Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
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antic604
KVRAF
2188 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:19 am

Anosou wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:31 pm
antic604 wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:33 am
chimp_spanner wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:27 am
As for the "other performance improvements", 10.3 runs better even without VSTs.
Native devices & REs were previously using fixed 64 samples buffer, whereas now they adjust to what you set in Settings.
Just to be clear, this hasn't changed. Native devices and Rack Extensions are still using fixed 64 sample buffers. Only VSTs and other parts around Reason now adapt. It's those "other parts" and general optimisation that lead to the general performance improvements.
Oh, OK! Thanks for that clarification :)
Bitwig 2 // Reason 10 // Cubase Pro 10 @ Lenovo Y730 15'' i7-8750h
my music - https://soundcloud.com/antic604
other stuff - Psytrance in Bitwig Studio tutorial

Studio Saturn
KVRist
125 posts since 14 Oct, 2015

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am

Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement? I'm on El Capitan the latest. Is El Capitan not supported or what? Ok the improvement which I get is not like I have been reading here. The song which is not playing it plays but it looks like I'm not going to finish mixing. The improvement which I have gotten is like one bar from the DSP indicator. Do you think I will get a better performance if I bootcamp or something? I'm asking this because I really don't want to start from the beginning in another DAW, it is laborious. They are 78 tracks of imported stems.

jens
KVRAF
19218 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:16 am

xbitz wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 4:29 am
:clap: ... and now What Are Your Most Wanted Features You'd Like To See In Reason : https://forum.reasontalk.com/viewtopic. ... &t=7510808 :hug:
Proper MIDI loop-recording (multitake) isn't even on that list... lol

jens
KVRAF
19218 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:17 am

Studio Saturn wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am
Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement? I'm on El Capitan the latest. Is El Capitan not supported or what? Ok the improvement which I get is not like I have been reading here. The song which is not playing it plays but it looks like I'm not going to finish mixing. The improvement which I have gotten is like one bar from the DSP indicator. Do you think I will get a better performance if I bootcamp or something? I'm asking this because I really don't want to start from the beginning in another DAW, it is laborious. They are 78 tracks of imported stems.

What's your latency setting and did you try to switch Hyperthreading off?

chimp_spanner
KVRist
67 posts since 27 Jan, 2003 from Colchester, Essex, England

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:43 am

Studio Saturn wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am
Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement? I'm on El Capitan the latest. Is El Capitan not supported or what? Ok the improvement which I get is not like I have been reading here. The song which is not playing it plays but it looks like I'm not going to finish mixing. The improvement which I have gotten is like one bar from the DSP indicator. Do you think I will get a better performance if I bootcamp or something? I'm asking this because I really don't want to start from the beginning in another DAW, it is laborious. They are 78 tracks of imported stems.
Need a bit more detail; computer specs, buffer size, project sample rate, the contents of the project (what kind of plugins are in use), the nature of the performance issues (disk overload? CPU?), hyperthreading on or off, etc. The more you can provide the better.
Insert something profound/blatant self promotion/DAW specs here.

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antic604
KVRAF
2188 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:44 am

Studio Saturn wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am
Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement?
The optimisation works best at the 256-512 samples buffer. Also hyperthreading off might help. I'm assuming you're already running in low-res mode and have color prifle switched to RGB?
Bitwig 2 // Reason 10 // Cubase Pro 10 @ Lenovo Y730 15'' i7-8750h
my music - https://soundcloud.com/antic604
other stuff - Psytrance in Bitwig Studio tutorial

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EnochLight
KVRian
1157 posts since 21 Mar, 2012 from your mom

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:53 am

antic604 wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:44 am
Studio Saturn wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am
Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement?
The optimisation works best at the 256-512 samples buffer. Also hyperthreading off might help.
Actually, up to 1024 samples seems to offer fantastic improvement as well - depending on plugin count, complexity of the project, and which particular VST.
  • Presonus Studio One 4 | too many VSTi's to name
  • Windows 10 64-bit | Reason 10.3 | RME Babyface Pro | Nektar Tech Panorama P4 | Akai MPC Live | too many RE's to name

User avatar
antic604
KVRAF
2188 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:57 am

EnochLight wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:53 am
Actually, up to 1024 samples seems to offer fantastic improvement as well - depending on plugin count, complexity of the project, and which particular VST.
Perhaps. I just meant I don't see much of an improvement on buffers higher than 512 and I'm not really keen on sacrificing on CV/automation precision to only get marginal performance boost.

But obviously all that depends on the music. I rely heavily on CV & automation, so I start to hear the difference above 512, although that might be because so far I only run old projects. If I started at 1024 or 2048 that would just be a "new normal" I guess :)
Bitwig 2 // Reason 10 // Cubase Pro 10 @ Lenovo Y730 15'' i7-8750h
my music - https://soundcloud.com/antic604
other stuff - Psytrance in Bitwig Studio tutorial

v1o
KVRian
1494 posts since 2 Oct, 2004

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:41 am

SLiC wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:52 pm
So, by update 10.3 Reason managed parity with other DAWs for VST performance in this but Ialso think it has a long way to go with GUI and workflow, it realy all does seem so dated. Great sound, some great ideas etc, but some much time and effort wasted on REs to then finally permit VSTs anyway...they realy need some direction.
What's dated about the workflow?
Orion Platinum, Muzys 2

steff3
KVRian
573 posts since 7 Oct, 2006

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:02 pm

v1o wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:41 am
SLiC wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:52 pm
So, by update 10.3 Reason managed parity with other DAWs for VST performance in this but Ialso think it has a long way to go with GUI and workflow, it realy all does seem so dated. Great sound, some great ideas etc, but some much time and effort wasted on REs to then finally permit VSTs anyway...they realy need some direction.
What's dated about the workflow?
Somehow I think this statement is funny. The workflow of most of the DAWs is a tape machine approach - one assembles bites linearly. What is not dated about that ....?

