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duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:00 pm

clueless wrote:oddly enough, so have I. At least, I was thinking you could analyse any number of pop hits, break them down into a formula of progressions/intervals/repetitions stick the info in one end, and out the other comes (bare minimum) a template for "another pop hit". Or, you could use the template as a modifier for that-really-cool-riff-you-don't-know-what-to-do-with.

"great fun at parties"

When I did my Degree (psychology) just over 10 years ago, one of the lecturers (Robert West) had recently done a study on just such a subject, with the intention of then writing the ultimate hit single.

Alas, his research pointed to there being far more factors involved than just the music - for instance, the Birdie Song got to Number 1... funnily enough a mate of mine did the A&R for that, and gets a percentage everytime it gets airplay.. funny old world!

DSP

wrench45us · Post by **wrench45us** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:05 pm

i was wondering why we seemed to make that jump from triads to 7ths
apparently i got me the classical edumecation

and i used sus chords for full measures all the time
i like that little uncertain and tense quality
same with aug chords -- seems to be a staple in (at least some) trip-hop and atmospheric pieces

C sus 2 is similar to inverted G 6 (w/o third)
C sus 4 is similar to inverted F sus 2

my friend on the coast tells me as long as two notes are the same chord substitutions are all legal (and let the bass player figure out/remember the key)

clueless · Post by **clueless** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:05 pm

xoxos wrote:takes loads of time to analyse source data.. and biologically i've already analysed it, i just need to de-filter the data from my personal prejudices

aye, although I was really thinking of biro/back-of-envelope type analysis. Like breaking down [scratches round for example] er..."Lady Friend" (random example located!) into "it does this, then it does that 3 times, then...".

clueless · Post by **clueless** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:10 pm

duncanparsons wrote:
clueless wrote:oddly enough, so have I. At least, I was thinking you could analyse any number of pop hits, break them down into a formula of progressions/intervals/repetitions stick the info in one end, and out the other comes (bare minimum) a template for "another pop hit". Or, you could use the template as a modifier for that-really-cool-riff-you-don't-know-what-to-do-with.

"great fun at parties"
When I did my Degree (psychology) just over 10 years ago, one of the lecturers (Robert West) had recently done a study on just such a subject, with the intention of then writing the ultimate hit single.

Alas, his research pointed to there being far more factors involved than just the music - for instance, the Birdie Song got to Number 1...

oh yeah, I agree entirely. Every element of the music is a factor. Then there's...well, I'm not sure xoxos can do PR in Synth-Edit.

duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:10 pm

clueless wrote:
xoxos wrote:takes loads of time to analyse source data.. and biologically i've already analysed it, i just need to de-filter the data from my personal prejudices
aye, although I was really thinking of biro/back-of-envelope type analysis. Like breaking down [scratches round for example] er..."Lady Friend" (random example located!) into "it does this, then it does that 3 times, then...".

..exactly.. then The Birdie Song gets to #1. 'A little bit of this, and a little bit of that, now little bit of this, now share your..'

!

DSP

xoxos · Post by **xoxos** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:20 pm

shush up clueless!

clueless · Post by **clueless** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:20 pm

quick! stop him!

xoxos · Post by **xoxos** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:23 pm

jeezus you're fast! slow down! (i forgot what we were on about)

clueless · Post by **clueless** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:36 pm

sorry!

please continue.

duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:38 pm

ain't this fun.

I wrote a perfectly sensible tune once using i-III-VII-II (C#m-E-B-D#) as the progression, worked really nicely the B-D# provided a nice kind of reversed dominant thing.

Wasn't a hit single.

It was prog.

QED.

You can use it as a template if you want...!

DSP

duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:40 pm

clueless wrote:sorry!

please continue.

..which will probably be compleatly lost on xox!

now where's bungle? ('It's fc*king hot in there')

DSP

clueless · Post by **clueless** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:41 pm

duncanparsons wrote:ain't this fun.

I wrote a perfectly sensible tune once using i-III-VII-II (C#m-E-B-D#) as the progression, worked really nicely the B-D# provided a nice kind of reversed dominant thing.

Wasn't a hit single.

It was prog.

QED.

You can use it as a template if you want...!

DSP

ok. erm, but could I also have a template from one of your top ten hits?

*edit* "he said, silently..."

duncanparsons · Post by **duncanparsons** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:46 pm

Oh, my top ten hits.. mumble mumble I used to have 'Rabbit' by chas and dave..

DSP

xoxos · Post by **xoxos** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:56 pm

remember the voice, sort of an "ooh aye gum" affair..

I III VII II? lifted.. heh heh.. *now* i am so great!

wrench45us · Post by **wrench45us** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:55 pm

Rikky Rooksby has a great book 'Song Writing
Sourcebook' that covers practical songwriting theory.

the book is oriented for guitar (there are tabs and such) but it has widr application

he also has a littler book 'Inside Classic Rock Tracks: Songwriting and recording secrets of 100 great songs from 1960 to the present day'

I was hoping for more chord progressions from that book, but I guess there wasn't really enough material to keep it interesting, but he does cover quite a few.

both recommended, first more than the second.

music theory q