Studio One Pro 4.5

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
chk071
KVRAF
20413 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Thu May 23, 2019 2:38 pm

LawrenceF wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 4:52 am
I'd personally resist any DAW trying to be all things to all people or genres though. They should cover some of it sure, but I wouldn't want to see Cubase or Studio One turn into Bitwig or Live, or vice versa. Their paths or workflows vary for a good reason, to give people different choices.
Big plus one. If people want Live's or Bitwig's workflow and features, they should stick to those DAW's.

LawrenceF
KVRAF
6070 posts since 4 Dec, 2004

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 2:56 pm

Passing Bye wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:21 pm
Personally I hope they include clip launching and easy sampling from them, that would make Bitwig and Live quite redundant to me for studio use
Yeah, make sense. I thought they did some of that in Impact XT, but I won't pretend to know what clip launching means to people here.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques ... -impact-xt
you can build a loop arranger, clip launcher, or whatever it is you call the system that lets you fire off loops and clips in an Ableton Live style.

reggie1979
KVRian
609 posts since 26 Nov, 2018

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 3:24 pm

Impact XT is shizzle. It's the one thing I truly miss from Studio One.

Passing Bye
KVRian
726 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 3:37 pm

LawrenceF wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:56 pm
Passing Bye wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:21 pm
Personally I hope they include clip launching and easy sampling from them, that would make Bitwig and Live quite redundant to me for studio use
Yeah, make sense. I thought they did some of that in Impact XT, but I won't pretend to know what clip launching means to people here.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques ... -impact-xt
you can build a loop arranger, clip launcher, or whatever it is you call the system that lets you fire off loops and clips in an Ableton Live style.
I didn't meant Studio One per se, but linear DAW's in general, they should improve their workflow in that direction for sure, actually seeing this update made me rethink Studio One, direction of development seems good and I'm actually all for getting whatever feature other DAW has that makes more sense to end user and actually listening to user base, so in nutshell, any company that is interested to stay competitive is worth my attention, because in the end of the day I wish to stay with one DAW and likes of Studio One, Cubase and Logic are closest to perfection, just few Bitwig/Live features and that's it for me.
Mathematics wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:03 pm
Subscription is an awesome idea when it's not the only option.

Trancit
KVRAF
2127 posts since 27 Jul, 2004

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 4:26 pm

One thing I like to note in regards of the new Midi tools...
Perhaps someone responsable sees and understand this...

I was first impressed to have them before really trying and really thinking...
After this initial euphoria...:

As most of them are more or less copied from FL Studio please consider to do it correctly...

The magic of FL Studio´s PR editor is not only to have these tools but the visually realtime preview what they do to the midi and to be able to tweak these tools live while playing ... see and hear in realtime what you do... this is the point and this how most of you all work, right??

I cannot imagine most of you closing your eyes and randomly clicking in notes on the PR editor for serious work (other than for some rare experimantal stuff)...
Neither would I expect from a mixing engineer that he tweaks the compressor or EQ while the audio is stopped, then listen, ok rubbish, stop the audio and make a new try...
So why should this be ok with these midi tools??

It´s always nice to have new tools built in into S1 but tbh the usage of these atm is only blind flying, respectively trial and error... select your events, make some adjustments to the controls of the macro and hit ok... you don´t like it...hmmm lets undo all, make the selection again, tweak the controls again and hit ok again... you don´t like it again... hmmm let´s undo...

It´s easy to make some quick changes in a demo video and tell the people how much you love the changes... real life sadly works different most of the time...
Just having the tools without being able to see what they do is like trying to repair a broken machine in darkest night... ever tried???

Perhaps someone at Presonus is brave enough to make these really useable ...atm... they are a nice gimmick which could serve you in some cases but with equal chance it´s quicker to make the desired changes manually... in this case the new tool has failed imo... and your are beaten by a 15 year old implementation of the same tools into a DAW people have called a toy for many many years...

No offense, just some critism as a client because atm you didn´t do your work on them properly...

