discoDSP Synths

[audiojunkie]

Look guys, the only thing I’m trying to say is that this change is not a scam. It’s a change in business model. It’s not dishonest.

You don't understand the problem. He advert that for example DiscoveryPro 6.5 and above users get a free update to 6.8. only he fortgot to mention how to ge it. No Mail about update & the subscription model was announced only on social Media. As i logged in to download my free upgrade it came out that i have to pay 29 bucks. So can you explain me what you find right in this behaviour?

OK, I can see how that would frustrate you. It would have frustrated me too.

[audiojunkie]

Look guys, the only thing I’m trying to say is that this change is not a scam. It’s a change in business model. It’s not dishonest.

It breaks the original agreement. Even if you declare $29 as a „download fee“ you can‘t just force this on existing customers. There are clearly business models which are scams, there is no contradiction between those two words...
If he would ask for a reasonable download fee, and would declare it before purchase, or at least inform everybody to get their downloads before putting it into place, there would not be such big waves about it...

I personally don't remember the original agreement, but if what you say is correct, then that would be a problem for existing customers.

[audiojunkie]

That’s ludicrous! Suppose you crash your new car on the freeway. The dealer doesn’t owe you a new one. Suppose you scratched your new Blue ray disk and it no longer works. Should a movie theater let you in again for free to watch the same show again, just because you lost the plot? Make a backup like sane people do. I lost a year and a half of family pictures because my old hard drive finally failed and I didn’t make a backup. Should I expect the hard drive manufacturer to replace my out of warranty hard drive or should I sue because I lost my pictures? You were given a period of time to download the application for no additional cost when you bought it. You should have taken responsible measures to protect your purchase. A scam!! What an entitled generation we’ve become! Talk about first-world problems! Sheesh!

the problem with this analogy is that you're not comparing apples to apples. software is not a physical product (at least that's what software industry has told us for years), so it can't be analogous to physical goods. yet, it seems like some software developers prefer to treat their software as physical goods when it suits them (i.e. avoid all responsibility) but take advantage of the fact that it's not physical goods (impose license transfer fees, "cloud subscriptions", etc) when they can suck some more money off their customers.

the example with pictures is laughable. you produced the pictures, not hard drive manufacturer, so it's on you to back them up.

Hehehe Yes, I thought it was funny too, but I was just trying to illustrate a point.

[mladi]

Look guys, the only thing I’m trying to say is that this change is not a scam. It’s a change in business model. It’s not dishonest.

You don't understand the problem. He advert that for example DiscoveryPro 6.5 and above users get a free update to 6.8. only he fortgot to mention how to ge it. No Mail about update & the subscription model was announced only on social Media. As i logged in to download my free upgrade it came out that i have to pay 29 bucks. So can you explain me what you find right in this behaviour?

OK, I can see how that would frustrate you. It would have frustrated me too.

I'm not frustated i only explained why your statement is wrong.

[audiojunkie]

It’s a business model. Software as a subscription. I agree the wording probably should be changed to not use the word, Free. It’s a paid update, through subscription access. You may not like it, but it’s a valid business model that is gaining popularity. And businesses change their business models all the time, services increase rates, prices go up, etc. It’s called staying in business. You don’t have to like it. As a customer, it is perfectly fair to vote with your wallet and not buy further products. But this is definitely NOT a scam as others have said. It’s a change in business model, and like it or not, it’s not dishonest. You said it yourself—the market is saturated. Buy something else. If the developer finds that this model doesn’t work, he’ll have to change again or go out of business.

You are wrong, and it blows my mind how anyone could defend this practice. The subscription has been introduced for all customers regardless of whether they knew about it or not, which is a total change to the terms and conditions of the original sale. As someone else mentioned it's like a bait and switch. It's incredibly poor, I don't know how any developer could be so cheap as to not provide downloads for legit customers purchased software. If you are struggling so badly, just create a google drive account (or multiple accounts) and allow people to download their stuff. To me though this looks like the company is f**ked beyond repair, and he's just looking to milk it for all it's worth before it's abandoned. Why else would you throw your entire userbase under the bus? Why anyone would willingly choose to give this guy their money or defend his actions is beyond my comprehension.

You bring up some good points. Terms and conditions of the original purchase cannot be changed to my knowledge.

[audiojunkie]

I bought 3 DiscoDSP synths in 09/10 2018, less than a year ago. I log into my account and can't download and am asked to buy cloud. Figuring this is just a migration mistake I email discoDSP asking to get the downloads activated. Here is the reply.

