KVR Audio

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:56 pm

I don't know. Take a look at what happens when audio software developers develop mobile apps. They are dirt cheap, and devs still seem to make their cut. Maybe the issue here is that the desktop market is so small.

hhuang9611 · Post by **hhuang9611** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:08 am

robbmonn wrote: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:47 pm Well, oddly enough, I think audio software is underpriced. If the pricing were higher there would be more developers spending more time and being more innovative and taking risks on interesting and niche stuff. See what is happening in the Eurorack/Guitar Pedal space? The level of quality and innovation there is staggering... but that's because the economics work out-- if you want that module or pedal you will have to pay for it, and the prices are an order of magnitude higher. I really see how pressure to lower prices and piracy are hurting the software space badly.

How about klanghelm and Valhalla then?

Exceptional quality with waves-sale price

generaldiomedes · Post by **generaldiomedes** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:25 am

Some of these developers (Valhalla, Cytomic, etc.) .. this cannot be their day job.

robbmonn · Post by **robbmonn** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:47 am

the Valhalla developer has commented on social media more than once that he is not making a lot of money. Listen, in the US if you want to start a business and provide health insurance for your family you are talking about $1000+ a month, then rent food etc. Domyou really think that Sean sells enough software to cover that? My point is that there would be MORE people doing more wonderful things if the market was priced higher. Just like there were more professional musicians, engineers and producers when you paid $16 for a cd. It not really something that is up for debate... it is just true. Eurorack and guitar pedals prove it. That’s why I hold the opinion that it would be better if software A. Had an unbreakable copy protection standard and B. Cost more. Feel free to disagree, but that’s my feeling.

Case in point is Omnisphere and even more so U-He. And Spitfire Audio sample libraries. They cost more, yes, but they are remarkably good, well supported, flexible tools made by people who are dedicated and focused. Yes, there are cheaper tools that are also good, but that wasn’t really my point.

Also consider this as an example. There have been dozens and dozens of hardware loopers on the market in the last 25 years. Many that are or were very very good. There have been far fewer and in general less well implemented software loopers. This indicates to me that the hardware market for the tool makers is better, pays more, etc, than the software market. Piracy and cost are surely big factors there. If software were more lucrative than hardware we would have more and a greater diversity of it. Again, my two cents as someone who has been using this stuff since the Apple 2.

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:00 am

IT'S OUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!

Only joking.

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:13 am

It's not funny anymore James.

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:48 am

LOL.... you kids....

ATN69 · Post by **ATN69** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:57 am

He didn't really say what's out

..and I am not sure I wanna know any details about that

masterhiggins · Post by **masterhiggins** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:02 am

hhuang9611 wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:08 am
robbmonn wrote: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:47 pm Well, oddly enough, I think audio software is underpriced. If the pricing were higher there would be more developers spending more time and being more innovative and taking risks on interesting and niche stuff. See what is happening in the Eurorack/Guitar Pedal space? The level of quality and innovation there is staggering... but that's because the economics work out-- if you want that module or pedal you will have to pay for it, and the prices are an order of magnitude higher. I really see how pressure to lower prices and piracy are hurting the software space badly.
How about klanghelm and Valhalla then? Exceptional quality with waves-sale price

They also have an extremely small overhead and a much smaller user base. PA has a massive marketing budget whereas Valhalla and Klanghelm are usually word of mouth. However, their user base is much more loyal. I'm not saying one is superior. They just clearly have much different goals.

hhuang9611 · Post by **hhuang9611** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:16 am

robbmonn wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:47 am the Valhalla developer has commented on social media more than once that he is not making a lot of money. Listen, in the US if you want to start a business and provide health insurance for your family you are talking about $1000+ a month, then rent food etc. Domyou really think that Sean sells enough software to cover that? My point is that there would be MORE people doing more wonderful things if the market was priced higher. Just like there were more professional musicians, engineers and producers when you paid $16 for a cd. It not really something that is up for debate... it is just true. Eurorack and guitar pedals prove it. That’s why I hold the opinion that it would be better if software A. Had an unbreakable copy protection standard and B. Cost more. Feel free to disagree, but that’s my feeling.

Case in point is Omnisphere and even more so U-He. And Spitfire Audio sample libraries. They cost more, yes, but they are remarkably good, well supported, flexible tools made by people who are dedicated and focused. Yes, there are cheaper tools that are also good, but that wasn’t really my point.

Also consider this as an example. There have been dozens and dozens of hardware loopers on the market in the last 25 years. Many that are or were very very good. There have been far fewer and in general less well implemented software loopers. This indicates to me that the hardware market for the tool makers is better, pays more, etc, than the software market. Piracy and cost are surely big factors there. If software were more lucrative than hardware we would have more and a greater diversity of it. Again, my two cents as someone who has been using this stuff since the Apple 2.

Good point. I didn't put enough thought when I mentioned those developers. I assumed they are doing pretty well... I guess you may take my statement as a real question instead of a counterexample

But like you said, producers and audio engineers don't make decent money either so I guess it's hard for them to afford highly priced software...

Anyway, I won't say how software should be priced, but if there is a bargain, I will enjoy it and thank the developer.

(Maybe there is a perfect world where everybody makes enough money from their efforts)

ATS · Post by **ATS** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:42 am

ATN69 wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:57 am He didn't really say what's out ..and I am not sure I wanna know any details about that

MikeCallon · Post by **MikeCallon** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 6:20 am

I hope your guesses on pricing are correct, but I wouldn't be surprised if this was $299, intro at $149 and heavy hitter at $99. I hope not, but let's see later today

martinjuenke · Post by **martinjuenke** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 8:11 am

ATN69 wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:57 am He didn't really say what's out ..and I am not sure I wanna know any details about that

I‘m sure a very specific plug of him has been out

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:06 am

ATS wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:42 am
ATN69 wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:57 am He didn't really say what's out ..and I am not sure I wanna know any details about that

500 - Internal Server Error

Could be a good sign.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:49 am

So where is it? It's been 9th of April for almost 14 hours

bx_oberhausen from Plugin Alliance has landed