more people need to try renoise

[howtobecalm79]

I do everything in Renoise,midi recording,vocal recording you name it.The thing with Renoise is when you open it for the first time it looks like a spaceship and has its own learning curve as all new things do but once you get into it you will be amazed how fast you can lay down your ideas and how inspiring it is.Join me in the Renoise forum there are people there who can help you with everything.

im with u bro i dumped reason for renoise

[gentleclockdivider]

You can still control and sequence all reason's instruments from renoise >
-Route reason instruments to reasons HW output ( ommit the mixer )
-Create a new instrument in renoise and select the the reson device from renoise midi out tabe
-Create for each reason device a rewire dsp istance in renoise and select reason HW output buss from the rewire drop down ( now each reason instrument will be routed to that instance )
-Select renoise midi cc control and select the isntrument (parameters are automatically mapped and assigned )
Everything can now be sequenced / automated/mixed from within renoise

Bloody idiot move from propellerheads they sacked rewire in reason 11

[antic604]

Well, maybe they don't??

[JO512]

I've been playing with Renoise because of this thread. It is intriguing, but strange to me. Hexadecimal? Really? Why not write the software to allow the entry of a percentage that gets converted behind the scenes to the nearest hex value? Or why not just 0-127? I have to think of a percentage and then translate that to hex mentally or with a calculator. That gets in my way and interrupts my creative flow big time. I suppose hex would become intuitive at some point.

After playing with it for a bit though, it is obvious that there is much I can do with Reaper very intuitively that I don't have a clue how to do in Renoise. Creating a feedback loop with effects in it and playing that as an instrument is one example.

And having to delay notes to get them out of exact evenly divided quantization? That's clunky!

Playing with Renoise and realizing that something like it has been used to make some of the electronic music I find mostly unlistenable is enlightening. I can see why much of that music sounds so stilted, non-organic, and square! I have never really been a big fan of music primarily composed of single samples anyway. The same exact sound over and over hurts my ears!

Renoise advocates often claim that you can do things with samples that you can't do in a regular DAW. I am not seeing that. Speedwise, maybe it has an edge, I don't know. You can get pretty fast in Reaper with practice, and the possibilities with actions and keyboard shortcuts for those actions are endless. And like Renoise, you can write custom scripts if you are inclined that way.

I can do anything imaginable with samples in Reaper. And I can see the waveform, so I can more intuitively slice it up, drag the content around, stretch, bend pitch in it, fade it, change its volume, pan, and so on. I can see the transients! That's important! And I am much more free from the grid if I want to be. I can make all the glitchy patterns I want, and at very high resolutions if I want with zero hassle. And I can automate effects like crazy. I can quickly draw automation! Automation items give a lot of power. I can create little automation phrases that I can duplicate, split, loop, glue, reverse, invert, and so on.

When it comes to editing velocities and other CC values in Reaper, I can draw with the mouse! If I need a sweep of velocity values, it's very intuitive to draw them in the CC lane with a single mouse swipe.

As far as I can tell, I can get just as intricate in Reaper, perhaps moreso because I don't have to worry about a master resolution. And I can put in triplets, dotted, swing, and that sort of thing, very easily. I don't have to put in delays, set up phrasing, or any of that to get quantized odd note timings.


To me, a piano roll is much more intuitive. You can actually see both the pitch and time dimensions in the music at a glance. And time represented left-to-right is far more intuitive, as that's how it is represented most everywhere, at least in the West. A series of notes ascending with time can be seen obviously to do that, at a glance. We naturally think of increase or ascent as rising to the right. With Renoise, you have read the individual values to see what pitches you have. And in a piano roll, you don't have the note-off weirdness. You just have a note with a duration and you can see that at a glance. You don't have to look for the note-off instruction. In Renoise, you have to deliberately put in the note-off. Note lengths don't read at a glance like in a piano roll.

In Reaper, I can look at the tracks and largely see what's happening. Just glancing at things in Renoise, it isn't obvious at all what it might sound like.