Logic had a bit of a object oriented approach (at least for MIDI and control) ....
Live is also more or less linear - micro-linear ....

Just my 2-cents ;)

v1o
KVRian
1494 posts since 2 Oct, 2004

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:38 pm

steff3 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:02 pm
v1o wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:41 am
SLiC wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:52 pm
So, by update 10.3 Reason managed parity with other DAWs for VST performance in this but Ialso think it has a long way to go with GUI and workflow, it realy all does seem so dated. Great sound, some great ideas etc, but some much time and effort wasted on REs to then finally permit VSTs anyway...they realy need some direction.
What's dated about the workflow?
Somehow I think this statement is funny. The workflow of most of the DAWs is a tape machine approach - one assembles bites linearly. What is not dated about that ....?

Logic had a bit of a object oriented approach (at least for MIDI and control) ....
Live is also more or less linear - micro-linear ....

Just my 2-cents ;)
What are you talking about? If you’re talking about the sequencer, then yes it is linear. But Reason is modular so you can sequence entirely in CV using all sorts of generator and sequencer devices if you fancy.

Ableton Live has clip based sequencing, but that’s only because Live’s clip launcher was originally invented for DJ’ing. Not every DAW has to be like Live, I wouldn’t want to record 100 piece orchestras with it.
Orion Platinum, Muzys 2

reggie1979
KVRist
263 posts since 26 Nov, 2018

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:00 pm

But you could easily. It has a perfectly linear sequencer as well as the clips.

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Deep Purple
KVRian
1125 posts since 9 Jan, 2015 from NY, NY

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:42 pm

Studio Saturn wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:30 am
Am I the only person who hasn't received an improvement? I'm on El Capitan the latest.
Maybe it's not optimized for El Capitan and the improvements are more obvious in more recent versions of MacOS?
Sweet child in time...

xbitz
KVRAF
2353 posts since 3 Oct, 2013 from Budapest

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:49 pm

v1o wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:38 pm
steff3 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:02 pm
v1o wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:41 am
SLiC wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:52 pm
So, by update 10.3 Reason managed parity with other DAWs for VST performance in this but Ialso think it has a long way to go with GUI and workflow, it realy all does seem so dated. Great sound, some great ideas etc, but some much time and effort wasted on REs to then finally permit VSTs anyway...they realy need some direction.
What's dated about the workflow?
Somehow I think this statement is funny. The workflow of most of the DAWs is a tape machine approach - one assembles bites linearly. What is not dated about that ....?

Logic had a bit of a object oriented approach (at least for MIDI and control) ....
Live is also more or less linear - micro-linear ....

Just my 2-cents ;)
What are you talking about? If you’re talking about the sequencer, then yes it is linear. But Reason is modular so you can sequence entirely in CV using all sorts of generator and sequencer devices if you fancy.

Ableton Live has clip based sequencing, but that’s only because Live’s clip launcher was originally invented for DJ’ing. Not every DAW has to be like Live, I wouldn’t want to record 100 piece orchestras with it.
still one of the most usable ones ,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6UFCdD4Lyk
especially with the https://www.edmprod.com/subtractive-music-production/ methodology
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=delCISbVfFU
"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

User avatar
antic604
KVRAF
2188 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Re: Reason 10.3 is out ...and it's awesome!

Post Wed Apr 17, 2019 10:55 pm

v1o wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:41 am
SLiC wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:52 pm
So, by update 10.3 Reason managed parity with other DAWs for VST performance in this but Ialso think it has a long way to go with GUI and workflow, it realy all does seem so dated. Great sound, some great ideas etc, but some much time and effort wasted on REs to then finally permit VSTs anyway...they realy need some direction.
What's dated about the workflow?
I think most people use that when talking about sequencer. I don't know how to describe it, but it's kinda 'stiff' or 'rigid', doesn't feel as fluid like in Bitwig or Live. Some examples:
- until 10.2 you couldn't edit 2+ tracks at once and even still it's very limited compared to Bitwig
- editing notes is a mix - in the clip itself it's quite limited and inconsistent (moving notes with mouse plays them, with keyboard doesn't), but then under F8 there's lots of super deep options
- on big screens (or high res), the piano roll is very small vertically even at highest zoom
- there are no automation curves and automation values more often than not do not correspond with respective parameter (say a channel fader at 0dB will show a value of around 7000)
- if you have an instrument followed by chain of 5 FX and you want to automate each of those FX, the sequencer will put those automations in separate FX tracks (that you can't hide or collapse), totalling 6 tracks for the part,
- there are no folder tracks to organise your session.

Not saying it's all bad, because what I miss in other DAWs are e.g. blocks mode (check xbitz' video above!) and support for pattern-based sequencers, multiple MIDI lanes for single track, separate mutes for MIDI & automation tracks, automation clips, native pitch-shifting editor, etc.

So perhaps 'dated' isn't the best word, because it's a mix :)
Bitwig 2 // Reason 10 // Cubase Pro 10 @ Lenovo Y730 15'' i7-8750h
my music - https://soundcloud.com/antic604
other stuff - Psytrance in Bitwig Studio tutorial

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