Where Will Digital Audio Workstations Be In 10 Years ?

[jancivil]

We'll be living in the digital age of plenty where we can't be sure if a human or AI created a song.

Expect the reappraisal of live music. Acoustic live music in particular. You can't fool it's created by (the help of) a AI DAW!

This is just laughable. Ludicrous really. I have to wonder if you have the first clue about what goes into real music. No, if you really did you wouldn't have this particular fantasy.

Why would there be a "reappraisal" of acoustic live music? Because AI. You need more than a brain to get your touch together on a stringed instrument; you need all kinds of physical apparatus to be a wind player. Do you actually entertain a fantasy of a robot doing this any time soon? The feedback from touch on an instrument is extremely complex. This is supposedly going to be in the realm of digital binary code? When? How? What of the problems here are you currently studying?
Show your work.

Pure fantasy.

I appreciate your reaction. And I appreciate your concern, at least that’s how your post appears to me. The fierceness of it gives me the impression you feel quite uncomfortable of AI possibly having such an impact. I may be wrong though.

You are so very wrong. I meant what I said, it's a baseless fantasy afaic. I'm not afraid of unicorns or the tooth fairy.
I was offended by the glib dismissal. No one needs AI for it {aside from 1) disability or 2) people who won't be equipped anyway.}. So the qualification "(the help of)" has no real meaning.
I challenged you to show your investigation into what is to be done.

[jancivil]

Note I’m not talking about robots playing physical instrument although that will advance as well.

This does not follow your remark 'expect a reappraisal of acoustic live music.'.

I’m talking about neural network systems [...] Magic as in ‘very impressive feats’ like beating the best human Go players or Dota players, by just trial and error and learn from and improve upon itself.

It doesn't follow that beating a human at a game amounts to replacing live performers on instruments. So you've moved the goalposts considerably since I reacted, isn't it.

The limits of AI are mostly defined by the limits of hardware.
So, without serious hardware limitations there are no limits to AI.

I don't accept the premise, nothing which follows from it I'm going to buy.
I touched on my argument as to why; at least one would see I was talking about writing the AI , ie., writing something which is a far reach at this time. It's beyond me to say 'never' but we're not looking at anything on the order of that, just because 'better than a human at Go', or at chess. You said "goal-oriented", well performing a piece of music off the page is goal-oriented but the issues of interpretation and the difference made by an_individual_with_full_agency does not follow.
To the thought experiment "Rachel" in that story, it would be more interesting to me to interrogate "full agency" or 'real sentience' as per Philip Kindred Dick, 'What is a human?' *memories; emotions; a depth of experience; the synergy of which is not compartmentalized, it's dynamic and holistic*, it's not a strategy contest.

Things we call intuition can partly be compared to the output of very abstract layers of deep neural networks. I say partly because it’s not the whole picture of course. The brain is still much more complex and currently there’s nothing in AI which is anything close to emotions.

So you actually agree with the essence of my objection. But back to the goalpost 'expect a reappraisal of live acoustic music', everyone is going to wonder, there is no support from you for this at all. So I'm still pretty irritated by the assertion.
I posed the rhetorical question 'Why would you want this?' which is not very different than 'Why are you worried about it?'.
I'm definitely not, it's just that I saw the assertion and I supposed there is no real support for it.

[jancivil]

("partly, because it's not the whole picture." It's but a sketch of a tiny part of the picture.)

What is a concern is what I went into as to 'copies', which is a concern you share. But if the species gets to where we can't tell, f**k us, we're shit. We're doomed on a far more basic level anyway.

[jancivil]

program that

"expect a reappraisal of..."
my ass

[telecode]

"expect a reappraisal of..."
my ass

Actually, the response is, George Michael did it better. Why? Because he was a true artist and had a better voice. He also took the original to a whole new other level that gave it distinctiveness and other worldliness. These peeps are just starbucks hipsters trying to cash in on clicks by covering a well known cover. But whatever..

I have way more respect for these guys because they have a sense of humor about what they are doing and come across as much less snobby about what they are doing ... fishing for youtube clicks.

[vurt]

In creative terms, it's like that Ford or Coke ad that gets broadcast on TV or Internet -- instead of a million people seeing the same as, AI will enable these companies to customize the ad experience for each viewer which will greatly increase changes of a sale. i.e. if you like EDM, you will hear EDM in the ad and if I like R&B, I will hear R&B in that ad. They will get info from the data they collect on you. Its very plausible and very possible this will happen with AI technology in the next 10 years at the rate its progressing.

like i said earlier, im not too worried yet about ai in this sense.
i log on to youtube, it offers me many things i have no interest in watching.
i log on to amazon, its suggests i buy coldplay albums
i get google ads for lawnmowers and car stuff.

the ai, has no clue about me what so ever!

agi, is the one we should really be worried about, that's when an ai doesn't have a given task, its just thinking, that's the one that could go skynet!
and given everything will be connected soon (my friend can open his curtains from his mobile phone???? too much f**king money if you ask me....) well be murdered by kettles and sexbots


speaking of which: there are plans in the making (read in the economist so not some bullshit interweb site) to add a law regarding hacking sex bots to murder the user.

why we need this im not sure? surely "murder" in and of itself is the illegal part, the method is irrelevant?

