KVR Audio

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:19 pm

Ironical I sold my Live as it was a bit too much like working on a computer/PC- I got a Deluge instead, something a bit more left field and it had CV. If MPC workflow away from Computer is what you want (portability etc) then the Live simply cant be beat, but as I am in front of the computer most of the time I find myself using Maschine for this type of beat creation...

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:46 pm

SLiC wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:19 pm Ironical I sold my Live as it was a bit too much like working on a computer/PC- I got a Deluge instead, something a bit more left field and it had CV. If MPC workflow away from Computer is what you want (portability etc) then the Live simply cant be beat, but as I am in front of the computer most of the time I find myself using Maschine for this type of beat creation...

I actually considered a Deluge for a while, but ultimately the MPC Live fit my needs more. While both are truly portable with built-in batteries, I really liked the MPC's OS approach with touchscreen.

Assorted musings: many complain the MPC Live/X/One only has 2 GB of RAM (with slightly less being available to sampling), but the Deluge only comes with 64 MB (though you can stream from the SD Cards, which is awesome)! What Synthstrom Audible accomplished with Deluge is pretty incredible.

deastman · Post by **deastman** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:00 pm

All I really wanted was something which allowed me to quickly sample, chop, and sequence with good visual feedback. I’m still not totally in love with the MPC UX/UI, which is a bit of an inconsistent mess, but it does accomplish what I wanted out of it. I have other ways of sequencing CV/Gate, and I’ll probably remain content with my MK1. For any serious songwriting, I’ll still turn back to the laptop.

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:32 pm

EnochLight wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:46 pm
SLiC wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:19 pm Ironical I sold my Live as it was a bit too much like working on a computer/PC- I got a Deluge instead, something a bit more left field and it had CV. If MPC workflow away from Computer is what you want (portability etc) then the Live simply cant be beat, but as I am in front of the computer most of the time I find myself using Maschine for this type of beat creation...
I actually considered a Deluge for a while, but ultimately the MPC Live fit my needs more. While both are truly portable with built-in batteries, I really liked the MPC's OS approach with touchscreen.

Assorted musings: many complain the MPC Live/X/One only has 2 GB of RAM (with slightly less being available to sampling), but the Deluge only comes with 64 MB (though you can stream from the SD Cards, which is awesome)! What Synthstrom Audible accomplished with Deluge is pretty incredible.

Genuinely they are both superb, both are updated regularly with amazing new stuff getting added for free. (Deluge just got Audio clips and Live looping for example). Cant go wrong with either, like you say, its just a workflow preference....CV was an influence for me with the Deluge, but now that's gone as well (and who know what else has been added to the MK2 - probably more sample RAM

)

telecode · Post by **telecode** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:22 pm

the Deluge looks cool. I never head of it before. Though it seems like it might be targeted at a specific type of mostly electronic based music. I don't know.

I'll pickup a MPC Live 2 when it hits if its anygood. I usually keep my gadgets a long time. My Mikro 1 lasted me almost 10 years. Only recently upgraded to a MK3. Its not bad. More features.

We shall see what comes of all of it.

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:29 pm

I still think it's such a shame how basic the sample synthesis parameters in the MPC ecosystem are. The MPC is definitely not at all a replacement for Maschine, which is a LOT more capable in how you process things (the only benefit is that it can run standalone, but is that really such a big benefit?)

For instance, almost all the modulation sources are unidirectional. There is literally no way of applying the filter envelope in the opposite direction. There is literally no way of getting a proper ping/pong panning with an LFO (it always goes unidirectionally from 0 to 127, so left to right). Same for all keyboard scaling modulations etc.

.. oh and still to this day there is no easy way to change the polarity of a mixer tack, instrument or sample (not even a flip polarity in the offline sample editing "fx"!!). The ONLY way to get a polarity flip is to load one of the AIR Fx (the enhancer) and bounce a sample through that.

Then there is the weird workflow that isn't at all consistent. In one page you may be able to use certain key combinations to do a common task, while in other pages where you'd assume you can do the same, you can't. The workflow can be easily described as "psychotic".. or simply unpolished.

AKAI as a company is really strange. I've had the feeling for quite some years now that they simply do not have any people there who are truly "hard core" when it comes to music making and deeper synthesis. I suspect it's a bunch of corporate types and a bunch of coders who aren't using their own equipment at all. That's how it all feels..

telecode · Post by **telecode** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:28 am

my impression of the MPC software was that its a little more DAW like than Maschine. The rest of it I think it is a question of getting familiar and used to it. When I first started working with Maschine I was also very confused.