I really don't think this tracker stuff is for me! I am still intrigued though. I'll play a little more! Maybe the light will come on! So far, it mostly feels like stepping back into the DOS days of my childhood, which does have a little nostalgic value.

Renoise seems like it would appeal strongly to people who like the Linux terminal, ASCII art, and coding in assembly. I am much more of visual person!


What am I missing? Is there something that can be done with Renoise that really can't be done with a DAW like Reaper?

[cron]

I've been playing with Renoise because of this thread. It is intriguing, but strange to me. Hexadecimal? Really? Why not write the software to allow the entry of a percentage that gets converted behind the scenes to the nearest hex value? Or why not just 0-127? I have to think of a percentage and then translate that to hex mentally or with a calculator. That gets in my way and interrupts my creative flow big time. I suppose hex would become intuitive at some point.

After playing with it for a bit though, it is obvious that there is much I can do with Reaper very intuitively that I don't have a clue how to do in Renoise. Creating a feedback loop with effects in it and playing that as an instrument is one example.

And having to delay notes to get them out of exact evenly divided quantization? That's clunky!

Playing with Renoise and realizing that something like it has been used to make some of the electronic music I find mostly unlistenable is enlightening. I can see why much of that music sounds so stilted, non-organic, and square! I have never really been a big fan of music primarily composed of single samples anyway. The same exact sound over and over hurts my ears!

Renoise advocates often claim that you can do things with samples that you can't do in a regular DAW. I am not seeing that. Speedwise, maybe it has an edge, I don't know. You can get pretty fast in Reaper with practice, and the possibilities with actions and keyboard shortcuts for those actions are endless. And like Renoise, you can write custom scripts if you are inclined that way.

I can do anything imaginable with samples in Reaper. And I can see the waveform, so I can more intuitively slice it up, drag the content around, stretch, bend pitch in it, fade it, change its volume, pan, and so on. I can see the transients! That's important! And I am much more free from the grid if I want to be. I can make all the glitchy patterns I want, and at very high resolutions if I want with zero hassle. And I can automate effects like crazy. I can quickly draw automation! Automation items give a lot of power. I can create little automation phrases that I can duplicate, split, loop, glue, reverse, invert, and so on.

When it comes to editing velocities and other CC values in Reaper, I can draw with the mouse! If I need a sweep of velocity values, it's very intuitive to draw them in the CC lane with a single mouse swipe.

As far as I can tell, I can get just as intricate in Reaper, perhaps moreso because I don't have to worry about a master resolution. And I can put in triplets, dotted, swing, and that sort of thing, very easily. I don't have to put in delays, set up phrasing, or any of that to get quantized odd note timings.


To me, a piano roll is much more intuitive. You can actually see both the pitch and time dimensions in the music at a glance. And time represented left-to-right is far more intuitive, as that's how it is represented most everywhere, at least in the West. A series of notes ascending with time can be seen obviously to do that, at a glance. We naturally think of increase or ascent as rising to the right. With Renoise, you have read the individual values to see what pitches you have. And in a piano roll, you don't have the note-off weirdness. You just have a note with a duration and you can see that at a glance. You don't have to look for the note-off instruction. In Renoise, you have to deliberately put in the note-off. Note lengths don't read at a glance like in a piano roll.

In Reaper, I can look at the tracks and largely see what's happening. Just glancing at things in Renoise, it isn't obvious at all what it might sound like.

I really don't think this tracker stuff is for me! I am still intrigued though. I'll play a little more! Maybe the light will come on! So far, it mostly feels like stepping back into the DOS days of my childhood, which does have a little nostalgic value.

Renoise seems like it would appeal strongly to people who like the Linux terminal, ASCII art, and coding in assembly. I am much more of visual person!


What am I missing? Is there something that can be done with Renoise that really can't be done with a DAW like Reaper?

Impressed with the time you've put in there! 2 quick comments/answers:

Re hexadecimal: I remember writing a super-long justification of hex on KVR around 15 years back and receiving a pithy "but it's just to save space on low res screens" in response, but I stand by it being the most straightforward system in terms of mapping numbers to a 4/4 time signature.

