Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Chords, scales, harmony, melody, etc.
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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Post Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:04 am

BTW, I'm tired of being called 'he' at this point.

"probably could be of great value sharing his expertise and..."
I've done that for years here.

You started getting personal and talking shit about what I do because I tore your points apart and I didn't feel like tolerating it.
You're still doing it.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:27 am

So you went to create as negative a story about me as a person and had at my music in service really of deflecting that you don't have anything to say.

I started off working with a kid in my neighborhood who was a classic singer-songwriter sort (a Beatles fanatic). I arranged the things in the studio so the demos had some style. We had label interest. We met people. For me, the industry looked pretty sleazy (to get radio play you had somebody procuring sex and drugs for the key people who needed persuading. If you didn't, your record was a stiff. It wasn't my songs, but I had an interest in it because they were my productions, my guitar soloing, my bass playing, my charts.) And, around the same time he met a good, Christian woman, I was moving into classical performance, which got me into music school. We'd moved into prog rock anyway, although our tapes had a little bit of notoriety. I could have stayed and been a big fish in the small pond. I'm not like that, nor am I real comfortable with being the subject of gossip. I was a known quantity at 17.

After 10 some years of being a guitarist and eventually writing little idiomatic things, I began composing in earnest. This has nothing whatsoever to do with pop music or its goals, that aspiration, anything. Doing things which fit in with what people who don't really have interest in music qua music isn't it.
What I had found in school was that composition, as serious endeavor, had meant - for a century, really - pushing the envelope, advancing vocabulary and dealing in ideas. It was very liberating to find individuals who just didn't give a shit about that level of approbation pop is all wrapped up in, doing things for the money.

And I met like minds at San Francisco. I did shows, I put things together, I even got paid to do it for periods of time but the music was everything. When I got hurt I was fairly notorious. But to give you an example of what kind of economy we're talking about, Fred Frith came over to borrow dude's amp at the house to do the Skeleton Crew thing with Tom Cora once. He's like a permanent member of the faculty at Mills College and a legend. He hadn't an amp for the gig.

So your ad populum argment is a total, massive FAIL. In a sense, the seriously high interest in music for its own value is doomed commercially. It doesn't mean a massive hit isn't good simply through it being super commercial, but it does mean - more and more, historically - less is allowed. Historically, you got away with all kinds of risk 40, 50 yrs ago. The Rump Shaker is PURE PANDERING to the lowest imaginable common denominator. There are varying degrees of this. If you're into music for the money you do certain things. By 24 when I started writing all the time, I was long gone.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:47 am

christian f. wrote:
Fri Mar 08, 2019 12:19 am
I'm convinced that If you're REALLY good and talented, people will 100% find you and recognise that no matter what genre, budget, age, market bla bla ..
Yeah, you keep schooling us on the world... How old are you?

You made up a fiction about me and my music.
People find me. A guy from Russia presented a mixtape of stuff from my 2010 album No Location and characterized himself as my disciple. The thing then, which I kind of get because of the hole which was left by his passing, people wanted me to be the new Zappa out of that album. (He had interspersed weird little segueways as though to make it "Läther".) I would prefer to be known for me, though.

I was a pretty notorious guitarist at one time. I'm not going to get deep into it because of numerous personal reasons.
I wasn't ready to go back to my hotel room one day after the methadone clinic in the morning and was looking at magazines in the drugstore (long gone) at 7th and Market. Wired, it was 1997 iirc and technology was even more interesting then it was a couple years before. This issue was the best CDs of the year. The writer had this thing I had written around half of for a drummer's solo record (who was in the, basically USA exponent of Rock In Opposition and could get some (European) distribution being known) as number one.

