Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - 1.8.5 the main thread

[kevvvvv]

sircuit, you're always right.

[sircuit]

sircuit, you're always right.

asks for solution => two people deliver solution => requires effort => refuses solution

[Ranoka]

@kevvvvv I like the advice of learning a synth by recreating some patches you like from init. Step 5 on this article explains the process https://www.syntorial.com/tutorials/ten ... th-dynamo/

Like the others, I've discovered there are no shortcuts for learning synthesis. Training your ears is an important step, and that comes from practice and experience. Learning the routing of a synth can generally be picked up from reading the manual and recreating patches. Watching videos can be useful for figuring out a particular sound is made, but not the best way to start otherwise you can get into the trap of only recreating sounds from videos. It's good to take what you learn and make it your own, and apply what you learned to some different synths.

Personally I think the best way of learning and improving synth programming (after doing the syntorial style practice) is to join the One Synth Challenge at KVR!

There are also the Sound On Sound synthesis articles, but I have to admit that I haven't actually read any of them yet

Avenger may be a bit ambitious to start with, maybe focus on learning one aspect or module at a time. I like how Zebra has Zebralette so you can focus on learning the oscillator in isolation.

[generaldiomedes]

I would recommend syntorial as a good ear training tool.

[msvs]

all he was interested in, is to see how I (others) do it. Typical KVR that this is widened to a debate on principles However, the answer to Kevvv is: maybe I will do a video, just turning the camera on when I design sounds for 30min or 1h. There could be some inspiring ideas, how to work with Avenger.

[kevvvvv]

Thanks Manuel.

You see through the clutter.

Appreciated.

[Ranoka]

Sorry about that kevvvvv, I'd be interested in seeing a video of Manuel doing some sound design too!

[Trancit]

...There could be some inspiring ideas, how to work with Avenger.

First...in terms of Avenger

Second: I agree, that tutorials doesn´t help directly to improve yourself but as people having different methods it can give nice hints for achieving certain sounds in ways one wouldn´t have done this way round...not only for Avenger... I like to see this kind of tutorials too...

Third: Learn from the best... as Manuel is verifiable one of the most talented/successful sound designers since decades it´s a valid request to see him working...

Fourth: In principle, who are you naysayer to tell him what he is allowed to want and what not... and how he shall learn or not... it´s only up to Manuel to respond to this as it was a request to him personally

[chuna]

I find that watching someone skilled in their craft, do their craft, an extremely educational experience.
Watching Manuel design some sounds will help all of us learn more about sound design and Avenger. This makes all users more comfortable on Avenger, helping us to want to use it more.

It's a win win for users and makers of the best synth on the market.

Great request Kevvvv!

[tapekiller]

Hi Manuel, I just noticed that in the latest version of avenger the browser position keeps resetting to the default one (upper half) and preview keeps turning on.
Any idea about what might cause it? I'm on windows 10, x64, and never had this issue with past versions, permissions are still the same as before too.

I also have another question: why is the sample volume so low when I import them in an oscillator? Samples that are supposed to peak at 0 instead play at a much lower volume, like approximately 20db lower than their actual volume. So in order to get decent volume on it I need to crank up the whole oscillator level AND sample level to respectively 130% and +12db. At this point I get about the same volume, yet if I see the levels on avenger's mixer and big meter I'm supposed to clip when I'm actually not clipping
Not sure what scaling avenger uses, but the 0 on avenger doesn't correspond to the 0 on the daw meter, in fact most times when I try to get a decent output volume on my patch everything is red.
Also, the AMP mixer meter (in the amplifier section) shows a much higher level than its real one, on a new blank patch a sawtooth oscillator sounds as quiet as roughly -12dB, but on the amplifier section of the mixer it's red all the time.
It's some minor thing but probably nobody has stopped to notice it, mostly because I don't know how often people even use the mixer to begin with.