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:50 am

Of course a lot of people will say AKAI invented the MPC and MPC style workflow and that Maschine was Originally just a clone....ultimately all that really matters is which you prefer working with, although if you want stand alone the choice is more limited...in the e d I desired my Maschine Mikro and Surface was portable enough (battery life about the same )

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:56 am

I owned all of them: the MPC Live, MPC X and the Force, and eventually I sold all of them. The last one to go was the Force. There were lots of things I really liked about them. They have enormous potential - but talking for a highly personal perspective - I felt they actually were trying to do too much, and the complexity made it feel like you were working with a computer but in a more restricted way. It's a different breed of MPC and that's a good thing. They are not for me, but I'm happy Akai is dedicated to them.

/C

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:12 am

telecode wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:22 pmthe Deluge looks cool. I never head of it before. Though it seems like it might be targeted at a specific type of mostly electronic based music. I don't know.

This is one of the best & most comprehensive reviews of Deluge - check it out:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... oCUiky9Ljo

Also check Loopop's YT channel - I think he has 2 videos about it: one general and one about synthesis.

Personally, I'm waiting to choose between Live vs. Deluge until the former is released and the latter gets te wavetable update. Although I'm also very tempted with Tracker from Polyend (again, check Loopop's review posted yesterday), as I started music in the 90s with trackers so I'm very familiar with the workflow.

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:36 pm

bmanic wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:29 pm The MPC is definitely not at all a replacement for Maschine, which is a LOT more capable in how you process things (the only benefit is that it can run standalone, but is that really such a big benefit?)

Yes. Yes it is.

Right now, they are two different target demographics. Most people who are shopping for the current MPC lineup are looking to get 100% away from having to be tethered to a computer for music production.

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:43 pm

SLiC wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:32 pm Genuinely they are both superb, both are updated regularly with amazing new stuff getting added for free. (Deluge just got Audio clips and Live looping for example).

antic604 wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:12 am Personally, I'm waiting to choose between Live vs. Deluge until the former is released and the latter gets te wavetable update.

One of the showstopping issues I have with the Deluge is that (to my knowledge) you can't record long linear audio tracks, such as guitar or vocals, or other things you'd want to have in an entire song. And while you're currently limited to 8 audio tracks on the standalone MPC right now, when disc streaming is implemented (a free software update), that might easily be expanded.

If people don't need to actually record proper audio tracks, though, the Deluge is still a great device.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:13 pm

EnochLight wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:43 pmOne of the showstopping issues I have with the Deluge is that (to my knowledge) you can't record long linear audio tracks, such as guitar or vocals, or other things you'd want to have in an entire song.

You sure about that? Audio is streamed from the SD Card and once triggered should play until the end of the sample. I believe putting them in a Kit works:

http://forums.synthstrom.com/discussion ... e-playback

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:31 pm

antic604 wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:13 pm
EnochLight wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:43 pmOne of the showstopping issues I have with the Deluge is that (to my knowledge) you can't record long linear audio tracks, such as guitar or vocals, or other things you'd want to have in an entire song.
You sure about that? Audio is streamed from the SD Card and once triggered should play until the end of the sample. I believe putting them in a Kit works:

http://forums.synthstrom.com/discussion ... e-playback

Yes, I'm sure. That is not the same. It's a nice workaround, but not suited to recording live instruments, vocals, tracking - for the duration of your song, IMHO.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:42 pm

EnochLight wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:31 pm
antic604 wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:13 pm
EnochLight wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:43 pmOne of the showstopping issues I have with the Deluge is that (to my knowledge) you can't record long linear audio tracks, such as guitar or vocals, or other things you'd want to have in an entire song.
You sure about that? Audio is streamed from the SD Card and once triggered should play until the end of the sample. I believe putting them in a Kit works:

http://forums.synthstrom.com/discussion ... e-playback
Yes, I'm sure. That is not the same. It's a nice workaround, but not suited to recording live instruments, vocals, tracking - for the duration of your song, IMHO.

Right, definitely not for recording and even playback would work poorly due to no "MIDI chase"

Akai MPC Live 2: coming soon!