Say you wanted to do a fade over four beats - I've got no idea how that would look in decimal, but in hex it's 00, 10, 20, 30, 40... D0, E0, F0 on each step. When chopping up breakbeats, the base 16 nature of hex is even more handy. If you load a one-bar loop into the sampler and start using commands to jump the playback pointer around, each beat maps to 00, 40, 80, and C0. Your sixteenth notes map to 00, 10, 20, 30... D0, E0, F0, and finer divisions are equally trivial. Hex is just super elegant when you're making music in 4/4 because all the 'time units' you might want to work with divide into it very cleanly. Which brings me to...

Chopping up breakbeats. I really can't speak for the quality of Renoise as a fully fledged DAW, because I was using trackers back in the age when they were essentially just multitrack samplers with an interface, but my word they are simply unparalleled for complex rhythmic sampling work. The number of effects you can pull off without touching the mouse, loading a plugin, or even looking at a waveform is just ridiculous. I'm sure more is possible now, but I used to do effects like reversing/ping-ponging arbitrary sections, rudimentary pitchshifting and timestretching, gnarly FM and AM... all on arbitrary sections of the sample and entirely within the sequencer. The speed and fluency with which you can slither around inside a sample (even back in the 90s) has never been bettered.

I don't really use trackers any more here, but it's really nice to see that people who've never used them before are still giving them a look. Hope the above clears a few of your questions up

[xbitz]

but why Renoise, Redux can be used in any DAWs

if u need a phrase-based sampler

[gentleclockdivider]

THe advantage of hex is that you can type 3 digit number with 2 characters , 255 would be ff in hex .
Also if you type the number 80 ( which is the half of FF ) , you'll know that you're halfway the sample ., so a sample can be easily divided by 16 ( usefull in elec. music ) 0,10,20,30,40,50,60,70,80,90,A,B,C.D,E,F ...where each value represents that part in time of the sample
It really becomes a second nature .
Yes there is a lot you can do in a tracker that you can not do in regular daw , it's all about the effects commands , or better it would take a hell of a lot of time to achieve the same thing in a regular daw ( if possible ) .
For example you want to re-trigger a note multiple times , in a regular daw you have to use the pencil tool and adjust it's resolution , and maybe adjust it again for faster triggeres .
In a tracker you just type in a letter ( which specifies the effect ) followed by a number ( the number of repeats ) .
When you're just starting out this might take some while but after a brief period this becomes so easy and fast , there are also a lot of helpful shortcuts like continious paste etc..
If you want to repeat an effect , you don't need to re-type the value etc...lot's of small things that make life easier , combined with a a quality mechanical keyboard ( ducky one or filco ) you're set to go
I can understand why to some people it makes more sense that time is represented on a x-axis , I guess that is becasue we are so used to seeing waveforms where y= amplitude , and x= time .
But we're not talking about waveforms here , we're talking about numbers that represents notes , imho those are 2 diff. things

Renoise rules

[Whywhy]

A noob question for Redux :
Can we apply dsp effects commands into Redux ( like we can in Renoise ) ?
I'm demoing Redux but can find a way...

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

but why Renoise, Redux can be used in any DAWs

if u need a phrase-based sampler

It definitely seems to be a good approach for people wanting the many of the benefits of a tracker, within a familiar workflow/environment. However, one of the advantages of using different DAW is that it allows one to get into a completely different work/head-space, and to avoid falling into similar patterns.

[xbitz]

A noob question for Redux :
Can we apply dsp effects commands into Redux ( like we can in Renoise ) ?
I'm demoing Redux but can find a way...

Anakin:
Is it possible to learn this power?

Palpatine:
Not from a Jedi.


(check the desc under the video)

https://forum.renoise.com/t/no-way-to-m ... rs/46921/8

[Whywhy]

Thanks xbitz for the link.
Audio input is great but it's not what I would like to do, it's more simple:
In Renoise, you can easily apply in reel time a dsp and it appears into the tracker menu : fx command. We can change a dsp fx value, like, eg, a chorus feedback parameter or a dry/wet at every tick for a track.
I try it into redux, apply a dsp to a track but I don't see the dsp fx command...

