Clip based approach

[ChamomileShark]

I come from a background of tape machines and more recently Cubase.

I'm trying to understand what a clip based approach offers to someone not doing any gigs.

I bought Bitwig for the device modulation but thought I'd try the clip based approach. I don't really get it. I can loop audio or MIDI in something like Cubase and set it out so that loops can overlap or not, some loops play while others don't and arrange that way.

What is it that I'm missing?

[dellboy]

I come from a background of tape machines and more recently Cubase.

I'm trying to understand what a clip based approach offers to someone not doing any gigs.

I bought Bitwig for the device modulation but thought I'd try the clip based approach. I don't really get it. I can loop audio or MIDI in something like Cubase and set it out so that loops can overlap or not, some loops play while others don't and arrange that way.

What is it that I'm missing?

In theory Cubase has "independent clip looping" but I have not figured out how it works. In practice it should allow bars of different lengths to loop independently along the linear timeline.

So play 8 bars of bass, and set it looping - 4 bars of drums and set it looping - 6 bars of piano and set it looping. The bars of different lengths should sync and play together. Live and Bitwig do this with ease,and very quickly.

To achieve something similar in Cubase requires setting out markers, say 8 bars in length and then copying bars to fill in to make them all fit into 8 bars and set to loop and hit play.

Cakewalk Sonar has a Matrix view whereby bars of different lengths can be dragged from the linear view into the Matrix cells and they miraculously sync together when play is hit.

[Psuper]

I come from a background of tape machines and more recently Cubase.

I'm trying to understand what a clip based approach offers to someone not doing any gigs.

I bought Bitwig for the device modulation but thought I'd try the clip based approach. I don't really get it. I can loop audio or MIDI in something like Cubase and set it out so that loops can overlap or not, some loops play while others don't and arrange that way.

What is it that I'm missing?

In theory Cubase has "independent clip looping" but I have not figured out how it works. In practice it should allow bars of different lengths to loop independently along the linear timeline.

So play 8 bars of bass, and set it looping - 4 bars of drums and set it looping - 6 bars of piano and set it looping. The bars of different lengths should sync and play together. Live and Bitwig do this with ease,and very quickly.

To achieve something similar in Cubase requires setting out markers, say 8 bars in length and then copying bars to fill in to make them all fit into 8 bars and set to loop and hit play.

Cakewalk Sonar has a Matrix view whereby bars of different lengths can be dragged from the linear view into the Matrix cells and they miraculously sync together when play is hit.

You can set the individual loops in the editor below, just click the 'Independent track loop', drag however many bars you want to play (loop) in the editor, and they'll endlessly loop without needing to copy/paste anything in the main sequencer window. Unbelievably simple and flexible, can do that with as many instruments as you like, all will loop to the custom marker you set per individual instrument, change it on the fly while its playing, just slick as hell.

[dellboy]

You can set the individual loops in the editor below, just click the 'Independent track loop', drag however many bars you want to play (loop) in the editor, and they'll endlessly loop without needing to copy/paste anything in the main sequencer window. Unbelievably simple and flexible, can do that with as many instruments as you like, all will loop to the custom marker you set per individual instrument, change it on the fly while its playing, just slick as hell.

OK, I figured it out now for midi, but can it do the same for audio ?

It works, but its not very elegant.

Cakewalk Sonars version is really easy, and it allows clip launching form the PC keyboard or midi note.

Live and Bitwig are made for this stuff.

[Psuper]

It's supposed to, based on the video evidence here (starting where it begins the audio looping at 14.05):


I just tried it and couldn't figure out how to enable the track looping on audio as he did. But I rarely work with loops (I do, but not the way most people do) its just something I learned as I've been taking Cubase through the paces.

Anyone else know how to enable audio recording loops as seen in the above video?

