Audio I/O advice Focusrite/Steinberg/maybe small mixer?

[kritikon]

Getting back into music after quite a few years out. Used to run a decent sized h/w setup, smaller now but still a handful of h/w synths and at least a couple of h/w FX units + comps (very certain I still prefer some h/w comps over s/w). Will be via a new laptop already bought - reasonable spec i8 thingy with NVME SSD, 8GB RAM on Win10, can't remember how many USB but it has 4 or so with at least one USB C port, so it should be good for a i/o box and a dongle or 2 if needed.

I need to get audio i/o - so far am looking at maybe one of those Steinberg 2/2 boxes, maybe even a bigger one (thinking I might still use multiple i/o though I do still have a couple of patchbays, so I can use those to get h/w into the laptop. In the past managed to use patchbays effectively when I got rid of the old 24ch mixer...really miss that). Also mulling over maybe a Focusrite Red box. Bear in mind I'm in NZ so local choice is limited to say the least, though obviously I could import from overseas...prefer at least something bought in NZ if I can though. Used to run an Aardvark 8i/o box - quality but now defunct, so I don't want just cheapo crap, has to be reasonable quality even if smaller than I was used to.

Pros/cons: Focusrite sold locally. AFAIK they're still decent quality...will need to by Cubase separately. Steinberg comes with Cubase AI so I have an upgrade path to Artist (Elements not likely to have enough that I want...was used to full Cubase in the past) and Steinberg h/w should be very compatible with Cubase, surely. I'm using freebie Cakewalk but it drives me nuts. It's a stopgap only, no way I can use it for much longer. So even using Cubase AI will probably be less head-against-the-wall than Cakewalk for the time being. I could be up and running quickly.

Write ups seem to be that Steinberg h/w is good and sturdy, Focusrite speaks for itself. Any obvious other pros/cons, user advice from anyone who uses them? Maybe even suggestions for other i/o box...upto max of $NZ 500. Possibly even a small digital mixer? I miss mixers, but then would still need to buy DAW on top, and are small USB mixers any good? Possibly I can even still upgrade Cubase from my ancient SX2 ( )

Sorry for several questions in one go.

[BONES]

Hey stranger! Long time, no viddie. The best idea might be a mixer with built-in USB I/O. There are no shortage of them around. My bandmate and I both have Yamaha AG06's and they are great. Channel 1 and Channel 2 have built in insert effects, which you set up via a PC utility, and they give good, clean sound with decent latency.

I recently ran out of channels on mine and had quite a time finding a replacement. Yamaha's next one up gets a lot bigger. The MG10UX is a nice choice, though, but if you want to use USB, it takes up channels 9/10. StoreDJ over the ditch here sell 'em cheap (Au$249). For another $20 you can get a 12 channel Studiocraft mixer, Notepad 12FX, that does the same plus it uses two more for effects returns, so both are effectively 8 channel mixers. I ended up with a Behringer (model no. in my signature) which does the job and has the advantage of using ASIO4all as it's audio driver, which means you can choose outputs and stuff you can't do with dedicated drivers.

Otherwise, I had a Focusrite 2i2 which my bandmate uses and loves. It's a nice, sturdy little unit.

BTW, you just missed out on Steinberg's big half-price Cubase sale. Very poor timing on your part.

[kritikon]

Hi Bones, good to see the oldies still represented here.

Thanks for the heads up...I didn't know mixers had come down in price so much! That might be a better solution for me. At those prices it gives more of what I want at pretty much the same price as a half way decent i/o box. If I can get even 8 channels of mixer, I' d be way happier than fartarseing around with patchbays. Had a Soundcraft mixer back in the day...they used to be OK. Played around with Behringer analogue ones, and I found them a little noisey on adjacent channels, though that was many years back, and comparing against a different class of consoles, which is not really fair on Behringer. TBH I was thinking if mixers were even a possibility, I'd only be able to get a tiny one for the price, but at the price you mention...Aussie -> NZ is not far off par at the moment. You get any inserts on any channels on yours?

I heard there was a Cubase sale. Yeah, pure bad timing.

Thanks for the info...I hadn't thought mixers were a serious possibility for budget but....spend a few years out of it and things change quickly. A souncard is small & handy, but I'm not going to be taking it anywhere anyway, so mixer....yeah.

Cheers Bones.

[kritikon]

Sorry...I reread and saw you mention 1&2 inserts. I can access analogue input inserts, or you mean digital inserts?

[BONES]

The inserts are fixed. You get EQ & reverb on 1 + 2 (shared, same settings) and you get compressor on Ch 1 and an Amp Sim on Ch 2. Both the MG10XU and the Soundcraft have built-in FX but allow you to run your own (send) if you prefer. I don't think any of them allow you to use external inserts but you can always do that in-line.

[vurt]

ive had a focus rite for a good few years, no problems here.
mines the scarlet 6i6.

only 4 analogue inputs but if i need more i add the mixer.
i only record straight to two track these days though, not so fussy about stems at this point.

[kritikon]

The inserts are fixed. You get EQ & reverb on 1 + 2 (shared, same settings) and you get compressor on Ch 1 and an Amp Sim on Ch 2. Both the MG10XU and the Soundcraft have built-in FX but allow you to run your own (send) if you prefer. I don't think any of them allow you to use external inserts but you can always do that in-line.