[vurt]

We'll be living in the digital age of plenty where we can't be sure if a human or AI created a song.

Expect the reappraisal of live music. Acoustic live music in particular. You can't fool it's created by (the help of) a AI DAW!

This is just laughable. Ludicrous really. I have to wonder if you have the first clue about what goes into real music. No, if you really did you wouldn't have this particular fantasy.

Why would there be a "reappraisal" of acoustic live music? Because AI. You need more than a brain to get your touch together on a stringed instrument; you need all kinds of physical apparatus to be a wind player. Do you actually entertain a fantasy of a robot doing this any time soon? The feedback from touch on an instrument is extremely complex. This is supposedly going to be in the realm of digital binary code? When? How? What of the problems here are you currently studying?
Show your work.

Pure fantasy.

I appreciate your reaction. And I appreciate your concern, at least that’s how your post appears to me. The fierceness of it gives me the impression you feel quite uncomfortable of AI possibly having such an impact. I may be wrong though.

You are so very wrong. I meant what I said, it's a baseless fantasy afaic. I'm not afraid of unicorns or the tooth fairy.
I was offended by the glib dismissal. No one needs AI for it {aside from 1) disability or 2) people who won't be equipped anyway.}. So the qualification "(the help of)" has no real meaning.
I challenged you to show your investigation into what is to be done.

i can see a "reprisal" of live acoustic music, with real musicians, if we do end up with the ai music releases.
people might go and see the odd artist who is purely ai based, but we as humans don't actually appreciate perfection.
its not right, it wont feed that part of the human psyche that 20 tabla players can. the excitement as it builds and the players are like dervish's with their hands, you sweat watching them...

its that shiver up the spine, the connection between two humans sharing a moment.
that's what live music is. not an algorithm.

[Hink]

does live music not exist if only the performer is there to enjoy it?

[vurt]

does live music not exist if only the performer is there to enjoy it?

well yes of course.
i was talking about the difference between an ai performance and a human performance. to an audience member.
no ai is going to be able to have that connection.
thinking as an audience memberin this case, rather than a musician, we get that shiver communicating with our instruments, those moments we become one.

[BBFG#]

I keep hearing from current and post-millennials that the world will end in less than twelve years now. Then of course someone will get that pulse thing to happen, rendering the internet infrastructure useless and all our computers to be used as what they all ultimately become anyway... doorstops. Using wood for guitars will be completely outlawed as well as smelting metals or mold injecting of petroleum vinyls and plastics.

So if that hyperbole somehow turns out true...

In ten years the DAW will be three people with sticks looking for a log to beat on while hoping the tribal police won't find and execute them for abusing nature.

Chances are, between the two extremes, things will not be very much different than now. Just smoother and more consistent.

[Hink]

does live music not exist if only the performer is there to enjoy it?

well yes of course.
i was talking about the difference between an ai performance and a human performance. to an audience member.
no ai is going to be able to have that connection.
thinking as an audience memberin this case, rather than a musician, we get that shiver communicating with our instruments, those moments we become one.

I agree with you but dont we already have such a perception from many, for example today's music is just pushing buttons...we realize the bs behind that bias but it already exists and peope are going to the shows believing the music is computer generated and the artist is some sort of operator

[vurt]

In ten years the DAW will be three people with sticks looking for a log to beat on while hoping the tribal police won't find and execute them for abusing nature.

what about rocks?

[vurt]

does live music not exist if only the performer is there to enjoy it?

well yes of course.
i was talking about the difference between an ai performance and a human performance. to an audience member.
no ai is going to be able to have that connection.
thinking as an audience memberin this case, rather than a musician, we get that shiver communicating with our instruments, those moments we become one.

I agree with you but dont we already have such a perception from many, for example today's music is just pushing buttons...we realize the bs behind that bias but it already exists and peope are going to the shows believing the music is computer generated and the artist is some sort of operator

but do people really enjoy those shows? when they think that i mean?
many years ago, i was lucky enough to see kraftwerk performing. the majority of the audience, im assuming i didn't ask, must have had that mindset, because honestly they where mostly stood like statues, then clapping between the tracks.
no dancing, no whooping and hollering when your fave track was played...
i was getting some right stares going absolutely mental with me 3d gigs on
there where a few other dancers there, im not saying i was the only one.
weirdest gig ive ever been to.

same when you go to classical gigs, although everyone is seated and theres less whooping and such. you can see the people who are there because they love the music, the performance, theyre on the edge of their seats, hands are wringing, eyes fixated on the performers.
then there are those who are there to be seen. they sit, ocassionally look at their watches or the program...

[toonertik]

Chances are, between the two extremes, things will not be very much different than now. Just smoother and more consistent.

Not my ass... as I get older, it gets rougher...
as to consistent ... hmmm,
the only thing I have know or consistency.. is my foolishness...

Let us remember what AI is...
Artificial... I repeat artificial intelligence..
the day it becomes real intelligence, what is the need for human life... how boring it will become...
And my toaster will not be controlled.. no 5G near me thank you very much..

BTW... IF I am still around.. I still make sounds..
the way I have for over 50 years.. ))))

[vurt]

BTW... IF I am still around.. I still make sounds..
the way I have for over 50 years.. ))))

are you la petomane?