One of the best guitarists I know found me at Facebook having heard a couple of things on the radio off of No Location.
I'm so not famous, but there are one or three people who located me. I could produce such rave reviews of my shit.
If you find 'talent' outs on that Rump Shaker (I just freudian slipped a T at the beginning of that construction), you wouldn't know talent if it felched you.

if you want to tell a story about a person, get some f**king information, check for things, FFS.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 08, 2019 12:02 pm

I like people like this who don't need a machine to tell them about swing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2EL0YWOQz8

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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:52 pm

Not to be offensive to the example above but look what arrived today all due to this thread:

Image
bmw 335i 0 60

Roland R8 Mk II. Though it surprised me how big it is. At the size of a MC505 :o Thought it would be more in compact Boss style. However, it is cooooooool. My new precious :love:

Thanks stooopid thread :hihi:

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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:21 pm

IncarnateX wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:55 pm
there is the good old Roland R-8 “humanization principle” to spice up your quantifications in some DAWs, though it basically just provides random timing errors
No it doesn’t you frigging idiot, I’ve just bought one and it randomizes everything but the timing. It is just one more of those ass pulled KVR assertions!

Now who wrote that rubbish, anyway?





...eh...

Ooops! :clown:

(How is that even possible? MY ass, of all of them, can’t be wrong! This is a mod’s work, no doubt.)

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Delta Sign
KVRian
654 posts since 22 Jun, 2018

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:45 pm

Yeah, the "humanization" on the R-8 was quite ahead of its time. It's still quite an amazing piece of gear and a lot of fun to use in general.

Congrats on getting one of these :tu:

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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:50 pm

It is wonderful, like “hey where have you been all my life”? Could deffo have made some of my own drum tracks more organic/less mechanic. Has no swing function though, only 100% triplets, no percent settings in between but a few microtiming settings to rush or slow the beat a little.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:15 pm

bronze age tech :phones:

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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Sat Mar 23, 2019 11:42 pm

Oh shit. I am getting THAT old, ain’t I?

And how did they even make triplets in music before Roland rhythm boxes? Tech was not available :ud:

Somewhat dissapointet that it does not introduce random microtiming errors. Would really have been the icing on the cake. Though maybe that would have demanded too much of the processor? One should think that microtiming obviously would be part of the trick beyond static push and pull.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Sun Mar 24, 2019 1:44 am

predates technology
or almost. they used something to write that mensural whole thing

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mensural_ ... olorations

An individual composition was not limited to a single set of tempus and prolatio. Meters could be shifted in the course of a piece, either by inserting a new mensuration sign, or by using numeric proportions. A "3" indicates that all notes will be reduced to one-third of their value; a "2" indicates double tempo; a fraction
"3/2" indicates three in the time of two, and so forth.

Coloration applied to a group of breves (ex. {a}) was known as color temporis, while that of a group of semibreves (ex. {b–c}) was called color prolationis. The resulting rhythmic effect, as expressed in modern notation, differs somewhat according to whether the affected notes were normally perfect or imperfect according to the basic mensuration of the music. Applied to perfect notes (ex. {a–b}), coloration creates the effect of a hemiola: three binary rhythmic groups in the space normally taken up by two ternary ones, but with the next smaller time units (semibreves in {a}, minims in {b}) remaining constant. When applied to notes that were already imperfect according to their normal values (ex. {c}), coloration results in the effect of a group of triplets, with all rhythmic units reduced by two thirds.

ex. {c}:
coloration.png
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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Sun Mar 24, 2019 1:49 am

Yeah. Now we are talking. Nice entry, Jan.

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jancivil
KVRAF
17949 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from No Location

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:19 am

knew you'd go for that one

Funnily enough you'd think with the total focus on that era in Music History (two trimesters and we're still in it) this would have come up.
Nope, Music Theory and pretty early on. We sight-sang from mensural and neumes, even.

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IncarnateX
KVRAF
3802 posts since 25 Jan, 2009 from Forgotten Realms

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:29 am

Yup. And unfortunately I do not think that it will be the last time we shall hear that swing was invented with swing-function on the MPC according to The Produzah’s Handbook. Only a decade after we learned to grow sample-trees. And this is apparently just fine, for culture and history are for worn out oldies like us who have no clue about “modern” music.

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vurt
addled muppet weed
43055 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Swingbeat; How do I do it?

Post Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:41 am

so mr x, you like to "swing"?

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