What's Due is Due | Alt-rock (Jack White w/ Noel G on lead?)

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wagtunes wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:55 am Quirky. I like it. Well done. Nothing to nit pick about on this end.
Thanks wags!
enroe wrote: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:12 pm The vocals in the chorus part could stand out a little more. But only a little. The last guitar-driven part and the ending is perfect. Good work, nice song! :tu:
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am I think it would make a lot of difference if you tried to be a bit more tight with both the rhythm and pitch of the chorus. It doesn't have to be spot-on (There need some slight differences for the doubling to have effect). However, when both the vocals are falling shy of hitting the target notes, and in their own ways; and the delivery is also a bit lax rhythmically, it feels a bit of a shambles. It's not critical, but it does detract from the potential power of the chorus, which could really do with providing more of a solid punch as a contrast to the verse.
At some point before the end of the year, I'm going to have to tidy up a bunch of tracks as I tend to give my family a CD for Xmas. I'll take a look at the chorus and see if I can fix up the timing and stuff. It's been a while since I've done anything on the project, but I tend to record a lot of takes for the vox, so chances are I can fix some of the worst bits without too much issue. This track never got a proper clean up in that regard.

I tend to just pick the two takes I think were the best when I was performing and leave it at that while I'm in the process of arranging and recording. I find the whole editing process tends to get in the way of being creative (plus I'm lazy and don't really enjoy that side of things). Moving vocal takes 2 ms forwards and cutting them up and automating the volume ain't my idea of a good time :|

I'm aware that these things can put the icing on the cake so to speak, so I do try and clean things up at some point, but I try and keep it separate from the creative songwriting process. It's more of a technical exercise in patience from my perspective. A bit like proofreading :D
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am I get more of a David Byrne vibe :).
Me too, I don't think I sound like Bowie at all.
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am This one has one of those great 'don't know where the first beat is' intros. Also your quirky, almost-spoken, almost-atonal delivery really suits the verses, but this imo is causing some issues when doubled up in the chorus.
I actually drop a beat IIRC; at any rate, (from memory) the little guitar intro is offset by 1 beat compared to where it is during the actual song.
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am Only other thing to say is that one of the guitars is out of tune :P
Bollocks, any idea which one?
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am Also, listening on SoundCloud, it runs automatically into "Playing For Time". That's a f**king stonker, right there. I'm guessing it will become a song, hence the WIP. If that should happen, please also keep a mixed/mastered instrumental version available. Really love it :tu:
We'll have to see what comes of that. I'm off on holiday for a few weeks, so won't be doing anything for a while.


Thanks again for the feedback all of you.

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sjm wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:25 am If not, I wonder if it's actually happening when encoding on SC; maybe I just need to turn down the master by 1 dB or so.
Soundcloud is lo-fi but I suspect there is an issue with the original mix irrespective of Soundcloud.

One tip to bear in mind, you should only upload high quality uncompressed WAV files to Soundcloud. If you upload a lossy MP3, Soundcloud will convert it again to its format which subjects your audio to two lossy conversions.

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sjm wrote: Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:15 pm
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am I think it would make a lot of difference if you tried to be a bit more tight with both the rhythm and pitch of the chorus. It doesn't have to be spot-on (There need some slight differences for the doubling to have effect). However, when both the vocals are falling shy of hitting the target notes, and in their own ways; and the delivery is also a bit lax rhythmically, it feels a bit of a shambles. It's not critical, but it does detract from the potential power of the chorus, which could really do with providing more of a solid punch as a contrast to the verse.
I tend to just pick the two takes I think were the best when I was performing and leave it at that while I'm in the process of arranging and recording. I find the whole editing process tends to get in the way of being creative (plus I'm lazy and don't really enjoy that side of things). Moving vocal takes 2 ms forwards and cutting them up and automating the volume ain't my idea of a good time :|
It's not really something that I would see as an editing job.
Like I said, my issue is not that there isn't some kind of imperfection, but that trying to match two imperfect takes compounds any issues. If I were behind the desk, I'd get you to try and really commit to the primary vocal being tighter in both pitch and timing. And with one vocal setting a more solid foundation, the doubled vocal could definitely be looser without loosing the coherence of the section.
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:42 am Only other thing to say is that one of the guitars is out of tune :P
sjm wrote: Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:15 pmBollocks, any idea which one?
Well, f'sure when the main rhythm guitar come in. But I can also hear it in the opening lead line. And I can hear similar issues in 'Playing For Time". Seems to be enough of a consistent occurrence to maybe be actual tuning instability/intonation problems on the actual guitar. Hard to know without hearing it in isolation :shrug:

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One of the guitars is out of tune ... cant tell which one.

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thecontrolcentre wrote: Sun Nov 03, 2019 1:48 pm One of the guitars is out of tune ... cant tell which one.
The rhythm guitar definitely is. You can hear it when it's strummed without the lead hitting at the same time. Whether the lead is out of tune is harder to tell, but it seems like it to me :shrug:

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Maybe they're both out ... @OP did you check your tuning before recording? TBH I cant understand how you didn't notice.

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Enjoyable song with pleasant rhythm. Sounds nice.

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I didn't realise this had been bumped. I'll take a look at the guitar at some point in more detail, but from what I can tell (and as I discussed with el-bo elsewhere), the rhythm is a bit wonky in the tuning because of the way I was playing the guitar.


Thank markkuja for the nice comment.

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