Thanks in advance for any help or insight on this matters

[msvs]

Hi Manuel, I just noticed that in the latest version of avenger the browser position keeps resetting to the default one (upper half) and preview keeps turning on.
Any idea about what might cause it? I'm on windows 10, x64, and never had this issue with past versions, permissions are still the same as before too.

better mail this to Rene

I also have another question: why is the sample volume so low when I import them in an oscillator?

to match the overall volume of other OSCs (granular or VA Oscs) the sample oscs are reduced a bit in volume. But you can compensate this permanently: Each multisample also have a small textfile in the same folder. Just go into this textfile with windows editor or wordpad and you will find a GAIN value parameter. Just enter +5.00db or whatever you want (depending on the sound). Furthermore short sounds/plucks seem to have lower volume, than a sustained white noise, or a sub sinewave. The pluck seems far lower in volume, even it peaks at 0db, too. I compensate this always in my XPs in this textfile per sample.
(ps shapes also have this textfile to compensate volume. Again, a sinewave is not as loud as a noisy one, even if they have the same source volume.

[Teksonik]

sircuit, you're always right.

asks for solution => two people deliver solution => requires effort => refuses solution

You know kevvvvv has been here for 19 years, six times longer than you have right ? I'm not sure if you're in a position to be so condescending.

[tapekiller]

to match the overall volume of other OSCs (granular or VA Oscs) the sample oscs are reduced a bit in volume. But you can compensate this permanently: Each multisample also have a small textfile in the same folder. Just go into this textfile with windows editor or wordpad and you will find a GAIN value parameter. Just enter +5.00db or whatever you want (depending on the sound). Furthermore short sounds/plucks seem to have lower volume, than a sustained white noise, or a sub sinewave. The pluck seems far lower in volume, even it peaks at 0db, too. I compensate this always in my XPs in this textfile per sample.
(ps shapes also have this textfile to compensate volume. Again, a sinewave is not as loud as a noisy one, even if they have the same source volume.

Thanks a lot, that's interesting to know. On the other hand, any idea about the meter values or should I ask that to Rene as well? Maybe it's a technical bug and it's just been overlooked over other things.
Have a good day

[sircuit]

sircuit, you're always right.

asks for solution => two people deliver solution => requires effort => refuses solution

You know kevvvvv has been here for 19 years, six times longer than you have right ? I'm not sure if you're in a position to be so condescending.

Oh, but I am even more, knowing this.
And is not even personal about Kevv, it’s about any person that spends 19 years on forums and still needs sound design turorials. It’s two decades, double the amount of time Beatles were active.

DYI is way effective than any tutorial, be it from Manuel itself, and for the moment the current circumstances show that I am right.

Not saying that I know it all (quite far from it), we never stop learning, but man, 19 years and actively asking for entry-level advice for a fixed-architecture synth?

Something really doesnt add up: maybe the forums are a complete waste of time?

[Teksonik]

Oh, but I am even more, knowing this.
And is not even personal about Kevv, it’s about any person that spends 19 years on forums and still needs sound design turorials.

He just asked for video tutorials. You know it's completely possible to grasp the concept of hands on learning but still want additional learning aides when working with a new synth right ?

Watch a 10 minute video and learn something that might have taken you an hour to learn on your own. Certainly you can grasp that concept ?

I have always been a hands on learner but that has a lot to do with my inability to read a manual for more than thirty seconds without losing focus. When I first started with synthesizers I couldn't afford new ones and used ones rarely came with any documentation. There was no Mother Google to ask for help so you just just dug in and started turning knobs.

But even now I would watch Avenger Tutorial Videos especially if they ended up on YouTube. Better than watching podcasts or road rage videos and we would probably learn something (even you).

We all work differently and we all learn differently. Some will digest an owners manual before touching the plugin and some will never open the manual except when they get stuck. There is no right way only what is right for each individual.

The bottom line for me is I don't think kevvvvv needs your "advice". You're just coming across as a dick....

Anyway condescending newbies aside is there a Patch Repository for Avenger ? Is there an email address where we can send our custom expansions ? I'm working on one and would like to share when I get a few more patches. Do we just share the .avpx files ? (Question directed at the developers of Avenger).

Ok I'm going to go make some more Avenger patches now........