LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
rj0
KVRist
336 posts since 18 Sep, 2010

Post Thu Jan 09, 2020 12:58 pm

Getting quite interesting.

So the Morph control modifies how the wavetable positions are interpolated/cross-faded (step-wise, not other kinds of real-time processing)?

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vastdynamics
KVRist
120 posts since 5 Jan, 2015 from Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:12 pm

rj0 wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 12:58 pm
Getting quite interesting.

So the Morph control modifies how the wavetable positions are interpolated/cross-faded (step-wise, not other kinds of real-time processing)?
Yes, the morph parameter controls the smoothing of the wavetable position parameter. For resynthesized tables out of samples you do not want smoothing, for e.g. hardsync it might be better. And yes, the plugin does not have what other synths call real-time wavetable effects. I experimented a lot with that but believe there is no way to do it while keeping the “zero nyquist-alias” promise - even when oversampling the oscillators 8 times or so you will still have it (maybe not audible).
____________
Best regards,
Tobias
http://www.vast-dynamics.de

buzz1
KVRist
51 posts since 23 Mar, 2019

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:14 pm

vastdynamics wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:12 pm
rj0 wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 12:58 pm
Getting quite interesting.

So the Morph control modifies how the wavetable positions are interpolated/cross-faded (step-wise, not other kinds of real-time processing)?
Yes, the morph parameter controls the smoothing of the wavetable position parameter. For resynthesized tables out of samples you do not want smoothing, for e.g. hardsync it might be better. And yes, the plugin does not have what other synths call real-time wavetable effects. I experimented a lot with that but believe there is no way to do it while keeping the “zero nyquist-alias” promise - even when oversampling the oscillators 8 times or so you will still have it (maybe not audible).
One of the great attractions of many wavetable synths is the real-time effects capability.
To omit them for a non audible benefit seems very strange to me.

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vastdynamics
KVRist
120 posts since 5 Jan, 2015 from Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:50 pm

Maybe. The plugin is not designed for that so it is unlikely that I will add it later. On the other hand, I am still looking for a good example of such a „real-time“ effect that can not be realized with „static“ wavetable functions. I think I used most of the synths and have not found something so far. I agree that it is a different workflow and might be more intuitive. But technically you can achieve the same. And as said, most wavetable synths create aliasing sounds with that - and some artifacts ARE audible and its my ambition for musical instruments to avoid that.

buzz1
KVRist
51 posts since 23 Mar, 2019

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:22 am

Nobody cares whether a synth technically aliases or not, as long as they get great sound. Look at Massive x. There has been a great deal of debate as to whether it aliases or not, but in the end, for all its other shortcomings people really like the sound. And the various modes DO increase its versatility enormously. Also when you start introducing noise, distortion, bit reduction, etc- all of which are integral parts of much sound design these days, zero aliasing becomes even less relevant.

rj0
KVRist
336 posts since 18 Sep, 2010

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:28 pm

Perhaps a mode or setting, to retain or not, zero aliasing mode (with associated limitations, user option)?

WasteLand
KVRist
442 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:01 am

vastdynamics wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:50 pm
Maybe. The plugin is not designed for that so it is unlikely that I will add it later. On the other hand, I am still looking for a good example of such a „real-time“ effect that can not be realized with „static“ wavetable functions. I think I used most of the synths and have not found something so far. I agree that it is a different workflow and might be more intuitive. But technically you can achieve the same. And as said, most wavetable synths create aliasing sounds with that - and some artifacts ARE audible and its my ambition for musical instruments to avoid that.
i am on the fence on this one. the difference i get, but a real-time effect, you can modulate, you how that be realized within a "static" wavetable?

i get the design decision, and i have no problem with another approach, every other approach seems to me only a good thing, but in this case i wonder. the filters use oversampling. for instance.

but forget the technique behind it, how i can achieve a modulated effect in a "static" wavetable? perhaps i didn't found it yet.

alias free as the holy grail, yes i get it. and i try to avoid also, but if it present it isn't audible, or it works... i make strange sounds... i do not anaylyse every sound, if there is aliasing. there could be, when making samples, resampling them with different effects (time stretch! does wonders! make a synth out of a guitar..), resampling it within a DAW. or use the sampler that eventually plays the sample(s) for more sounddesign, different, many time simple ways, that sound a lot or how the sound works while playing the sound.

this off topic or not? because i would like to buy vaporizer2, yes! yes! to work with my own samples. i wavetable synths, but i do not make my own wavetables yet...

as a wavetable editor it is great, by the way. and it creates already sounds i like.

you must see every instrument as is. pigments ain't serum (i demoed serum for the first time, to see what all the fuzz is about, and yes it is a beast, but don't need it. has great possibilities, but MSoundFactory is closing in...), and i like what pigments does, it works well for my music.

perhaps i am too picky, if it has the serum options (yes there are tempting, but i have other solutions), i will demo it further, as is.

but modulating parameters, how can that be achieved? in not-real-time.