[JO512]

Re hexadecimal: ... I stand by it being the most straightforward system in terms of mapping numbers to a 4/4 time signature.

Interesting. I hadn't thought of that. However, it occurs to me that in a DAW like reaper, I can set a fade on CC values or automation with a single mouse swipe, and I can get all sorts of fade shapes, not just an even division of the interval. I could draw a line in the CC lane to fade something like velocities on a thousand notes with just a couple of clicks. I don't even have to think about the math, such as whether I have an even number of notes over which to fade.

As for chopping up breakbeats, there are a number of methods in Reaper that could be used to achieve a similar result with even more flexibility. Personally, I'd just use Falcon or Kontakt, and set different parts to be triggered with different notes on the piano roll, maybe even setting up some velocity layers. In the absence of Falcon or Kontakt, I'd just use Reasamplomatic. Very easy. You can also just arrange instances of the sample itself with different starting and end points and fades. Reaper has tool to automatically chop it up too: "dynamic split items". Not problematic at all! And you can do all sorts of pitch-shifting and whatnot on these instances if you like. You can even draw a pitch-shift envelop on each one if you want.

Personally though, I'd never chop up a breakbeat like that. I am not a fan of having the same exact sound over and over for a kick or snare or whatever. I'd rather trigger a synth or a rich sample library with some expressive possibilities so I can vary and control it more.

...they are simply unparalleled for complex rhythmic sampling work. The number of effects you can pull off without touching the mouse, loading a plugin, or even looking at a waveform is just ridiculous. I'm sure more is possible now, but I used to do effects like reversing/ping-ponging arbitrary sections, rudimentary pitchshifting and timestretching, gnarly FM and AM... all on arbitrary sections of the sample and entirely within the sequencer. The speed and fluency with which you can slither around inside a sample (even back in the 90s) has never been bettered.

I wonder if it is really true that Renoise can do more in this regard than something like Reaper. Personally, I don't do a lot of sample work, but playing with it a little, I see lots of powerful possibilities. And so far, I haven't seen anything in Renoise that can't be done in Reaper in a different way, and not necessarily in a slower way. Given practice and skill in each application, all these things can be achieved in both with speed.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughts and observations!

[gentleclockdivider]

It's not possible in redux

[gentleclockdivider]

@JO512 , that's because you don't know it that well .
Can you timestretch a sample( using the sample offset command +interpolate ) to whatever length you want and re=trigger/ reverse certain parts of the sample without cutting and pasting the audio ?

You know how a sample is played back right , it's data in a lookup table and a pointer reads through that table
A tracker gives you precise control of that pointer + a lot more

[JO512]

Can you timestretch a sample( using the sample offset command +interpolate ) to whatever length you want and re=trigger/ reverse certain parts of the sample without cutting and pasting the audio ?

I can timestretch it, reverse it, change the starting point and so on, even snap transients to the grid, and so on. But cutting and pasting is indeed part of the process unless you use some sort of sampler plugin, and there are many options there. I don't see cutting and pasting as a big problem though. For one thing, I can set fades and crossfades visually, visually drag clips independent of the grid if desired, and so on. That visual thing is helpful. You can see how the transient and tail sits with respect to the grid.

But if I want more control of a sample, I'll just set up a Reaktor Blocks patch. There, I can even use a multi-breakpoint envelope or any imaginable modulation source to modulate the position of the playhead, and all sorts of other crazy things. And I can modulate the envelope rate, automate selection of different envelope presets, and so on. With Reaktor, your imagination is the only limit! It does take a little time to think about and set up a patch though. But you could create one you use commonly and save it.

Obviously, Reaper plus a bunch of plugins like Reaktor and the good blocks packs are more costly than Renoise. But I already have these.

I don't doubt that Renoise is great for many. For me though, given what I already have and like, it doesn't make any sense.