Thanks Bones. Would be nice to have external inserts but definitely not a deal breaker. I can run inserts via patchbays if I had to...mostly I'd be using external compressors for direct instrument recording. Mostly happy using s/w for busses/mixes etc. Everything else is pretty much ITB...some old FX boxes, but TBH I'm not sure they do anything I can't get with s/w nowadays.

[kritikon]

ive had a focus rite for a good few years, no problems here.
mines the scarlet 6i6.

only 4 analogue inputs but if i need more i add the mixer.
i only record straight to two track these days though, not so fussy about stems at this point.

Another oldie....g'day vurt.
If for nothing else than local availability (I'm still old enough that I like physically buying h/w from a shop - backup and all that) the Focusrite is top of my list for I/O boxes. Good to know they're decent product still. TBH the idea of a mixer is really tempting me now though...been looking some up and...I'm prolly just a sucker for flashing lights and buttons
Just seems easier if I'm using h/w. Too much choice. When I were a lad it was pick either A or B and pay a mortgage for either. Music stuff seems like it's so cheap and so much choice now...not complaining, mind. I can do now for a few hundred bucks what I spent 10's of thousands on back in the day. Nice. Might even keep the missus happy.

[BONES]

Yeah, the price of stuff is what's go the back using more hardware. When you can get something like Audiothingie's MicroMonsta for US$250 or a proper 2 osc analogue synth like IK's Uno for under US$200, it's very hard to resist.

Thanks Bones. Would be nice to have external inserts but definitely not a deal breaker. I can run inserts via patchbays if I had to...mostly I'd be using external compressors for direct instrument recording. Mostly happy using s/w for busses/mixes etc. Everything else is pretty much ITB...some old FX boxes, but TBH I'm not sure they do anything I can't get with s/w nowadays.

If you've been away for a while, it think the biggest thing you'll notice is how far the sound quality of software has come. I was out of the loop for a few years and only got back into it properly 18 months or so ago and that's what blew me away. Download a few demos, like Synapse's Dune and Diva or RePro from U-He and see what I mean. It's surprising how far the game has moved on.

[kritikon]

I'll try those, thanks. I already know I'll get a s/w Wavestation (my old keyboard finally died ), and probably update impOscar, also look at what samplers are doing nowadays...they seemed to be heading off in interesting directions a few years ago. Dunno if samplers are even a thing nowadays?
Was looking at mixers and definitely have to get one - looks like $300 should get me what I need. Xenyx looking good at the moment. Thinking about it sensibly, I'll have to get an i/o box as well simply for midi. Not quite sure how I'm going to work that...mixer directly into the audio i/o or mixer into laptop via USB? If I use the midi via USB can I also USB the mixer at the same time?

[BONES]

You should be able to. It's what we used to do on stage - audio I/O to the PA and MIDI to my bandmate's OctaPad, via a separate USB-MIDI interface, so he could trigger drum sounds on my PC. It always worked.

[crimsonwarlock]

If I use the midi via USB can I also USB the mixer at the same time?

Should definitely work. I have a lot of MIDI over USB stuff and it just stacks up all the MIDI channels inside your DAW to select from. Same with audio. I'm running a Focusrite Scarlet 18i20 with an additional OctoPre and besides that a Motu Midi Express 128. Then I have several MIDI controllers that run over their own dedicated USB. I have a simple powered USB hub to have enough ports to get it all running at the same time, no problems with that either.

Not sure how much you are invested in Cubase, but Reaper has come a long way over the last years. It has quite a learning curve because of the crazy amount of features it has. For most people it is a love-it or hate-it thing, but it's definitely the most bang for the buck price wise (the license is 60 bucks, including all upgrades for the current AND the next major version). And you can download the full working, non crippled version to try it out for an extended period to see if it fits you. I'm running it for years now and am pretty proficient with it, so if you have any questions just ask

[kritikon]

If I use the midi via USB can I also USB the mixer at the same time?

Should definitely work. I have a lot of MIDI over USB stuff and it just stacks up all the MIDI channels inside your DAW to select from. Same with audio. I'm running a Focusrite Scarlet 18i20 with an additional OctoPre and besides that a Motu Midi Express 128. Then I have several MIDI controllers that run over their own dedicated USB. I have a simple powered USB hub to have enough ports to get it all running at the same time, no problems with that either.

Not sure how much you are invested in Cubase, but Reaper has come a long way over the last years. It has quite a learning curve because of the crazy amount of features it has. For most people it is a love-it or hate-it thing, but it's definitely the most bang for the buck price wise (the license is 60 bucks, including all upgrades for the current AND the next major version). And you can download the full working, non crippled version to try it out for an extended period to see if it fits you. I'm running it for years now and am pretty proficient with it, so if you have any questions just ask

Thanks. I hadn't thought about a USB hub. I think my laptop has 3 USB standard ports (might be 2) and a USB C one, so I should have enough, even if I end up with Cubase on a dongle. I'll have a look at Reaper, but I spent 20 years with Cubase right from the get-go on an Atari back in the day, so the workflow is just so familiar, I'm reluctant to have to get used to another one. Cakewalk has a lot of similarities but even that just slows me down so much compared to Cubase.
Should I be using the USB C port specifically for audio i/o or for midi? It's supposed to be quickest isn't it?
Cheers

[crimsonwarlock]

Use your fastest port for audio, MIDI doesn't need any real bandwidth.

If you have always worked with Cubase, I'd stick with that. Still have my Atari Mega 1 together with a Steinberg Midex and Cubase..... somewhere. Not sure if the disks would still load though

[vurt]

dont do reaper
it's a cult man
runaway!