This is not acceptable. Bait and switch business practices. discoDSP F-, AVOID (you never know what the company is going to do next to make your life harder)

On Jun 19, 2019, at 12:48 PM,<support@discodsp.com> wrote:

Hello, try contacting FastSpring or purchasing our cloud service for 1 year + free updates for all the purchased products within the same time frame.

Best regards,

Good grief. I would like to see an official comment on this. I mean it's either a yes or a no. I don't like to judge too quickly, but I can't see this is as anything but bad.

That's been my concern as well. I didn't want to judge too quickly. However, I'm seeing that there is definitely something wrong with this if the original terms and conditions were changed.

[audiojunkie]

I bought an upgrade on August 3, 2018. I have installers 6.8, but I cannot download 6.8.1. I need to pay a subscription.

6.8.1 was released on August 20. Cloud was introduced a few weeks ago... Is this defamation campaign going to last forever here?

Is it true that you changed the terms and conditions for original licensees? Could you comment on this please?

[audiojunkie]

This is such a shame.

I have forever been a fan of OB-xD. It is a free synth with paid quality. The filter is phenomenal, it has a wonderful meatiness to it. Makes me happy just thinking about it hahaha. Great job on that!
But developer attitude and policy matters. I've been in touch and had contact with the owners of many small companies for various reasons. Every interaction, even if I had a problem, has lead to an increase in my confidence with said company. "They make make a mistake, but they'll fix it." You need to understand just how huge this is.

My point is, you may be in the right 'legally'. But there's a large difference between what's legal and what normal human beings perceive as right and wrong. You are completely entitled to hide behind legalities - that's your prerogative. However, in terms of growing a business, I recommend you try and see the bigger picture.

The fact remains that I will buy Xfer, Cockos, U-he, AudioAssault or ToneBoosters products at full price with 100% confidence. I will get my money's worth. Actually, in my experience, probably more than my money's worth. But discoDSP hiding behind legalese claims of 'defamation' without clearing the crux of the matter does not inspire my confidence.

No one here wants to see you go down or go out of business. Your current customers just want a bit of honesty regarding your business practices, and spectators want some kind of transparency.

There's really no need to throw around legalese, because that makes you look guilty.

Well said! I, for one, want to see George succeed. Bliss is something special that doesn't exist anywhere else. I just want to see everyone happy and business to get back to normal.

[audiojunkie]

Question for George. How is it good business practice to make someone pay for a product twice? And why do you never send email updates? You need to take a good look at yourself and your business model. You are taking a pasting on here, but imo its warranted (and after seeing a simple question deleted from the dsp forum, Im done with this shady company. Im out)

I've actually been receiving email updates all along.

[Calandria]

I hope this thread isn't locked.
I worry that the KVR management will buckle to discoDSP's unfair pressure.

[digitalboytn]

Yeah, he didnt code that, 2dat did.

standing on the shoulder of giants and all that...

Figures lol.

The only things that George seems to code are confusion and contempt

[discoDSP]

Guys... seriously. Bullshit of some people here is raising to spectacular levels.

WTF are you saying about terms have changed? What kind of non sense is that?

You purchased a license to USE THE SOFTWARE. The INSTALLER DOWNLOADS were offered for FREE as COURTESY. THERE IS NOTHING CHANGED REGARDING THE TERMS.

Now you want to get your forgotten download right? Pay for it. It's actually CHEAPER TO PAY CLOUD SERVICE BECAUSE IT COVERS DOWNLOADS AND UPDATES FOR ALL YOUR LINKED PRODUCTS.

If you have a ISSUE just frigging CONTACT ME -> contactus@discodsp.com and I WILL SORT YOUR ISSUE. Bringing THE BEST customer support for THE BEST plugins like I have ALWAYS BEEN DOING.

Hope this moronic thread gets locked for God's sake...

[samsam]

Hey George

Renemder that thread you created about those devs who wouldn't allow transfers? You could start one about companies' policies regarding downloading installers and whether or not to charge?

Could be useful.

[Distorted Horizon]

I'm starting to feel that George made the same mistake than Bitwig did, when they suddenly introduced their subscription model..

It's actually CHEAPER TO PAY CLOUD SERVICE BECAUSE IT COVERS DOWNLOADS AND UPDATES FOR ALL YOUR LINKED PRODUCTS.

So you say that version upgrade will cost 29 currency, and it covers upgrades for all the bought items for one year?
So basically if I buy discovery pro v7 upgrade, I get updates for free during that year for any other ddsp products too that I have. Even major versions?

If that's the case, it would make sense and actually is quite generous.

And if that's the case, I feel very sorry for you for falling to the same hole where the Bitwig fell

[AnX]

wherec s is the source code for the ios version?

legally you have to release it, been a while now

should i contact a lawyer?