Passing Bye
KVRian
726 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 4:45 pm

Yeah, even Audition and the likes have preview so you can hear before you commit to the change, so yes, real time is the way to go.
Mathematics wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:03 pm
Subscription is an awesome idea when it's not the only option.

oneway
KVRist
69 posts since 11 Dec, 2017

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 4:53 pm

Trancit, excellent point. When I say Studio One still has room to grow as a creators daw (for my style of music, modern pop) this is the kind of refinement I mean. Things that allow you to use the current tool set in a more efficient, accurate, and effective way. Not launching clips, just stuff that makes it a better linear DAW with frankly my favorite ergonomics in the business. Things like:

- Refinements for composition such as real-time feedback from Musical Functions, fleshing out the pattern editor, note fx, automation containers, features like Cubase’s Chord Pads or Chord Assistant.

- “Real” mixer features like a true solo bus, PFL, better cue mixing/Monitor room type stuff (contrary to popular belief a lot of us on Pop love this stuff - this is a vocally driven genre)

- perfecting the workflow of the instruments we have, the little stuff that we’ve already been doing well re ergonomics and reducing the # of clicks for common operations. Also includes improving flexibility/efficiency with 3rd party tools, things like better Dropout Protection, simpler external instrument tracking, more accurate direct input, simpler MIDI routing,

Lawrence, good point re the “something for everyone” approach. I don’t jive with the clip launch approach to arranging in a DAW. Patterns and automation items, sure, but the whole performative aspect of Live should be left to Live IMHO. They do it best, really we don’t need to muddy up the program with it. a lot of people who use Ableton don’t even use the arrangement view and their vocals are tracked in other programs. Frankly I think this is why the arrangement view and the mixer in Live is so badly neglected. There’s a good lesson in that.

That being sad, the improvements mentioned in the first paragraph are still well in line with a linear and purposeful (vs improvisational) DAW that incorporates composition and mixing, like cubase, studio one or logic.

Love what came in 4.5 and excited for what’s next.

Passing Bye
KVRian
726 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 5:08 pm

oneway wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 4:53 pm
I don’t jive with the clip launch approach to arranging in a DAW.
I use it mainly for composing, I can lay out how many versions I want of one section and just try all of them one after another, mix match elements between all of variations and come up with best solution so quickly. I see Studio One have his own solution for that, but still, doing that in Bitwig is way easier and it's also just one additional panel in it, think Sonar have it too, it's not about changing nature of a DAW, Bitwig for me is as linear studio DAW as any other (minus advanced features old linear ones inherited), it's about incorporating great solutions for music making.
Mathematics wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:03 pm
Subscription is an awesome idea when it's not the only option.

oneway
KVRist
69 posts since 11 Dec, 2017

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 5:37 pm

Passing Bye wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 5:08 pm
oneway wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 4:53 pm
I don’t jive with the clip launch approach to arranging in a DAW.
I use it mainly for composing, I can lay out how many versions I want of one section and just try all of them one after another, mix match elements between all of variations and come up with best solution so quickly. I see Studio One have his own solution for that, but still, doing that in Bitwig is way easier.
That's cool. Maybe I'll play with my Bitwig 8 track sometime. It's a good point, there are ways those systems can help compare potential arrangements without being fully performance-oriented. Maybe it'll give me some ideas for good FR's for improving our Arrangertrack and Pattern system. These types of features are exciting right up until the point that they interfere with doing a vocal session within the same DAW :)

Passing Bye
KVRian
726 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Thu May 23, 2019 5:38 pm

Exactly! :)
Mathematics wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:03 pm
Subscription is an awesome idea when it's not the only option.

rich_h
KVRian
779 posts since 3 Apr, 2003 from UK

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Fri May 24, 2019 8:16 am

jinotsuh wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 1:23 pm
jens wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 6:46 am

and at least with Amplitube (didn't try many plugins yet) in low-latency mode I have to disable and then re-enable the low-latency for parameter changes within Amplitube to become active...

