should make a distinction between minimum and recommended and state that 4k UHD is the recommended, since you imply that it's the resolution Avenger was designed for (even if some elements are blurred on 200% but that's another matter)
Furthermore laptops definitely respect these specs but on a laptop FHD screen text is barely readable because of the font choice (which has been subject to criticism too, but that's another story).

thinking you know anything about that topic better than him is a bit over the top. And yes he might ignoring this, because he knows certain things better and he is too busy explaining several pages of text to you.

He might not know the synth better than Rene of course, he doesn't have access to the code but he definitely can share his experience (politely of course) and report problems that you don't necessarily experience by yourself.
Not everyone runs the very same machine you have, and you can't expect people to mention problems unless they experience them firsthand.
On a slightly related note, I mean no disrespect but patronizing behaviours and condescending attitudes just lead to PR shitshows.
As you know, no matter how good a product is (and Avenger is very good), a salesman has to know how to sell it, and there is no need to be rude to your own (potential) customers.

I've tried being transparently respectful, I hope you acknowledge at least some of my points and eventually share your thoughs on them (just as respectfully, I hope).

[Mr D]

Jeez, is someone knows how to do it better, why not just make your own synth and bury the competition??!!

If Ableton Live properly implemented track freeze that also unloaded the instrument, this would be a non-issue.

Cubase does it right, but i prefer Ableton's workflow for electronic music.

I personally haven't experienced any recurring bugs or crashes with Avenger.

[tapekiller]

Jeez, is someone knows how to do it better, why not just make your own synth and bury the competition??!!

Nobody is saying that they can do it better, people are just expressing their concerns or reporting what they found in their experience. It seemed quite obvious but for some apparently it isn't.
But let's keep giving pats on each other's back and say that everything is just perfect, that always plays out very well

[msvs]

4k is the optimal choice, FHD is recommended, you can work quite well on FHD. So we chose this as minimum/recommended.
Furthermore 8GB is minimum... you can open several instances of Avenger. But its not optimal. Optimal would be 32 or 64, maybe 128GB
and of course he can share his opinion and experiences. But it reads as if he knows the solution to everything, which is definately not the case.

btw @Mr D regarding the Kick attack, I just tried it and cant find any problem in the preset (except that I would prefer an logarhitmic oneshot LFO as env, and would set the micro Fade in time to 0.00)
I mixed down 4 kicks 3 times (3 wav files). When I invert the phase of a wav and copy/mix it, I get digital 0 in all cases. http://www.vengeance-storage.com/file/kick3.rar

Read the requirements, installed the demo, plugin opens vastly with black screen and a big cpu spike, read about the problems in here, uninstalled it.

perfectly and correctly done this way, saves both parties a lot of trouble If it wont work on your machine, it wont work. Thats what demos are good for. ...But, I never heard of a black screen... however

btw there can be CPU spikes which only lasts a milisecond in certain cases, usually you wont notice... but when there is one, its only at the first (live) played note and they will NOT appear when mixdowning/bouncing to wav. If I understood Rene correctly, they can occur when too many parameters has to be precalculated in a too short time. Increased my ASIO latency a bit and have no problems. Dont know if it has to do with this. But something that can be tried out.

[Tilly]

Read the requirements, installed the demo, plugin opens vastly with black screen and a big cpu spike, read about the problems in here, uninstalled it.

perfectly and correctly done this way, saves both parties a lot of trouble If it wont work on your machine, it wont work. Thats what demos are good for. ...But, I never heard of a black screen... however

Just for your info: I read in here this is a common problem with resizing too, so I of course tried that. Indeed I sometimes got the editor drawn right after resizing if luck was on my side, but often it was cut off too (like the image was too big for the already resized window) and often it flickered but stayed black in the end. I haven't ecountered such a bug with *any* other resizable plugin. Maybe that helps fixing anything...

[tapekiller]

Yes Manuel, entitlement goes both ways and it's wrong from any part. I know both you and Rene have good dedication and passion about this and I see that your interaction with people most time is actually very positive, but sometimes you see feedback as an attack when it really isn't so it's why I'm most times a bit upset when I see this kind of thing.

[msvs]

nope I dont see this as an attack at all. But some see it as an attack, when I say a definite and clear "no" to a feature request I dont like the standard replies of most major companies "thank you for your feedback, we will take this into consideration, bla bla" and nothing will ever happen. I am straight out, when I dont like an idea or feature request, I say this. And when I like an idea, I say this, too.

All cool

[sircuit]

btw @Mr D regarding the Kick attack, I just tried it and cant find any problem in the preset (except that I would prefer an logarhitmic oneshot LFO as env, and would set the micro Fade in time to 0.00)
I mixed down 4 kicks 3 times (3 wav files). When I invert the phase of a wav and copy/mix it, I get digital 0 in all cases. http://www.vengeance-storage.com/file/kick3.rar

I took one of your exports, duplicated the loop, shifted one of them one beat, and then looped the 3rd kick over the 2nd with inverted phase as in the picture. They don't cancel out. Furthermore, if I zoom in, you can clearly see the difference between attacks. Kick hit number 2 (below) have a clearly shorter attack than kick hit number 3 (above) - and despite having a shorter attack, overall kick hit number 2 is longer than hot number 3 (it settles to zero visibly after hit 3). The thing is the consecutive kick hits are not identical.

In all honesty, I personally don't care because Kick2 does it easier (and with more precision), just trying to help explaining the situation.

[mitchiemasha]

I built a new PC... because of Avenger. I can't express enough how much I love my new PC.

[Mr D]

@Manuel, i think you misunderstood the issue i was trying to pinpoint.

I'm not saying that Avenger won't export identical audio on repeated exports (i didn't test that and i guess your WAVs prove it does).

What i was pointing out was that if, for example, you trigger a sequence of kick drums in the same export (or live, realtime recording), then each one will be subtly different. Some have more or less attack.

I'm not trying to be super-picky, i actually heard it quite clearly before i even bothered with phase tests or examining the waveform in order to confirm.

Although i love SA Kick 2, there would be some real advantages in using Avenger for kick synthesise as there's just so many more sound sculpting possibilities as well as doing things like sidechaining kicks internally to basslines or other sounds.

Although i've only tested kicks, perhaps all sounds created in Avenger suffer from this problem? Or perhaps it's the extreme nature of a kick pitch envelope that causes it?

COULD WE PLEASE IN THE NEAR FUTURE HAVE A DEDICATED AVENGER FORUM?!

[Mr D]

Hey folks,

I'm experiencing a little weirdness with the MOD ENV, but perhaps i'm doing something wrong.

Here's the scenario:

2 oscillators.

MOD ENV 1 is set to trigger from OSC 2.
OSC 2 has it's keyzone limited to just one note: C3

So, i'd expect MOD ENV 1 to only trigger when i hit a C3 on my midi keyboard, but this isn't the case. In fact it triggers with any midi note.
(so if the story ended there, i would conclude that this OSC specific ENV MOD trigger option is either broken or useless)

But here's the weirdness: if i first hold another note (say, C1), then indeed only C3 will trigger MOD ENV1.

So it seems this OSC specific trigger only works in legato mode.

But that seems kinda weird, i can't see the logic in that.

Can anyone confirm, deny, or explain?

Thanks!

[msvs]

confirmed, already fixed

[Mr D]

OK, thanks for the quick reply!

Do you mean it was fixed recently and i need to download the latest version?

Because i only downloaded the newest version a few days ago.

Or do you mean it was fixed today and and i need to download a new version today?