Soundtoys 6 - What would you like to see?

[whyterabbyt]

EDIT: Oh, and what is the metric? Current state of the art, of course. Please don't tell me that science is subjective.

Unquantified moving goalposts arent metric.

Meanwhile, plenty of professionals use SoundToys plugins and their longstanding peers like Waves etc; maybe the 'chase the new shiny' cycle is genre specific, but in the wider worlds of recording and post, any set of interviews with producers etc will see those plugins mentioned far more than the constantly shifting flavour of the month 'state of the art'. And the state of the art is constantly volatile, so you're basically saying nothing stays good enough.

Now Im assuming 'PRO' means 'professional' rather than 'fashionable' or 'trending now' or whatever. But this is the classic bedroom producer notion of what 'professional' is; the 'lol ProTools aint Pro cuz noone I know uses it' fallacy; assuming that the wider world has to reflect one's own experience or preference.

Yeah, there are more advanced tools. But 'more advanced' isn't the sole driving force in what tools people choose, especially professionals.

[c_voltage]

Many words that i can't understand.

[egbert]

Many words that i can't understand.

You don't know how lucky you are.

[Halonmusic]

YES!!!

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Frankly, I asked others to comment on "aliasing" with soundtoys plugs and got NOTHING.

Again, for those bitching about this, can someone please respond with real world examples? Otherwise, shut up:

Be bold or be quiet. I (and others) don't know what to think w/o examples

I suggest you test this on your own. Run a sine sweep through the Soundtoys plugins. When the frequency gets really high, do you hear some inharmonic foldover tones? If yes, that's aliasing. Or load up Plugin Doctor, set the single harmonic test to produce a high frequency tone, like 17.5khz. Do you see any frequency spikes below 17.5k? That is aliasing.

I've done the tests. Others have too. I didn't save the results just in case a few years later Reggie might ask about them. But you obviously won't take other people's word for it anyway, so do the tests yourself. The aliasing absolutely exists.

That doesn't make the plugs terrible. That doesn't make them "not pro." Just means they'll introduce some low level noise when fed high frequencies in some scenarios. Depending on the source audio (like a low passed bass) and processing (maybe there's some high frequency content but you're not generating a lot of harmonic distortion in the plug-in) you may not ever hear it. But there's definitely aliasing produced in those plugins. That part is not up for debate. Test yourself.

[reggie1979]

Yeah, I was a little too snarky but that is a good idea.

[Hink]

If you want a serve of tape distortion with your delay then you probably don't need a side dish of aliasing with it.

Aliasing is garbage that you don't need. What's so difficult to understand about that?

do you notice thatr a post of your was deleted? Before you question someone else's understanding about things why cant you understand there is no place for attacks like that here?

Rhetorical question, best advice is you think twice before you post anything besides the words I apologize

[SparkySpark]

Artificial Intelligence, Machine Learning, Cloud, real time SPICE based analogue modeling! It's the shit. No plugin is complete without it!

[SparkySpark]

„I was wondering what other users would like to see?“

A bundle price of 100$ for new customers.

Actually the academic price is now just 149 (instead of 249). I thought it was compelling, but after having read this thread, I don't know...
https://www.soundtoys.com/product/academic-bundle/

[c_voltage]

Many words that i can't understand.

You don't know how lucky you are.

[yehboy1]

Is there any rule that says we can't start talking about Soundtoys 7 until Soundtoys 6 is out?

If not, I'd like to begin the discussion.

[Demuvi]

A more realistic price.

[jens]

@ jens
My comment isn't that "Decapitator really sucks" - it might be fine for most use cases although its clearly better at 96 kHz. I actually went looking online for evidence that showed that it used over-sampling - my reasoning being that a distortion plugin would be the most likely to use it (see my link a few posts back in this thread to Erik Klein (Digital Igloo) from Line-6 on the need for fairly extreme oversampling (ie 16x) for acceptable modelling of guitar amp distortion and, I assume guitar pedal distortion which the Helix platform does rather well).

Anyway, my search came up with that page I linked to which showed that actually there is simple foldover aliasing in Decapitator at 44.1 kHz. I am treating that test as being diagnostic of a lack of oversampling.

In case this is all greek to anyone - distortion by definition is harmonically related - so distortion of a 10 kHz signal will include peaks at 20, 30, 40kHz and so on. The 30 and 40 kHz peaks will foldover back into the audio band once they cross the Nyquist limit = (sampling rate)/2. So you will get a aliasing peak at ~14 kHz (22kHz - 8kHz). This peak is not harmonically related - it is noise - hence aliasing noise. Oversampling changes all this because instead of the Nyquist limit being just above the audio band at 22.05 kHz it could be way up at 384 kHz (16x OS starting from 48 kHz).

This is getting somewhat irritating. Again you are replying to me without actually replying to me.
I never claimed that you wrote "Decapitator sucks" or something along those lines. I didn't address you at all, except stating the fact that you had been quoting me without your post containing anything that could be considered an actual reply to what you quoted. And in reply to that again you write something that is not a response to me at all but nonetheless you explicitly address me. That's just weird.

[jens]

EDIT: Oh, and what is the metric? Current state of the art, of course. Please don't tell me that science is subjective.

Unquantified moving goalposts arent metric.

Meanwhile, plenty of professionals use SoundToys plugins and their longstanding peers like Waves etc; maybe the 'chase the new shiny' cycle is genre specific, but in the wider worlds of recording and post, any set of interviews with producers etc will see those plugins mentioned far more than the constantly shifting flavour of the month 'state of the art'. And the state of the art is constantly volatile, so you're basically saying nothing stays good enough.

Now Im assuming 'PRO' means 'professional' rather than 'fashionable' or 'trending now' or whatever. But this is the classic bedroom producer notion of what 'professional' is; the 'lol ProTools aint Pro cuz noone I know uses it' fallacy; assuming that the wider world has to reflect one's own experience or preference.

Yeah, there are more advanced tools. But 'more advanced' isn't the sole driving force in what tools people choose, especially professionals.

Quoted for truth.

[jens]

„I was wondering what other users would like to see?“

A bundle price of 100$ for new customers.

Actually the academic price is now just 149 (instead of 249). I thought it was compelling, but after having read this thread, I don't know...
https://www.soundtoys.com/product/academic-bundle/

149$ for the lot is a total bargain - even if you will end up finding some of them a lot more useful than others.