EDIT: i am not new to making music, but i am still learning, and every step you make, you realize that you didn't understand some things, that you now understand. and new questions arise.
a learned a lot from soft modulars. and other synths, i feel like now i am getting additive, spectral. substractive is easy (as technique, but recquires also experience, to get what you want, in the end perhaps at the same level..). and i thought i knew it, already. no, still learning. that's the way it is way when you dive in deeper and deeper.
win 10 pro (1909); cubase 10.5.10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

WasteLand
KVRist
442 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:24 am

there is a new update, 2.6.2..

i bought the vaporizer2, after many discussions with myself, no regrets. thought about serum, but i have MSoundFactory, that is enough, and synthmaster 3 is coming (for years i think...). it gets me deeper in making wavetables, is a craft on itself. if i don't get beatiful wavetables, i have learned a lot..

https://www.vast-dynamics.com/?q=products

EDIT: importing wavetables frome waveedit, does not work that well, of course.. but i understand that making great wavetables, recquires not one program, but more. the sculpt, to make a wavetable, that sounds good when morphing or scanning through it.
and now i have enough wavetable "generators" and manglers.. for now..

EDIT 2: release notes:

New version available for free download: 2.6.2 - change log:
► Added two new random drift automation sources
► Larger performance improvements in wavetable engine
► Corrected bitcrush FX and sampler cents / root key automation issues
► Reworked factory presets and additional factory presets now including 365 quality presets
► Added additional wavetables and single cycles now including 780 wavetables.
win 10 pro (1909); cubase 10.5.10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

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Halonmusic
KVRAF
3309 posts since 13 Nov, 2015 from Norway

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:18 pm

This is one fine synth :tu:
Don't be a Sheep. :borg: | Opinions matters :evil:

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vastdynamics
KVRist
120 posts since 5 Jan, 2015 from Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:01 pm

Thank you guys. :love: :party: :phones: :hyper:

GRUMP
KVRist
179 posts since 11 Jun, 2019 from Darmstadt, Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:47 am

Hi there,

I have a Question:

in the Sample Editor for WT Creation you can see the Number of Zero Crossings and set the Number for the Wavetable. Great Function indeed - but the resulting Tables don´t correspond the Number of Zero Crossings I have set before. If I say 100 for Example I get a WT with maybe 86 Positions and that gets out of Phase (and 0 Crossings) at the End.?

Addition: "Interpolation" for WT-Positions Selection fixes Problems others leave unsolved and delivers good Results. Very pleased :)
Sound Design - VOX, Airy, Choir

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vastdynamics
KVRist
120 posts since 5 Jan, 2015 from Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 30, 2020 4:51 am

Image
New version available for free download: 2.6.3 - change log:
► Significantly improved MSEG envelopes
– Can now be synchronized with DAW timecode – also for loops
– Option to run MSEG in single mode (not per voice but one global instance)
– Improved MSEG display.
► Added two new random drift automation sources
► Larger performance improvements in wavetable engine
► Reworked factory presets and additional factory presets now including 370 quality presets
► UI improvements (slider value popup)
► Added additional wavetables and single cycles now including 780 wavetables.
Find it here: https://www.vast-dynamics.com/?q=products
https://www.facebook.com/vastdynamics/

WasteLand
KVRist
442 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 30, 2020 5:14 am

vastdynamics wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 4:51 am
Image
New version available for free download: 2.6.3 - change log:
► Significantly improved MSEG envelopes
– Can now be synchronized with DAW timecode – also for loops
– Option to run MSEG in single mode (not per voice but one global instance)
– Improved MSEG display.
► Added two new random drift automation sources
► Larger performance improvements in wavetable engine
► Reworked factory presets and additional factory presets now including 370 quality presets
► UI improvements (slider value popup)
► Added additional wavetables and single cycles now including 780 wavetables.
Find it here: https://www.vast-dynamics.com/?q=products
https://www.facebook.com/vastdynamics/
so the MSEG can be used as multi-breakpoint envelopes.. and synced, because it defeats most of the time purpose, for me, of an MSEG, great. and of course a free running loop is nice..
downloading now...

o yes: the standalone version has no icon... not a great problem of course, but...
and avast always wants to scan the installer, and the first time you run the standalone.. but me thinks that is an avast problem.
win 10 pro (1909); cubase 10.5.10 pro, live 10 suite (+push 2), reaper, arturia V collection 6, reason 10, maschine (mk3+jam), korg collection, komplete 11 ultimate, softube modular, VM and many more..
https://soundcloud.com/sada-exposada

User avatar
vastdynamics
KVRist
120 posts since 5 Jan, 2015 from Germany

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 30, 2020 5:24 am

Ah icon - OK will look at it.
A bit off-topic, but isn't Avast the anti virus software that sells you privacy to companies?
https://bgr.com/2020/01/28/avast-sellin ... y-scandal/
I would rather uninstall that.

carlosigls
KVRist
62 posts since 9 Nov, 2012

Re: LAUNCH! VAST Dynamics - Vaporizer2 - Hybrid Wavetable Additive / Subtractive Synthesizer / Sampler / Workstation

Post Thu Jan 30, 2020 5:28 am

Avast is the worst unlike Vast Dynamics which is the best. ;)

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