[xbitz]

sry bit long... but

^^^^ first 7minutes can be skipped

[xbitz]

double

[Psuper]

You can set the individual loops in the editor below, just click the 'Independent track loop', drag however many bars you want to play (loop) in the editor, and they'll endlessly loop without needing to copy/paste anything in the main sequencer window. Unbelievably simple and flexible, can do that with as many instruments as you like, all will loop to the custom marker you set per individual instrument, change it on the fly while its playing, just slick as hell.

OK, I figured it out now for midi, but can it do the same for audio ?

It works, but its not very elegant.

Cakewalk Sonars version is really easy, and it allows clip launching form the PC keyboard or midi note.

Live and Bitwig are made for this stuff.

Also that's 2 different things - from what I gathered you were looking at setting up loops on the main sequencer screen. And while there's multiple ways to do so, that was the way most closely resembling what you guys were asking for.

If you're talking about setting up clips to launch/use in a live setting or being played on the keyboard etc use Grooveagent - thing is a damn beast so easy to use - take audio slice hitpoint: create slices, drag whatever to a pad, go to town, its drag and drop heaven man back and forth (and anywhere really) - took me one day to go through most of what I'll use it for, just start there if the independent loop in the editor isn't what your after.

[Psuper]

It's supposed to, based on the video evidence here (starting where it begins the audio looping at 14.05):


I just tried it and couldn't figure out how to enable the track looping on audio as he did. But I rarely work with loops (I do, but not the way most people do) its just something I learned as I've been taking Cubase through the paces.

Anyone else know how to enable audio recording loops as seen in the above video?

Figured it out (for looping independent Audio in the sequencer) -- instead of double clicking, he went to Audio:Events to Part. There it is.

[dellboy]

Figured it out (for looping independent Audio in the sequencer) -- instead of double clicking, he went to Audio:Events to Part. There it is.

Yes, got that now.

Although there does not seem a way for more than one track to loop independently.

It seems like Steinberg started work and this idea and never finished it, pity.

It would be great to just right click on a clip and tick "loop".

[Psuper]

You can have as many tracks as you want looping independently, you set it per track in the sequencer editor section. I find it far more useful to my workflow for experimenting in midi -- slap down a beat, loop it where I want, play a bunch of accompaniments, loop those where I like, and build.

But again, for what you want, just drag the clip to a pad in grooveagent and loop it all day long, create patterns, drag them around, throw on beatdesigner if you like, drag as many as you want, slice,isolate, drag, play them automatically or use pads/keys. I'm finding it just way easy and powerful.

As for a right click function to loop, take off the hover right click that is there by default and look through the options (I'm not in front of my DAW can't check). But having grooveagent is just dragging instead of right clicking, and you can drag from windows folders or anywhere else which makes it effortless.

[pdxindy]

Live and Bitwig are made for this stuff.

Yeah, if you want to do realtime and non-linear clip and scene launching, then Live and Bitwig are the ones to choose from.

[sguyader]

Usine Hollyhock allows, using the "grid".

[Googly Smythe]

Non-linear mode in Cubase, from the manual (page 318 v10):

The arranger functions in Cubase allow you to work in a non-linear fashion. Using an arranger track allows you to specify how and when specific sections are played back, even in live performances. This way, you do not need to move, copy, and paste events in the Project window.
NOTE
There can be only one arranger track in a project.
To use the arranger functions, you must add an arranger track and define arranger events.
Arranger events can be of any length. They can overlap and are not bound to the start or end of existing events and parts. You can order them in a list, and add repeats as desired

[Psuper]

Non-linear mode in Cubase, from the manual (page 318 v10):

The arranger functions in Cubase allow you to work in a non-linear fashion. Using an arranger track allows you to specify how and when specific sections are played back, even in live performances. This way, you do not need to move, copy, and paste events in the Project window.
NOTE
There can be only one arranger track in a project.
To use the arranger functions, you must add an arranger track and define arranger events.
Arranger events can be of any length. They can overlap and are not bound to the start or end of existing events and parts. You can order them in a list, and add repeats as desired

It just keeps getting better and better... I haven't got anywhere near the Arranger yet, but had to quickly see what its about, here ya go:



Not quite what I expected, but useful - then that flatten omg!