What did they do?
People have reported this issue with Amplitube prior to 4.5.0, so not neccessarily introduced with 4.5.0 as it has existed previously. I have never encountered it personally.
Yes, this was indeed the case with previous versions too. You should be able to partly address it within Amplitube by assigning the parameters you are going to be adjusting to automation parameters, although obviously this is not ideal.

dellboy
KVRian
948 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Fri May 24, 2019 8:35 am

LawrenceF wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:56 pm

Yeah, make sense. I thought they did some of that in Impact XT, but I won't pretend to know what clip launching means to people here.

For me, Live is not about clip launching, but clip building. I never use someone else's clips. A lot of popular music is built around bars that repeat, and Live gives the ability to quickly knock up a song built around bars of different lengths and re-arranging them to build a song.

Studio One goes some way towards this method with the arranger track, as does Cubase.

Digital Performer has already introduced the clip way of working - and that's always been a traditional linear DAW.

jonljacobi
KVRian
948 posts since 16 Jan, 2013 from USA

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Fri May 24, 2019 10:44 am

Oneway, what do you mean by ergonomics, and why is S1 your favorite in the business?

gentleclockdivider
KVRAF
1822 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Fri May 24, 2019 5:31 pm

Nice daw , just checked out the demo and found a quircky bug

midi cc labelled cutoff is actually sending resonance (cc71) and vice versa ..
Funny no one noticed this ...
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies

oneway
KVRist
69 posts since 11 Dec, 2017

Re: Studio One Pro 4.5

Post Fri May 24, 2019 7:10 pm

dellboy wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 8:35 am
For me, Live is not about clip launching, but clip building. I never use someone else's clips. A lot of popular music is built around bars that repeat, and Live gives the ability to quickly knock up a song built around bars of different lengths and re-arranging them to build a song.

Studio One goes some way towards this method with the arranger track, as does Cubase.

Digital Performer has already introduced the clip way of working - and that's always been a traditional linear DAW.
Oh when I say clip launching im not talking about pattern based sequencing. I'm talking about firing off clips in real time improvisationally and then taking that performance and editing it. Which is where ableton and maschine always fell apart for me... I dumped the performance into the arrangemnet window and went... great... now what? Still so clunky multiple versions later.

Pattern based sequencing is incredibly valuable and has been since it was introduced in the early to mid 1980s. Hopefully with some nudging Presonus (and other companies frankly) will realize that even though pattern based sequencing was sort of born of necessity when media was 3.5" floppies, there was a lot of great, efficient, and productive design choices made in the days of pattern based sequencing that DAWs could all incorporate if they put some hard thought into it.
jonljacobi wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 10:44 am
Oneway, what do you mean by ergonomics, and why is S1 your favorite in the business?
When I say ergonomics I mean accomplishing as much as possible with as few physical movements. There is a prevailing goal in the culture of the software team to do more things with less. Not all of these things are documented well, sadly, but things like Alt + Clicking on an insert rack to close all insert racks. Selecting 100 tracks and CMD + Dragging an insert they all share out of the insert rack and it will remove every single one. It's not just drag and drop, it's what they considered about their customers when deciding what you could drag where. It's a little mouse heavy (only a problem on a laptop touchpad imho) but I cannot imagine using a mixer or arrange view without Studio One's workflow.

Lots of DAWs have customizable modifiers, macros, and hotkeys, and I used to have to make use of them in other software. They don't offer a lot of that here, but I haven't really needed it. They actually thought about how I want to work and how to make it faster. That's priceless. I think that's the reason S1 users are so critical about features that are still getting refined or fleshed out. The core feature set of the DAW interface has been so considerately designed that anything basic or rough feels out of place :) And it wasn't just desinged that way at the beginning, tons of very efficient little behaviors were introduced in 3.3 and 3.5. Now 4.5 was more about actions/commands honestly, but if they remember that people came and stayed for their design and efficiency and keep bringing that in future versions, customers are going to reward them again and again and again.

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